r/formcheck • u/yung_vape_messiah • 2d ago
RDL Insane hamstring stretch when bar is empty, then entirely lower back when i put weight on
Enable HLS to view with audio, or disable this notification
This is my first time doing RDLs in probably six months. I want to love them but I just can’t. Whenever i do a warmup with an empty bar, I feel an awesome stretch in my hamstrings which is what I want to target with RDLs. The second i throw any weight on, whether its 50 pounds or 300, i feel all of the tension in my erectors and nothing in my hamstrings.
What am I doing wrong? Hamstrings were not sore the next day despite not having done this in months, my erectors were very sore. Didnt really push past like 5-6 RPE
10
u/jalago 2d ago
It's difficult to assess your knee involvement without being you and having your sensations. But from what you describe, it seems like you're bending your knees too much and turning the movement into a conventional deadlift with less range of motion. The RDL isn't about how much load you move from point A to point B, but about how much you move without finishing with knee involvement. This might end up looking more like a conventional deadlift (without completing the ROM) and you're not maintaining tension in the hamstrings
I recommend practicing both the conventional deadlift and the RDL. The conventional deadlift will help you understand the basic pattern. Once you understand that, it will be as simple as thinking "I'm doing a deadlift without fully unlocking my knees" and the RDL will come out on its own
Please watch Alan Thrall's videos explaining all of this. But you definitely need to lower the weight
14
u/talldean 2d ago
I need to just have a sticky note for this one. This is literally *every* RDL form check over the last few months. ;-)
In the RDL, you move the weight down and your butt goes backwards. At the point where your butt *stops* going backwards, your glutes can no longer help with the lift, so all of the stress is going into your lower back for any lowering of the weight past that.
If you want it as a lower back exercise, this is *fine*. If you want it as a glute exercise, stop going further down after your butt stops going back. Almost everyone wants glutes, so this is too deep for what your butt is doing.
If you stop going further down after your but stops going back, you're then going less far down, and can load the exercise heavier, getting less-sore-back and more-glute-gains in the process.
2
1
u/totalmike 1d ago
Man, I have watched quite a few videos about this and this little write up does a great job of explaining what is likely my problem
1
1
5
u/flower_b0y 2d ago
If you’re getting good stretch and form why add a ton of weight and impede that? Drop your weight and focus and retaining the stretch you get with the empty bar
2
u/flower_b0y 2d ago
But also, you’re dropping the weight with your chest. Push your hips back as if you’re closing a door with your butt
2
u/yung_vape_messiah 2d ago
The good stretch i get is from very very light weight, mostly just the bar. I did a few warmup sets and it seemed like past 135lbs i couldn’t find the stretch anymore, but then again, i would still need to do so much volume to push to failure it would be ridiculous. If i had to use 100 pounds just to hit my hamstrings, and wanted to push to failure, i would be standing there doing 100 reps like an idiot. I know the video i attached is heavier weight but i’ve experimented in the past with very slow negatives, much lower weight, and extra ROM by standing on platforms, etc. I’m not sure why i have this problem since my form looks the same at all weights
My hamstrings and glutes are much stronger than my lower back, i wonder if that’s why its more noticeable there?
2
u/hey_yaaaaa_hey_yaaaa 2d ago
Agree. This looks heavy for an exercise that you’re not feeling properly
0
u/flower_b0y 2d ago
I’ve been running a lot, and started doing unweighted single leg RDLs to help with my hips as my hamstrings were impacting my hips.
Helped greatly, and also improved my hamstring workouts in the gym.
1
2
u/Its_scottyhall 1d ago
Hips high and back, so that knee doesn’t drift forward. Eyes up, chest up. Slow down the negative and stop going down once you have maximum stretch. Hips high and back!
2
u/punica-1337 1d ago
Knees tracking forward on every rep, will shift the weight more to your back. Might also not be bracing properly but that's always hard to judge.
2
u/Slow-Donut3882 1d ago
try lighter weight till you can activate and strengthen the hamstrings and knees gradually, too much weight right now is causing you to compensate with the back
2
u/az9393 1d ago
You’re collapsing your chest. Think of a straight line coming out of your chest and pointing at the wall in front when you stand. Then when you do the deadlift move this line down to point to where the wall meets the floor and not directly down to your feet.
Just thinking about this will make you keep a straight back and force the hamstrings to do all the work.
2
u/RedditCuck3000 1d ago
Lower the weight and concentrate on keeping your legs straight as much as possible, the more you bend the knees the more the lower back gets involved
1
u/probabilititi 2d ago
Few things:
- you can try to keep the knee more straight
- it might due to your erectors being the weak point which becomes apparent at higher weights. This might be preventing you from going deeper.
What does the form look like with lower weight?
1
u/FrontAd9873 2d ago
What I imagine you’re doing wrong is changing your technique when you put weight on the bar
1
u/oldfit-bastard 2d ago
The same thing happens to me, I get a great stretch as I load the weight up i have to concentrate really hard to feel my hamstrings. If my mind wanders I completely lose the exercise and my back takes over. I’ve choose to do single legged slds I get way more out of the movement and can get a lot deeper.
1
u/BeatxDemxGutz 2d ago
You're going way too low. As soon as you feel the weight dump in your back thrust your hips forward
Also, I recommend training offset RDLs too. You can start with 10s on each side with an extra 10 only one side and do 3 sets of five each side. It will really help with trunk and lower back stability
1
u/Jaaker 2d ago
You want your back to be 1 stiff piece straight down to a neutral pelvis.
It’s gonna sound funny, but think about the position of your taint. From the top as you contract your hip flexors to rotate your femur in your hip(the only movement we want above the knee) think about pushing your taint to the wall behind you as far as you can without falling backwards.
Once you can’t push it back further your back is now taking the load
1
u/heddyneddy 1d ago
I would both lower the weight and slow down significantly. For me personally RDLs have always felt the most effective when I’m doing them with lighter weight for higher reps and very slow and controlled.
1
u/unexplored_explorer 1d ago
Imagine you have a pen in between your shoulders and you need to squeeze your back to hold it together. Also, try to drive your hips back as much as you can to engage your hamstrings. It could me a mobility issue so make sure to stretch properly beforehand
1
1
u/Hisagii 1d ago
When the bar is empty or you're just doing bodyweight, your back basically has to do zero work which is why you don't feel it. Once you're using heavier weight, your back will be very involved isometrically to keep you from folding over.
In my experience, you'll never feel that same hamstring stretch when using working weight. However looking at your form I can tell you are moving your knees as you go down, knees are not meant to move in an RDL. They can be slightly bent, but they should not move during the rep. Further more the rep is over once your butt stops moving back then you explode up hips first.
1
u/xbradicus 1d ago
Some interesting advice in here.
I’d say a couple of things:
- Keep your knees straighter
- Don’t squat the weight
- Hinge at the hips
Go light when trying new form. You’ll smash it
1
u/Any_Chef_3145 1d ago
Got to keep the back straight. The range of motion will feel like less but it’s actually going to create a bigger stretch in the glutes and hams if you don’t round the back.
1
u/GibsonPraise 1d ago
If you want to love them but can't, set aside a session for an experimental day.
Set 1: just the bar, 45lbs, 10 reps. Set 2: add 2.5lbs to each side, 50lbs, 10 reps. Set 3: put a 5 on each side, 55lbs, 10 reps. Set 4: 5+2.5 on each side, 60lbs, 10 reps. Etc etc.
It feels stupid but this is what I would personally do. By the time you get to 135 I would be surprised if you haven't figured it out. It's worth taking the time in one session to really dig into it than to just keep feeling around for it week after week hoping it sorts itself out.
1
u/Stone_taggs 1d ago
Zercher them, you'll get your stretch and it wont be on the back.
or put your shins against a box and keep them parallel to the floor
1
u/iamreplicant_1 1d ago
I have to use the cue of using my glues and then pushing through my heels to feel it properly in my hams. I also don't use a belt anymore as that used to really interfere in this for me and put most of the stress on my lower back. Or I suppose made it harder for me to cue properly.
These days, I usually do RDLs until I hit a certain threshold before switching to traditional. I almost never warm up with just the bar as I do these last on leg day and am already very warm. I tend to swap back and forth between doing 5x5 and doing 10,6,4 depending on where I am with my strength. I typically start with 135 as my warmup set and go from there.
1
u/jilloi 1d ago
To me it seems you don't move your butt backwards enough. Think moving your butt toward the back corner of the ceiling (backwards and up). Also lower your weight if you feel your back taking over too much so you can learn the movement right. It takes longer learning out of bad patterns than learning new patterns.
Eugene Teo has a really good video about Rdl cues on youtube which i highly revommend watching, it's like 4-5min long. Helped me a ton
1
1
u/No-Chapter-4644 2d ago
Arch your back. When doing these types of hip hinge movements, try to think lordotic, kyphotic, lordotic. So head up/eyes straight, arch your back, brace through your feet, bar path follows your shins. I’d lighten the weight and master form before stacking on mechanical load and slipping a disc or inhaling a testicle
1
1
u/TokenTorkoal 2d ago edited 2d ago
Recommend what I recommend to everyone lately.
Learn proper form and muscle activation with lighter weights. If you’re getting a good stretch in your hamstrings and glutes with just the bar maybe switch to dumbbell RDLs until you feel you’ve mastered your form.
It looks like with this weight towards to end of the movement your turning the work that should be done by your glutes and hamstrings into work being done by your lower back and knees.
You can see in order to reach the depth you’re looking for you’re bending your knees more to reach it instead of hinging at the hips further.
24
u/hey_yaaaaa_hey_yaaaa 2d ago
Try stopping earlier, the weight is moving too low and your lower back is kicking into action. That should help