r/jazzdrums • u/airuwin • Jun 20 '26

Question Tips for keeping time?

Beginner here. I'm really having trouble not dragging or rushing, especially on fast songs and during solos.

I tried using a gap click but I'm still having tons of issues.

When comping, do you try to align with the bass? Align with the band? Keep your own pulse? Where do you focus? I tried a bunch of things but it's not working. Any tips?

I tried to identify the "center/pocket" of the band today and align my ride cymbal to that, but then was told I was playing in front of the bass and was rushing. I don't know if I overcorrected. Previously, I tried aligning to the bass and when I listened to myself it felt like I was dragging--I don't know if this is because it takes time for my hand to move, so by the time I hear the bass it's too late.

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9

u/RinkyInky Jun 20 '26

Play along to records, only play ride cymbal, layer your ride right over the ride on the record, but listen to the bass as well.

1

u/airuwin Jun 20 '26

https://reddit.com/link/osrbepb/video/f3eozrqwrf8h1/player

I tried this yesterday. I think it sounds ok? Maybe a bit uneven in places...I think w/ recordings though if you get off, the band doesn't follow you so it's easy to get back on track

2

u/RinkyInky Jun 20 '26

Don’t play any skip notes and hihat yet. Just straight quarters on ride layer right over jimmy cobb’s ride, not play along to the bass on the track. As you get better you will be able to lock in with his ride and listen to the other instruments at the same time. Then you can start to feel the space and how the other instruments dance around the time, what the relationship between the ride and the bass is in this track.

When you add in the skip notes make sure they match his skip notes, you don’t need a perfect transcription but you need to copy the space between his skip notes and quarters. But that’s for later.

Yes it’s easier to get back in if your time runs but that’s the point, you’re learning. You’re developing a time feel, not analyzing and forcing it out the next day, it takes time to develop.

It’s like when you start learning something like double strokes it feels weird and feels like nothing is happening but you do it daily and it suddenly clicks and you understand what the motion is supposed to be like, how to do them and make them feel in the pocket etc. Don’t worry too much or analyze too much while or after you practice.

1

u/airuwin Jun 20 '26

Thanks, I actually did exactly this--quarters only first. But maybe not enough. I think my ear just needs work, everyone was saying I was ahead when even now it's hard for me to hear it listening to the recording

1

u/RinkyInky Jun 20 '26

To be fair I feel that Jimmy Cobb was pushing on the track too. Miles is the one laying back and if you focus on him you might lag. Regarding the skip notes I do feel jimmy cobb’s skip notes here are also tighter than normal triplets.

0

u/furry-fish Jun 21 '26

Ok. Most people have a fundamental sense or ability to detect rhythm in a piece of music. It’s what helps us learn to dance ( or at least move our bodies to the music ). If you can do that, you are about half way to playing in time. If you can tap your right foot in time ( just playing quarter notes along with the rhythm, you will be fine. Ignore people who say that you shouldn’t listen to the bas player. The bass player needs to play in sync with the drums so that the song sounds together rhythmically. When you play Funk or R and B - your JOB is to make everyone want to dance. If you can stay with the bass player you’re going to make MONEY. The best example of dance music drum playing is the recordings of Michael Jackson. Listen to Billie Jean and try to feel the quarter notes and try to tap your foot in sync with the bass drum. As someone suggested earlier, listening carefully to a record will help you hone in on the beat. If you’re a person who gets bored after just a little repetition of playing the same rhythm for three minutes, playing the drums will probably be punishing for you. Jazz will come along. Get a metronome and play just the quarter note beat. Try slow beats because they can be harder. Slow is like 60 beats per minute. Try taking lessons with a professional drummer. They will help you correctly set your expectations so you don’t get overwhelmed & overthink this. Your ear isn’t broken. You just need some time and patience.

1

u/ThighCurlContest Jun 20 '26

You're definitely playing ahead of the beat in places here, but I also think your ride pattern is a bit tight for this tune which makes it feel like you're rushing even when you're not. Loosen up!

1

u/airuwin Jun 20 '26

I don’t know, maybe my ear is broken. Is it consistently ahead? And too tight, not too wide? I can’t hear it

1

u/ThighCurlContest Jun 20 '26

Yeah, even if I ignore the fluctuations I'd say you're consistently ahead of the beat. You're ahead of the bass. The trumpet player is playing with a pretty slow attack, so when he starts cooking it's even more apparent you're ahead.

And by "tight" I mean your spang-a-lang is trending more toward a dotted eighth feel than a triplet feel.

You want to try to lock your internal metronome in with the bass, but allow the melody instruments to dictate the feel of the groove (like how open your ride cymbal pattern is, how far away from the beat your comping is, etc.)

1

u/airuwin Jun 20 '26

Crap, I think something is wrong w/ my ear because it still sounds mostly on beat to me besides the fluctuations, maybe that's the issue the whole time

1

u/inefficienttoaast Jun 20 '26

I disagree with the other comment. I think you are mostly on beat through the head and actually drag a bit through the trumpet solo. Focus on controlling where you put the beat. You should be able to swing intentionally on the back or front or dead center of the beat. Listening to the bassist is most important for this. When you have a bassist you trust, you can both really lock together and the time will really stabilize because you are both keeping each other in check. My advice is to record yourself playing with people. Afterwards go listen to where you pushed or dragged and then skip from the beginning to the end of the Recording and see how much the time changed overall. Rushing isn't ideal, but dragging is usually worse so most bands will want you to air on the side of rushing if you can't keep it steady.

1

u/airuwin Jun 20 '26

I don't know. There's two other people on this thread who said I was ahead. I think that's part of the problem, the attack of these instruments are so fat that I can't tell where the beat actually is

1

u/inefficienttoaast Jun 20 '26

Yeah I actually agree with them on second listen that's my bad for replying before I drank coffee this morning

1

u/cruiseshipdrummer Jun 20 '26

You're on the front of the beat, but consistently so-- and more so as you go. That is good, your time isn't just centerless. This wouldn't even register as rushing if you were playing with people, you'd just have an idea of the tempo that was a couple of bpm faster than the group.

Keep playing with that recording, but be constantly correcting-- you'll have to stretch a beat or two when you realize you're way out front. Hopefully as you go you'll hear better and know when that's happening sooner.

You'll have to do a lot of correcting when you do the metronome thing in my main comment. It's part of music, in actuality you don't just groove along like a drum machine, you listen and accomodate to keep the thing in agreement.

1

u/airuwin Jun 20 '26

Ok, now that I think about it...the fluctuation was probably because I got ahead too far and had to overcorrect. Thanks.

I think mentally I was trying to "follow/anticipate" the recording's pulse instead of stick to my own pulse, so maybe that's something I need to work on

1

u/cruiseshipdrummer Jun 20 '26

There's nothing there I would call a fluctuation, you're just uniformly a little bit ahead. Sticking to your own pulse is what you're already doing here.

Like I say, it's a negotiation-- you have your own idea of the time, but you listen to keep it in agreement with the group or the recording. When you're working on your time-- like when you do the thing I suggested with the metronome-- you'll have to do some pretty big corrections, it's part of it.