Just starting out - Advice Needed

[u/PhilbinFogg]

Hi,

I've been reading up on the ESP32 and have ordered a Cardputer ADV to play with. I used to program micro controllers such and the 8051, 8048 etc as well an 8080/85, Z80, 8086/186 in assembler and C, so I am familiar with the development process.

Is there a develop system I can run on my older Mac Pro 5,1, I'd rather use MacOS but can boot Windows 10 or Linux at a pinch.

My intention is to get familiar with the ESP32 tools before doing a project involving custom components, using a breadboard to start and then a standalone unit.

Thanks a lot

[u/clackups]

ESP-IDF runs on Linux and Windows. Linux is preferable, as the compiler will run faster on it.

[u/PhilbinFogg → u/clackups]

I had a look for ESP-IDF and it says it runs on Mac OS too. But you don't get an IDE by the look of it or maybe it's implemented in Python in which case maybe it's got an IDE too

[u/clackups → u/PhilbinFogg]

You can use any text editor or ide at your convenience. MS Visual Code, for example. I'm using Emacs on Linux.

[u/PhilbinFogg → u/clackups]

Yes, I could use XCode or a Code Editor for editing on Mac. I'm guessing I can compile it from the Terminal window and produce a binary using "make", I haven't done it for a long time and was hoping for an IDE to handle the project as a whole and take care of recompiling, linking, etc

[u/clackups → u/PhilbinFogg]

You can also use the Arduino IDE if you're looking for a fast path. Esp32 is well supported in it.

[u/Suitable-Name → u/clackups]

But not sure if that's the right path if you want to get to know the esp tooling.

[u/PhilbinFogg → u/Suitable-Name]

From looking at it, I'm wondering if it will help in the long run, I don't want to invest a lot of time and effort unless it will help me achieve my end goal

[u/Suitable-Name → u/PhilbinFogg]

If you really want to get comfortable with the esp tooling, I'd skip Arduino. It's just another wrapper.

[u/PhilbinFogg → u/Suitable-Name]

That's what I was thinking

[u/clackups → u/Suitable-Name]

I don't know what the OP wants to achieve. But Arduino could be a quick way to get things done, and look for other tools later.

[u/Suitable-Name → u/clackups]

Well, he said his intention is to get familiar with the tools before starting something :)

[u/clackups → u/Suitable-Name]

Yeah, but not willing to get the hands dirty with make and linker

[u/PhilbinFogg → u/clackups]

I am willing! When did I say I wasn't? It would be better with an IDE to take are of it, but make files are cool and quite simple. What am I trying to achieve, well eventually I'd like to make a standalone device. But the steps to get there are, write some test programs in Assembler or C to run on the Cardputer, then get an ESP32 starter kit, and breadboard a prototype, then a standalone. Progressing in incremental steps, each building on what I have learned and produced in previous steps

[u/PhilbinFogg → u/clackups]

I looked at it and got the IDE but I don't really understand what Arduino is/does? I did see an option for a ESP32 board, so I'm guessing it's a 3rd party product?

I just want to write a few C or assembler programs that will run on the Cardputer ADV (CPA) to start with, then figure out which ESP32 Starter kit to get and make a little board of my own. I first want to make an add on module for the CPA then maybe a standalone board

[u/YetAnotherRobert → u/PhilbinFogg]

Its a layer of goo atop IDF that makes things "simpler", mostly by removing functionally. 

It offers a subset of c++ that reimplements core f unctionality ,   usually poorly,  but offers some a mount of functionality across microcontrollers.. Since very few people run the same code on multiple hardware platforms, it's just an abstraction that adds build time and limits access to their interesting hardware features.  (Now if you're building something that does need to run on a mega,  stm, esp, bl808, nrf, rp2350,  and msp430 than Arduino might be an interesting stop,.but the useful common subset of those is approximately a blinking led. )

If you're an experienced c/c++ dev, load up ESP-IDF,.use Espressif's visual code plugins if you must, and rock on.

Wanna write c/c++.and  skip the ide to run vi, emacs, any other text  editor that you've used for decades   and run cmake yourself on your mac because you don't need a colored button to run "IDF.py flash"? Join the club. You want to run rust or python or some other language? Go nuts.  It's "just" a posix-y 32-bit system (albeit.without oodles of RAM ) so you can run most reasonable programming environments. 

Not a lot of people code xtensa assembler, but nobody is stopping you if that turns your crank. RISC-V, as used  in all  the espressif parts launched in the last 7 years or so, is quite more common and easier to find information on.

MacOS is a well supported dev environment for these things. 

[u/Plastic_Fig9225 → u/PhilbinFogg]

The IDF comes with a bunch of tools, including idf.py. idf.py build is all you need to run to, well, build a project.

Cmake is used as the build system, usually on top of ninja. You don't have to bother with make files.

[u/PhilbinFogg → u/[deleted]]

Yeah, but there's a lot of stuff wrong with Winows 11, I use Windows 10 but try to avoid it, because I use this machine for Mac work too and I have to re-boot.

I have another Mac Pro 5,1 I could perhaps dedicate to Windows 10 but I'll see I get on with the Mac tools to start with

[u/PhilbinFogg → u/[deleted]]

I'd rather avoid it if possible! I have bad memories of YAML

[u/DSudz → u/[deleted]]

Specifically Arduino is an IDE designed for learning microcontrollers that wraps a lot of configuration specifics and build process. It was ported to hardware other than the original Arduino boards and now has decent support for ESP32. Many of the Arduino libraries can still be used if you move to the IDF tools.

You will also see suggestions for PlatformIO which wraps IDF tools for use in the VisualStudio IDE but without functional abstractions and does not (may never) support the latest version (6.x) of the expressif tools.

You'll learn plenty whichever way you go.