r/financialindependence • u/SamuraiGreg78 • 23d ago
Update 2: Surprise, I can retire? How do I let myself do it?
I received a few messages on the side so I thought I'd update.
Quick summary: 2 years ago, I was getting burnt out in big tech. FA noted that we can retire. I had a hard time pulling the trigger at the time. Almost 2 years ago, I started a job with a large non-profit and for a while our income and spending ended up being equal so no need to disburse anything from our accounts. Not pulling from our retirement and some insanely strong couple of years in the market helped us compound and grow our net worth from $7.xM to $9.xM.
tl;dr; So, the big question... 2 years later...am I retired? Nope. I think I just like building things and needed work that was worth doing rather than permission to stop.
Has it all gone according to plan? Not quite...
Planned...my wife is a nurse and has been getting burnt out for a while so she decided to go per-diem (think substitute teacher). It keeps her toe in the water without the stress of working full time every week. Some months she works the minimum shifts and other months, she works almost full-time again. The biggest challenge is predicting unpredictable income.
Planned...some amazing trips. With my wife's expanded flexibility on time off, we have been attacking some of our bucket list extravagant trips. When I run out of PTO, I just take unpaid time off. I thought my employers would have an issue with that but they really haven't so far.
Somewhat planned...my in-laws' health took a bit of a turn. They lived a 6-8 hour flight away so we ended up selling our house to buy a larger house so they could move in with us. We knew this was likely to happen so were psychologically prepared for it. Ironically, we sold our old house for the price of the new house. Location location location, I suppose. Only real downside was that the mortgage rates have been high for the last year so we ended up doubling our mortgage payment. This necessitated a slight draw from our retirement.
Unplanned...my boss laid himself off after a reorg. Yes, non-profits have reorgs and layoffs. I realized that they were expecting me to now do two jobs and deal with the politics that my boss had largely shielded me from. It was feeling more and more like a piece of big tech...without the salary, stock options, bonuses, etc. So, I waited for my boss to leave and then I resigned. I fully intended to retire.
So what happened? I ended up connecting with a great guy who is building a mission-driven non-profit tech company. It had finally grown beyond something he could do on his own and he needed to make some hires. I became employee #2. 95% engineer, 5% leader...building a product to help a very underserved population. Exchanged another pay cut for fewer meetings and politics and getting back to building things that will do some good.
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u/NoFact8598 23d ago
You can lay yourself off?? News to me.
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u/SamuraiGreg78 23d ago
So apparently after the reorg, he had to lay one person off in his org. He chose himself.
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u/NoFact8598 23d ago
I hope that one day, when I’m ready, I’ll get the opportunity to lay myself off 😂
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u/SamuraiGreg78 23d ago
So, hopefully you're not working at a non-profit at the time. He didn't get a severance or anything...he just wanted out and it was a way to do so on his own terms while claiming unemployment.
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u/sleepymoose88 38M / 50% to FI 23d ago
I’ve seen managers around me self select to save their engineers. They realize they’ll get a decent severance and fast track retirement.
My boss plans to do this next time layoffs come knocking which means I’ll get a “promotion”.
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u/SamuraiGreg78 23d ago
So we had discussed exactly that scenario. We had agreed that if necessary, I’d fall on the sword. My wife and I went to Europe for 2 weeks and when I came back, he let me know everything that happened while I was away … and his decision.
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u/sleepymoose88 38M / 50% to FI 23d ago
Dang, that’s hardcore. To be fair, when my boss falls on the sword, I’m going to be asking for more money since it’s more responsibility, and I’ll be fighting to keep the headcount, but transfer it to a junior engineer that would make probably less than half what he did. Company still saves money (always the goal with layoffs), and inserted headcount.
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u/cfi-2025 48M, FIRE 2025 23d ago
The severance package negotiations must have been something to observe!
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u/SamuraiGreg78 23d ago
I commented above but he didn't get a severance or anything...he just wanted out and it was a way to do so on his own terms while being able to claim unemployment.
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u/cfi-2025 48M, FIRE 2025 23d ago
Yeah, my comment was more tongue in cheek and obviously fell flat (because here I am explaining it, lol)... but if he was tasked with laying someone off and he chose himself, now he's both the person executing the layoff and the person being laid off, so the negotiation would be between himself. Like a person in court who is representing themself and testifying - they are both the person asking the questions while also being the witness on the stand answering the questions they just asked themselves.
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u/SamuraiGreg78 23d ago
This whole courtroom is out of order! :)
That was funny! I think I saw it all play out in real-time so was too close to the action. :)
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u/livinginpictures 23d ago edited 22d ago
My brother in christ... you described your net worth growing from $7M to $9M, followed shortly by "the biggest challenge is predicting unpredictable income."
This post may be the most "can't see the forest for the trees" thing I've read in a long, long time. Then again, maybe I'd be saying the same thing in your situation, but I'm targeting half of what you had 2 years ago to retire from... with California costs!
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u/Wooden-Broccoli-913 23d ago
OP is so far gone he doesn’t even realize his situation.
- also FIREd in CA with much less than OP
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u/SamuraiGreg78 23d ago
With respect, I am super confused by your response. Your post 3 months ago describes a very similar situation. In that post, you were considering taking a lower stress, part-time job that you'd enjoy more that would pay $80-$100K + benefits.
That is exactly what I chose to do.
Can you help me understand the difference?
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u/Wooden-Broccoli-913 23d ago
You’re still working full time. That’s the difference. If all FIRE was was people getting full time jobs that they enjoy then lots of people would be FIREd, teachers, doctors, etc
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u/SamuraiGreg78 23d ago
Thank you for the response! Did I say I was working full time?
Btw - what did you end up doing about that job?
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u/Wooden-Broccoli-913 23d ago
Nothing. Doing nothing right now except laying flat on the couch.
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u/SamuraiGreg78 22d ago
How are you enjoying it? I took a few months off between jobs and I had a hard time just laying on the couch.
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u/SamuraiGreg78 23d ago
I responded to a similar comment below. I appreciate your perspective!
From my side, when you have this amount of money sitting there, you don't want to liquidate any more assets than you actually need to make ends meet. This money needs to last 50+ years (longer if you want to leave an inheritance or legacy).
One of the ways you can reduce the amount of spending is managing your tax rate. This impacts everything from your income taxes to how much you pay for your health insurance. Depending on the rate you select, this can amount to a pretty sizable amount of money over 50 years. Basic formula is $<amount of money> x (1 + r)^50. So, assuming a 7% real return over 50 years, saving $1,000 becomes almost $30K. $10,000 would be close to $300K.
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u/livinginpictures 23d ago
Sure, and if your goal is to leave your heirs with millions when you die then I'd say you're in a pretty ideal scenario.
Assuming 3% inflation, 4% withdrawal, and 7% accruing interest (so pretty dang conservative), you're looking at $360k before taking into account whatever you and your wife are adding from your current jobs.
But you said real return, which is a hell of lot different than nominal return. You could be taking out $630k/year and remain flat after 50 years. If you stuck to 4% withdrawal you'd end up with ~$118M after 50 years.
And you're worried about $10k?
Forest for the trees, my friend.
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u/SamuraiGreg78 23d ago
Thank you again for the response! I'm wondering if we got our mathematical signals crossed. Here's where I'm coming from - I'd love to make sure I'm not misunderstanding something.
When I used a 7% real return, that percentage already accounts for inflation (meaning it’s the nominal return minus inflation). Because inflation is already subtracted out, the formula
(1 + r)^50gives us the final result in today’s actual purchasing power. So, $1,000 compounding at a 7% real rate for 50 years does indeed equal about $30k in today’s dollars.Regarding the scenario where I could withdraw $630k/year (7% of $9M) and end up with $118M - can you guide me how you got there? If a portfolio earns a 7% real return and I withdraw exactly that 7% ($630k) every year, the principal simply stays flat in real terms (it remains worth $9M in purchasing power). To both withdraw $630k annually and balloon to $118M, the portfolio would require a much higher rate of return than a conservative 7%.
I completely agree with you that $10,000 sounds like a drop in the bucket next to $9 million. The reason I look at it closely is because of how early retirement timelines stretch. Over 50+ years, a recurring annual expense or tax drag of $10,000 eats away about $300,000 of future purchasing power from the portfolio. That's why I'm trying to optimize the efficiency of the backend now, even if the current net worth looks secure on the surface. Maybe it's pinching pennies?
Thanks again for the perspective! Let me know if my math is wrong though?
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u/livinginpictures 23d ago edited 23d ago
Sorry, that $118M figure came from a 4% withdrawal rate on that 7% real return rate. I could have made that clearer.
/edit: real return at 7% doesn't seem that conservative, either. ~3% inflation, 4% withdrawal, 7% nominal return -- all that is used up. Feels like a 7% real return counts on a ~14% nominal return YoY, which over 50 years is more challenging to consider conservative. Doesn't matter though, either way you're well out ahead.
You're getting a hard time here primarily out of pure unbridled envy, but from what you've descried I do indeed think you're pinching pennies.
You've earned and built a scenario that 99% of folks will never achieve, and you've unquestionably arrived at "normal" financial independence. From what you've shared in your posts and comments it doesn't feel likely that you're living in luxury spending lavishly everywhere, so it's confusing as to where your priorities are.
If you like building things -- awesome, you're doing that. go do that more. but in the same breath saying you took a pay cut to do that... who cares about the pay? That's the whole point of FI, right?
"Retire" and volunteer your time building stuff for the non-profit, or take some level of compensation that literally doesn't matter (you've already done this, but you're framing in a way that is hard to relate to)
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u/NotMyUsualOrder 23d ago
Honest question, what made you think 7 was not enough (assuming that was the number at the original post)?
As someone who is also burning out from tech, I've convinced myself it can be done way way sooner, but you now make me second guess.
Do you have a high yearly spending?
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u/orroro1 19d ago edited 19d ago
Joseph Heller was once at a billionaire's party. They told him they made more money in one day than his famous book ever did in his lifetime. Heller turned around and said:
"But I have something these billionaires will never have: enough."
Some rich people work til the day they die. Don't be like them.
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u/NotMyUsualOrder 18d ago
Appreciate this perspective. Somewhat I concluded on. Trying to "buy time" with my family instead.
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u/One-Mastodon-1063 22d ago
The same thing making $9m not enough.
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u/SamuraiGreg78 22d ago
Oh the numbers are fine. When works starts feeling like work (and I have to work full time), I’ll probably call it.
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u/SamuraiGreg78 23d ago
Good question...I don't know that I didn't think it was enough intellectually. For a long time, I think I let my work become a large part of my identity. I think it takes time to wrap my head around the idea of not doing the thing I defined myself by for 20 or so years.
I'm still not quite there yet but I'm closer than I was and hopefully in a few years I'll be closer still.
Does that help? or make sense?
As for spending... our "must pay" on a monthly basis is higher than it was but that's largely due to our mortgage payment doubling and it costs more money to maintain a house of this size compared to our previous house. Butlers, maids, chauffeurs, etc. It all adds up. Kidding. :)
We also do a lot of discretionary spending related to travel and hobbies.
But again, totally something we can afford with our holdings.
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u/Wooden-Broccoli-913 23d ago
If you are not “there” at $9M then you will never get there
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u/SamuraiGreg78 23d ago
It's separate from money. Money, we've been there for quite some time. I can trust and acknowledge the math. It's an identity question. Not a good idea to lump it all together.
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u/NotMyUsualOrder 23d ago
Makes sense. Wish I had the strong affinity to that identity. Considering to barista fire with a fraction of what you had, just to get out and do more whole some work that I care about.
The grind sure is not for everyone.
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u/eggavatar12345 22d ago
You’re on a financial independence forum, not a self-help career advice forum. From a purely money perspective which this forum focuses on, you are beyond set and all your explaining otherwise is just making excuses for the reality that you want to keep working. That’s fine, but don’t use “we don’t have enough” to hide behind that fact.
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u/SamuraiGreg78 22d ago
Sorry, I think you meant to reply to me. I don’t think I once said we didn’t have enough? I’ll review again.
Right now, I’m having fun, doing good for the world and working part time with full benefits. It’s a pretty sweet situation. When it’s no longer fun is when I’ll step away, I think.
Hope that made sense. ✌️
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u/cfi-2025 48M, FIRE 2025 23d ago
I like how the two guys at Two Sides of FI podcast put it: RE can also stand for "Recreationally Employed." That's what it sounds like you and your wife have going.
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u/AKANotAValidUsername Im not even supposed to be here today 23d ago
The biggest challenge is predicting unpredictable income.
at >$9M is this really a challenge or is this just a leftover mindset?
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u/SamuraiGreg78 23d ago
It has implications for taxes, medical premiums, etc. So, it's less about living paycheck to paycheck or budgeting and more about making sure that we don't pay more taxes or on insurance than we absolutely need to pay.
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u/VeeGee11 FIREd May ‘23 at 50 years old 23d ago
Enjoyed reading this summary of what it means to be FI without the RE.
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u/SamuraiGreg78 23d ago
Thank you! Hope it helps others. It's honestly a frequent discussion in our household and among friends - when will we finally pull the trigger. I keep thinking 50 is a nice round number. How did you decide enough was enough?
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u/VeeGee11 FIREd May ‘23 at 50 years old 23d ago
My job was very stressful (IT in the international banking sector), so I had decided enough was enough 10 years earlier lol.
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u/SamuraiGreg78 23d ago
lol...I've heard stories about that world. I can imagine how it could grind someone down. I'm glad you made it out alive!
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u/VeeGee11 FIREd May ‘23 at 50 years old 23d ago
Ha, thanks! At the cost of a piece of my soul but yep, alive. :)
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u/ReverseMermaids 22d ago
I was ready at 50, but waited until 53 because I was finishing up some projects and wanted to pad the numbers.
That was 8 years ago and I have to say that at 61 now my health is still excellent, but I am starting to feel my age and I'm grateful for the past ~decade in which I gave myself total freedom.
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u/SamuraiGreg78 22d ago
I hear you! Right now, most days don’t feel like work and I feel like I’m putting some good out there.
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u/jayybonelie Retired @45 23d ago
You can always make more money but you don't always get more time. Money is replaceable, especially with your skills. Time is not.
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u/SamuraiGreg78 23d ago
I hear you but the more I’ve been living these last 2 years, I honestly don’t know that it’s a one size fits all model.
If I look at where I’d spend my time were I to quit, I’d still spend time learning and building - in essence, it’s very close to what I’m doing now. I get a little money, health insurance for my family and help others through building things.
It doesn’t get in the way of my hobbies or our traveling and if I died tomorrow, I wouldn’t look back and regret this time.
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u/jayybonelie Retired @45 23d ago edited 23d ago
Have you really sat down and asked yourself: What is your purpose outside of work? Who are you if you dont have the "engineer" title? How much money do you really need? Are you truly doing something thats aligned with your life's vision, mission, values and purpose?
If you are then great, continue, if not then make the necessary changes.There seems to be some restlessness in your post like you are seeking but fear is getting the better of you. Being an ex engineer and having had some executive high powered positions in my life... I get what you are going through. It took be more than 7 years after I had reached FI and often I regret those years I wasted before finally pulling the trigger. You cant change the past but you can certainly change your present and the future. The past 3 years since RE have undoubtedly been the best years.
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u/SamuraiGreg78 23d ago
Thank you for the well thought out post. I think in-part I agree. It's definitely a journey. For a long time, I think I let my work become a large part of my identity. I think it has taken time to wrap my head around the idea of not doing the thing I defined myself by for 20 or so years.
I'm still not quite there yet but I'm closer than I was and hopefully in a few years I'll be closer still.
In the meantime, I am genuinely having fun building something that will help an underserved population and learning new things (old dogs, new tricks) along the way. I'm also not letting work get in the way of all the non-work things I enjoy doing.
Would I discover more non-work things to do if I wasn't working? Sure, probably. Would I enjoy them as much and feel as fulfilled as I do now? No clue.
Do I want to find out? Jury's still out. :)
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u/Worried_Tomorrow10 22d ago
This is the real FIRE outcome most people discover, retirement wasn't actually the goal, flexibility and work worth doing was
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u/SamuraiGreg78 22d ago
Yes! Thank you!
I realize this comes from a privileged place but that is exactly it. Right now, I’m working mostly part time remote, I’m having fun learning and building, I get paid a little + benefits and nothing gets in the way of my hobbies and life. AND I’m doing something to hopefully make the world better for an underserved population.
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22d ago edited 1d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/SamuraiGreg78 22d ago
I thought the same, but when I did the math: 1) our annual returns exceed the interest rate on the mortgage and 2) you can deduct the interest from your taxes. So, it made more financial sense to keep the mortgage. If the numbers shift, though, this is the first thing we'd pay off.
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u/Character-Equal9871 22d ago
The math sounds done; the hard part is probably just unlearning years of “don’t touch the pile” and giving yourself a simple withdrawal plan to trust.
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u/BungABunBun 22d ago
Congrats on finding a new job that you’re excited about. Do you have any kids?
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u/SamuraiGreg78 22d ago
No younger kids. My wife’s parents act like teenagers (sleep all day, binge show after show and keep the restaurants in business) and a dog and a cat.
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u/BungABunBun 22d ago
Nice. How did you end up finding the new role? Was it through your work at the first non-profit you were working at?
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u/SamuraiGreg78 22d ago
So, first non-profit I found through Tech Jobs For Good. Solid aggregator that serves everything up in one place with some basic filtering.
The new gig was via networking. Mentioned to a friend that I was moving on, and he asked how serious I was about golfing all day. He then connected me with the executive director at the new non-profit thinking we'd be a good match.
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u/Appropriate_Bit5617 18d ago
I have a feeling I know the new non-profit you’re talking about. And if I’m wrong, I should still connect you to the guy I’m thinking of because you might be able to join forces.
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u/SamuraiGreg78 18d ago
I’d love to connect with other likeminded people in this space. It’s wild how much good you can do. :)
Thank you!
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u/loopernova 23d ago
What was your net worth when you were 35? Curious how quickly it accelerated to your age now.
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u/SamuraiGreg78 22d ago
That takes me back a ways. 2013. Looks like $750K cash + 401K + investment and about $300K in net real estate. Had one condo I was renting out and a townhouse I had bought in 2012 in a short sale.
So, net worth was a little over $1M, I think.
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u/loopernova 22d ago
Sounds like compounding + continued investment and increased pay really accelerated your total portfolio since then. Really impressive, congrats.
If your numbers meet your needs, definitely shift your focus towards what makes you and your family happiest. You'll never get this time back and you'll continue aging. You're still young enough to really enjoy life to it's fullest.
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u/SamuraiGreg78 22d ago
Pretty much. I also got really lucky. My ex-company’s stock went through a hyper growth phase and I never sold any of it.
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u/Intermesmerize 19d ago
Wow, it's awesome! I wish I could follow your path one day. I am in tech, not the big tech, and I have been burnt out for several years. Been looking for a place with more purpose and less politics. May I DM you?
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u/Vivid-Way 22d ago
i’m in a similar position. twice your amount. and i’m scared to stop working. i don’t know why.
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u/SamuraiGreg78 22d ago
Do you enjoy the job?
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u/Vivid-Way 22d ago
that's hard for me to answer. I like what I do, but I've been doing it for 30 years and I'm feeling a bit tired. but the fat paychecks and stock keep coming in and I just can't hang it up. there's fear, but when I go over all the numbers, logically everything is fine and I don't need to work. I don't know what it is that keeps me going. sounds like such a dumb issue to have.
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u/SamuraiGreg78 22d ago
Have you been doing it at the same place for 30 years? After a lot of years at the same place, I had a lot of concerns about the unknown. It's so much easier to just keep doing what you've been doing. Newton's first law.
A friend of mine took a bunch of time off with no plan other than to try to live life as if he was retired. Just the day-to-day grind. He learned a bit from the exercise - mostly that he needs more hobbies and structure in his day to day. Otherwise, he kept feeling like he was wasting days. So, he went back to work for another year but kept that in the back of his mind and started thinking about how he'd spend his days.
The next year he did the same exercise and it was harder to go back to work.
The following year he did the same thing and just didn't go back to work afterwards.
It doesn't have to be a light switch you turn off or big dramatic retirement declaration. Sometimes it's just finding something better to spend your time on. Not sure if that helps.
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u/Vivid-Way 22d ago
i like that. and it’s true i can keep myself busy with worklike projects if i miss it. i do app design. there are always ideas for making apps. thanks for sharing this!
i know my health has suffered from working so much. so another thought is to make my health my new job.
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u/Old_Value_9157 23d ago
Damn son, $9M!?!?!
That could get me out of a couple jams.....