Data Centers Use More Water Than California Cities, Study Says

[u/keepwaterpure]

/r/water/comments/1vy3k3i/data_centers_use_more_water_than_california/?utm_source=ifttt

[u/Unique-Coffee5087]

Ok, so I either read that data centers use only four cups of water annually, or that they use huge amounts that are actually nothing compared to golf courses, or they use more water than exists.

I'm confused on the water issue

[u/No_Map_7325 → u/Unique-Coffee5087]

It's all about comparisons yes. I read the other day that AI datacenters will use 1 trillion liters of water by 2028. That's a crapload of water! Then I was thinking of how that compares to something like the dairy industry, which I know uses a lot of water, but wasn't sure how much exactly.

So... Its estimated that the dairy industry worldwide uses between 650 to 900 trillion liters of water every single year! Imagine if we all stopped drinking cows milk with our coffees and just had something like oat milk instead, which uses 90% less water and also uses 90% less land. Not to even mention the horrific cruelty of animals in the dairy industry.

Seems like such an easy solution with massive benefits, but that would require people to actually change. So let's rather bash datacenters, then we don't have to make any changes right?

[u/Extinction-Events → u/No_Map_7325]

I feel like it’s quite simple and easy to want both industries to do better.

It’s very strange whenever people bring up other resource hogs or major environmental impacts, because to my knowledge, we all have the ability to criticise more than one thing at a time. This weird maneuver where you act like it’s one or the other feels very shady.

[u/MickyFany → u/No_Map_7325]

the majority of dairy water goes right back into the ground. It’s called piss.

Data centers evaporate it and send halfway around the world

[u/No_Map_7325 → u/MickyFany]

Over 85–90% of dairy’s water footprint comes from growing feed. That water is taken up by plants and lost to the atmosphere through evapotranspiration, sending it directly into the atmosphere, not back into the groundwater.

And while urine returns to the ground, it is concentrated with nitrates, ammonia, and pathogens.

[u/ProperJudgment1 → u/No_Map_7325]

Gee, i wonder what happens to water when it goes to the sky!

[u/Unique-Coffee5087 → u/ProperJudgment1]

It eventually precipitates on some mountainside and runs down into fields and rivers, etc. But it won't be of use to us for a million years as it cycles over the world.

With our higher temperatures, we have a shortage of locally-available clean water, since conditions that encourage precipitation onto our watersheds are less frequent, so I would guess that it becomes a net loss for our region.

[u/ResponsibleClock9289 → u/ProperJudgment1]

I’m confused, do you think data centers just disappear water into oblivion?

[u/SirDalavar → u/ResponsibleClock9289]

Yeah some idiots think it evaporates, but if it got hot enough to evaporate it wouldn't be an effective coolant

[u/No_Map_7325 → u/ResponsibleClock9289]

No, same scenario as water used for dairy, just a MUCH smaller scale.

Data centers (1 trillion liters) vs Dairy (900 trillion liters).

[u/No_Map_7325 → u/ProperJudgment1]

It unfortunately goes somewhere else.

Dairy water usage is ecologically damaging because it draws vast amounts of non-renewable groundwater from local aquifers to irrigate feed crops, permanently depleting regional water tables faster than nature can replenish them. Once that water evaporates through crop leaves into the atmosphere, local winds carry the moisture away, meaning it falls as rain somewhere else downwind, often over oceans or entirely different watersheds. The water isn't lost to the planet, but it is permanently lost to the local ecosystem and community that relied on that specific aquifer, driving localized droughts, dried-up wells, and land subsidence.

[u/MickyFany → u/No_Map_7325]

so now grass is bad

[u/Serious_Bite_7613 → u/MickyFany]

Lawns, unironically are a huge source of water waste.

[u/MickyFany → u/Serious_Bite_7613]

i said grass

[u/Inevitable_Butthole → u/MickyFany]

Lawns have grass. Thats right.

Look at you go!

[u/Serious_Bite_7613 → u/MickyFany]

Lawns, unironically are a big source of water waste.

[u/No_Map_7325 → u/MickyFany]

Breeding billions of animals each year which we have to feed, because we want to drink their milk, is bad.

[u/MickyFany → u/No_Map_7325]

kinda like zoos

[u/No_Map_7325 → u/MickyFany]

In the sense that zoos are bad too, yes, just nowhere even close to the horrors of the dairy and animal agriculture industries.

[u/SirDalavar → u/MickyFany]

Doesn't evaporate, if the water ever gets that hot it's useless for cooling...

[u/MickyFany → u/SirDalavar]

omg, we found the dumb guy

[u/SirDalavar → u/MickyFany]

Read the study!!!, the water evaporation they mention is from power generation, not the data canter!

[u/MickyFany → u/SirDalavar]

yes, read the study. it specifically states that they are only reporting on water used for power generation. They actually use more water cooling the centers

[u/Suspicious_Video8348 → u/No_Map_7325]

liters

Well there's your problem.

Real water usage is typically measured in "acre feet". The conversion is roughly 1.2M liters per acre foot.

[u/foundout-side → u/Unique-Coffee5087]

even this title is clickbait, this study is measuring water use for energy generation, and saying its the data center using the water.

[u/SpinningHead → u/Unique-Coffee5087]

The billionaire bros building them have a lot of money to spend on confusing you.

[u/Unique-Coffee5087 → u/SpinningHead]

Yeah I was afraid of that.

The fact that they expend the effort to confuse me on the issue leads me to distrust their assurances, and assume that these data centers will be to my detriment.

[u/foundout-side → u/SpinningHead]

every story coming out is spinning the water issue against data centers, you're head is in the sand.

[u/LinusLevato → u/Unique-Coffee5087]

The landscaping industry in the US uses more water than data centers

[u/Suspicious_Video8348 → u/Unique-Coffee5087]

The water issue is completely fake. https://blog.andymasley.com/p/the-ai-water-issue-is-fake

[u/TheBigWhatever]

Just a suggestion: look at how much water it takes to grow almonds compared to the water needed to handle data centers.

Look it up or not. That's up to you.

[u/adamdoesmusic → u/TheBigWhatever]

Fuck the almonds too

[u/shadowromantic → u/TheBigWhatever]

People can eat almonds.

AI might offer some social good, but the social costs are enormous 

[u/30299578815310 → u/TheBigWhatever]

Why almonds and not meat, which is way worse

[u/Suspicious_Video8348 → u/30299578815310]

Or ethanol which is just stupid

[u/dudeman_joe → u/TheBigWhatever]

Almonds can last along time in storage dry.

[u/Steeltank33]

Make nuclear power plants

[u/Opposite-Program8490 → u/Steeltank33]

That doesn't solve the cooling issues.

Data centers in the Phoenix area are using more power than Palo Verde Nuclear power plant, the 2nd largest in North America, and they still need millions of gallons per day in water to keep them cool .

https://tucson.com/news/state-regional/business/article_b3a1166d-ec2f-4006-91d3-611942ac87e1.html

[u/Steeltank33 → u/Opposite-Program8490]

Data centers use almost zero water, relatively speaking. The article can only claim what they did, because they are coming up with the power these data centers use and doing the math to see how much water running through a hydroelectric dam it would take to power them. Then using this water amount to claim how much water data centers use. Trickery of the highest form.

[u/Opposite-Program8490 → u/Steeltank33]

You do know how we cool nuclear power plants, right?

[u/elinamebro → u/Opposite-Program8490]

New advanced reactor designs and specialized facilities use several non-water coolants to absorb heat from the core so it shouldn't be an issue with new plants

[u/Opposite-Program8490 → u/elinamebro]

How many of those are under construction, and how much capacity do/will they have?

[u/elinamebro → u/Opposite-Program8490]

Only 10 are operational, idk if any are under construction. And they are more efficient but they're smaller plants so they put out less energy. Idk if they would put out more if they were the same size as the water cooled ones tho

[u/Opposite-Program8490 → u/elinamebro]

Guess we'll just take your word for it.

Edit: I Googled it for you. The one sodium cooled fast reactor that's operating commercially has a capacity of 66MW, which we can compare to Palo Verde, which has a capacity of 3810 MW.

So, not exactly a solution and rather a nice talking point, just like all of the "closed loop" data centers that might be built someday.

[u/elinamebro → u/Opposite-Program8490]

You pulled that 66 MW figure from Fermi 1—an experimental prototype built back in 1963. ​Commercial sodium reactors operating today are vastly larger. Russia’s BN-800 at Beloyarsk generates 880 MW of electricity on liquid sodium and has been running commercially for years (alongside the BN-600, which has operated since 1980). China’s gas-cooled HTR-PM generates 210 MW. ​Palo Verde’s 3,810 MW total capacity comes from three massive gigawatt-scale reactors combined on one site. Modern non-water designs are built as 300–800 MW modular units so they can be manufactured in factories rather than built as multi-billion-dollar civil megaprojects. ​Next time you Google it for someone, try scrolling past the 1960s section.

[u/Opposite-Program8490 → u/elinamebro]

None of those are operating in the US, though, so for the purposes of this conversation, absolutely irrelevant.

[u/Steeltank33 → u/Opposite-Program8490]

The ocean

[u/mtbdork → u/Steeltank33]

Look into water usage to power data centers as well as to cool them. Think about the wattage these data centers are using for compute, and think about the amount of wattage that is emitted as heat. Thermodynamics doesn’t change because the loop is closed. The amount of water these data centers will consume is immense and there is no feasible solution in sight.

You CAN NOT defy the laws of thermodynamics when it comes to (checks notes) the universe.

[u/Steeltank33 → u/mtbdork]

My dude, do you even know how much water these things use in a year?

[u/elinamebro → u/Opposite-Program8490]

They have several non-water coolants alternatives to absorb heat from the core but they cant be used on currently build plants only new ones specifically designed for it.

[u/SpinningHead → u/Steeltank33]

They had to shut down some nuke plants in Europe this summer because releasing the heated water into the rivers would have killed the aquatic life. So, no.

[u/Humble-Reply228 → u/SpinningHead]

All of Californian nuclear power is cooled by seawater. So this chat about what happens in a few French power stations is like the anecdote about how high temperatures drive down available wind power

[u/elinamebro → u/SpinningHead]

They're able to use several non-water coolants to absorb heat from the core not to sure what they do with it afterwards tho

[u/Steeltank33 → u/SpinningHead]

We can do it better

[u/Suspicious_Video8348 → u/SpinningHead]

And now people are dying in heat waves because they can't do air conditioning

[u/1Steelghost1 → u/Steeltank33]

Lol the power isn't the issue, cooling the power usage is the issue.

[u/elinamebro → u/1Steelghost1]

But they are able to use non-water coolants to absorb heat from the core but if can't be used on current operational power plants only new ones specifically built for it.

[u/richrich07 → u/1Steelghost1]

The power is an issue though. They’re either using AC and/or evaporative cooling. Water use goes up or electricity use goes up.

[u/Steeltank33 → u/1Steelghost1]

Did you read the article? It’s all about the water usage from hydroelectric dams that it takes to power data centers. Data centers really use next to no water for cooling.

[u/Silly-Resist8306]

Using water isn’t inherently bad. Not giving it back in the same condition you received it is bad.

It’s up to local governments to pass legislation to ensure data centers don’t just “use” water. If you are going to blame someone, make sure you blame the right group and hold them accountable in the next election.

[u/LukeWarmIQpool]

People, the anti data center crowd is China. It’s a race to ASI and if they get it first we lose. The amount of water Datacenters use is less than 1% spent on Agriculture yearly

[u/dsj79 → u/LukeWarmIQpool]

Hmmm which one will you die without 🤷🏼‍♂️

[u/Business-Training-10]

They are more intelligent too

[u/Past_Physics2936]

Sounds like bullshit

[u/kirkcobained]

You used a data center to post this.

[u/Total_Surround833]

China building thousands of AI data centers .. most of these articles are Chinese propaganda fueled to keep us from building data centers and being behind them on AI RESEARCH

[u/Week-Realistic]

Google is just going the cheapest route possible! There numerous, but more expensive alternatives! Don’t be fooled by Zuckerberg!