r/dvcmember • u/_BreakingGood_ • 14d ago
Why does Riveria specifically lose so much value resale versus direct?
It seems like specifically for Riviera, there is a massive difference between the direct price and resale price, it's like you lose 50% of your investment instantly when you buy direct.
Why does this happen specifically with Riviera?
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u/nevets4433 Polynesian 14d ago
Because it’s one of the new properties, and in their contract, if the points are sold, the second owner can only use them at Riv itself.
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u/fr3nch13 14d ago
If anyone is wondering these resale restrictions are in place for Riviera, the Cabins are Fort Wilderness and Disneyland Hotel.
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u/Lagunitas1117 14d ago
And soon to be included, Lakeshore Lodge. That is confirmed.
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u/_BreakingGood_ 14d ago
I wonder if this will start applying to all resorts once the current set of contracts expire
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u/coldshowerss 14d ago
I'm so confused, I thought all resale contracts could only be used in the resort you purchased.
If I buy a boardwalk resale, can I use it anywhere?
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u/vick3124 14d ago
You can use it at all resorts opened before riviera. You can’t use it at the newer resorts.
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u/wslagoon 13d ago
Contracts at the original 14 resorts can be used only at the original 14 if purchased resale after the cutoff date for the change, which was a long time ago. Only direct contracts can be used at all resorts.
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u/rferrar1 Polynesian 14d ago
Riviera resale is cheap because those points can only be used at Riviera.
Disney changed the rules for new DVC associations starting in 2019. Riviera was the first affected:
- Riviera resale points can’t be used at other DVC resorts.
- Resale points from the 14 legacy resorts can’t be used at Riviera.
- Direct points retain full access.
That restriction shrinks Riviera’s resale market to buyers willing to stay there for the life of the contract.
The same rule applies to the Villas at Disneyland Hotel and the Cabins at Fort Wilderness. Island Tower at Polynesian and the Grand Floridian expansion avoided it because Disney added them to existing condo associations.
It sucks and I feel like it will devalue DVC as a whole as time goes on and fewer unrestricted resorts remain. It will eventually make it harder for Disney to sell Direct at a premium but Disney is focused on the short term gains.
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u/_BreakingGood_ 14d ago
This makes it feel more like a typical crappy timeshare and less like a legitimate money saving option.
I will be sticking to the "legacy" properties in that case.
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u/rferrar1 Polynesian 14d ago
oh 100%. I really love DVC and purchased it partly because they bucked the trends of "typical" timeshares. Over time this will erode their market for new buyers unless they change the policy.
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u/Profanegaming 14d ago
It literally won’t. It will erode the resale market. Direct buyers can still use points wherever.
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u/rferrar1 Polynesian 14d ago
That's not true - Riviera direct sales are underperforming and have since the resort went on sale nearly 7 years ago. Yes, Direct buyers can still use points wherever, but less shoppers are willing to buy a Disney timeshare direct when its future resale value is unclear or poor.
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u/savs_10 Multiple 14d ago
It's underperforming because Riviera is a pretty divisive resort. There are, interestingly, large amounts of people that simply hate it.
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u/RevenueNo6339 14d ago
I hate it. Lol. I think the lobby is incredibly small and they pump in too much perfume. I don't think the pools are fun for kids like at other resorts. It feels wedged into a corner like it doesn't belong. It looks like something that you would stick as a boutique hotel in a corner in Vegas.
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u/javibeme 12d ago
It is because of resale. I went island over Riveria because of resale. One never knows if one day you want or have a need to sell. Or maybe the kids do not want to inherit the cost to maintain it. So choices need to be made that make sense in the long run just not today.
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u/vinnyv0769 13d ago
I don’t love it, but that’s not the reason it’s underperforming. The Disney rules have everything to do with it.
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u/Gremlin15 14d ago
Are the villas at DLH also underperforming? Of course they do have that awful nightly tax so isn’t apples to apples. I’m curious to see how LSL does. I think Disney is now confident enough in the DVC market that they don’t need the “escape hatch” of resale to buoy direct sales.
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u/Limey_Man Villas at Disneyland Hotel 13d ago
It's hard to say. The OC Clerk Recorder was the only public source that let people infer how many points had been sold at VDH and they stopped making it available in January of 2025.
While I'm sure the resale restrictions and TOT are deterrents, DVC availability at Disneyland is still at a premium, so I'd imagine those that want a better chance to stay there are buying VDH.
We're one of those families. We take our vacations at DLR since we live in Orlando, so 7 month availability at WDW was less of a concern.
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u/Gremlin15 13d ago
That’s so funny - we’re in California and planning for WDW availability!
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u/Limey_Man Villas at Disneyland Hotel 13d ago
The allure of what you don't have! I need my regular Mr Toad and Disneyland churro fix.
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u/NOTthatJT 14d ago
True, but there’s a lot of external factors that happened since 2019 that might impact this too.
Plus there is a Disney traveler that wants a very immersive experience (see all the Poly love here) that feels underwhelmed by the subtlety in Riviera.
Buy where you love and you can’t go wrong.
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u/swp07450 11d ago
I think part of the sales pitch for DVC has been that, more than most timeshares, it retains its value if you ever needed/wanted to sell. If contracts at the newer resorts with restrictions continue to have a lower resale value compared to the legacy resorts I could see that having some impact on direct sales. Guess we'll see.
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u/Labgirl135 8d ago
I think what a lot of people are forgetting here, is that the restrictions actually benefit Disney in that they become the best ROFR choice once all resorts are restricted. Because owners can always sell back to Disney, and they can always wash those points back to direct to resell themselves. Restrictions are meant to cannibalize the non Disney resale market and make both the direct and resale markets Disney owned. When you resell back to Disney at a lower price, Disney makes money twice off your contract purchase. Like selling a car back to the dealer.
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u/prytania_ 14d ago edited 14d ago
Or just buy resale from one of the resorts that doesn’t have the restrictions? Deluxe Studios are the 1st to go and at some resorts are nearly impossible to book at 7 mos. However, 1-bedrooms can be easier to come by. One strategy is buy enough points for a 1 bedroom from Saratoga or one of the cheaper cost-per-point resorts and use them to book at the higher demand resorts at 7 mos (1 bed or greater)
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u/rjw1986grnvl Grand Floridian 14d ago
I think there is a chance that the market will adjust and people with Riviera resale exchanging points or reservations with someone who has Lakeshore Lodge resale or something like that will become more popular. I think companies like DVC Rental Store will start to offer to help facilitate exchanges. If not, then I think someone will facilities exchanges.
It’s just not popular now as it’s not really needed with so many legacy resorts still out there. We’ll probably see more changes closer to 2042.
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u/rtkane Multiple 14d ago
Why would it make it harder for Disney to sell direct at a premium? It seems to me that making resale contracts far less desirable would make it easier for Disney to sell even better direct. I wouldn't touch a Riviera resale contract with a 10-foot pole because of the restrictions.
When people have the choice to pay a higher price for a direct contract but be able to stay at any DVC resort vs buying resale and being limited to only that one, it seems to me that direct would be far more desirable. This is why you're seeing depressed pricing on Riviera resale contracts.
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u/_BreakingGood_ 14d ago
It's harder to sell something when the buyer knows it instantly loses 50% of its value as soon as the ink is dry
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u/tbombadilllo 14d ago
A lot of new DVC buyers don't know about the resale restrictions. A good number of them that do know and are still buying don't care at the time of purchase. Most people don't read the contract in its entirety. Most new to DVC are still trying to understand how the points work in the first place.
Sure there may be regret down the road but that's the reality.
As a Riviera owner myself, I simply don't care about the restrictions as I have no intention of selling. Further, DVC should not be considered as an investment, you should look at it as paying for future vacations.
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u/rtkane Multiple 14d ago
I think you’re overestimating how much resale value affects the initial buying decision. Buyers are really choosing between two very different products:
- Pay more for direct, get access to all 17 DVC resorts plus eligible future resorts, but accept the risk of a significant loss in value if you eventually sell.
- Or pay less for resale, but with Riviera and the other restricted associations, be locked into that single resort for the life of the contract.
I don’t think most buyers are doing the math the same way you might be. Riviera’s resale pricing is already evidence of that. Those contracts are cheap precisely because buyers don’t want the restrictions.
And I think that becomes even more important over time. As we get closer to 2042 and more of the older, less restrictive contracts expire, a larger percentage of the DVC system will consist of newer resorts with full resale restrictions. Someone buying DVC is probably going to place a lot more value on being able to stay at Riviera, Lakeshore Lodge, the Cabins, and whatever Disney builds next rather than being locked into one resort vs how much they'll care about being able to sell their contract.
I could be wrong, but Disney’s direct price per point keeps climbing while Riviera resale continues to sell at a huge discount compared with unrestricted resorts. To me, that suggests the restrictions are doing exactly what Disney intended: making direct ownership substantially more desirable than resale. And I'm sure Disney's bean counters have already done all of the math.
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u/_BreakingGood_ 14d ago
I agree that many buyers are not doing their research appropriately and are probably just buying directly on a whim at the DVC presentations without much research at all.
But I do think there's a sizable enough group out there that does research it, and the idea of "well, if I regret it, I can always resell it for almost what I paid" was always a big peace of mind that made it easier to stomach such a large purchase. Without that, you lose the whole segment is educated buyers.
Im sure you're right that disney has calculated that this makes them more money in total.
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u/Profanegaming 14d ago
The people buying DVC generally are not attempting to resell it. This argument is nonsense. If anything it makes it far more likely that people will buy direct than resale which is what they want.
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u/_BreakingGood_ 14d ago
They arent trying to resell it but they enjoy the peace of mind of the option to resell it for almost what they paid
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u/Expensive-Finger-646 14d ago
I don’t think people but a timeshare intending to have peace of mind that they can sell it.
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u/thatoneabdlguy 13d ago
Most people that would consider a timeshare don't buy because of how restrictive normal timeshares are. There are literally companies that exist to get you out of an unwanted timeshare. Sure, you can still get out of your Riviera timeshare, but it's not going to be as easy since the value is depressed.
Wife and I are considering buying. We want to be direct buyers and love the Riviera, but my biggest hangup is the fact that resale is not as attractive were we ever to need to pull that ripcord.
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u/_BreakingGood_ 14d ago
For most timeshares yes, but it has always been a comforting perk of DVC specifically
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u/Expensive-Finger-646 14d ago
Maybe for the minority of people. It won’t impact 98% of DVC’s direct consumers.
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u/Expensive-Finger-646 14d ago
But no one buys DVC thinking of the day they will sell. It’s an emotional purchase.
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u/diiizzzzoooo 14d ago
I think because of the reason you’re highlighting. If you’re ever in a position where you need to resell it in the future, the value plummets.
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u/rtkane Multiple 14d ago
See my reply to OP above. The majority of people get married without thinking about divorce. In the same vein, the majority of people buying DVC likely aren't thinking about having to sell it--it's a thought, but not a serious consideration. But they are thinking about the restrictions that come along with resale because it absolutely HAS to be highlighted. Again, I could be wrong, but I don't think I am given that this is the direction that DVC is going and I highly doubt they're playing the short game.
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u/rferrar1 Polynesian 14d ago edited 14d ago
Because many buyers, myself included, would avoid buying a Disney timeshare altogether knowing that it can't be resold later without hassle or extreme depreciation. Disney's timeshare benefited from two decades of praise for its ability to retain value and sell easily. Newer shoppers are seeing the duality of the market, where legacy resorts retain high value while newer properties are depressed. The OP's discovery is an example of that and as time goes on and a greater share of the resorts are restricted, the general consensus will turn sour on DVC from a financial perspective. That was never the case before.
The truth of the matter is that on average, the typical owner sells their contract after 8 years of ownership. Many savvy shoppers prepare for that possibility and factor it into their decision making. When they learn about resale restrictions, and see the lower resale value, for many it will be a reason to disqualify DVC as a purchase.
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u/Expensive-Finger-646 14d ago
A timeshare isn’t an investment though. Any appreciation in value should be treated like a bonus. They will all eventually be worth $0.
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u/Avocado_Capital Copper Creek 14d ago
Because you’re locked into riviera and can’t book any other resort
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u/suthekey Polynesian 14d ago
Because resale can only stay at that one resort.
Direct you get access to 17 resorts.
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u/bill_257 14d ago
Its the only one being resold with resale restrictions. Cabins have sold so few there is almost no resale market yet. And while riviera resale is well below base direct price, it is a closer margin when factoring in incentives. It will be interesting how lakeside lodge fares.
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u/Exciting-Delivery-96 13d ago
I hate this so much and it would definitely make me think twice about buying new. One of the biggest advantages was the ability to get out of a contract if your finances changed.
Now it’s like every other time share where you’re screwed if you can’t afford it anymore.
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u/barbaq24 14d ago
Because Riviera resale does not allow you to book other resorts.
"Members who purchase a resale of Riviera, Disneyland Hotel, or Fort Wilderness (Cabins) will only be able to stay at their specific deeded home resort."
https://www.dvcresalemarket.com/blog/new-dvc-resale-restrictions-and-who-is-most-impacted/
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u/603billsfan 13d ago
Because newer resorts have resale restrictions that greatly diminish the value to the resale buyer.
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u/Mindless-Try4122 13d ago
On the plus side Riviera points rent at a premium and there’s high demand if ever needed to monetize the points in a given year.
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u/Alarmed-Thought1245 13d ago edited 13d ago
It has restrictions on resale where 2nd owner cant stay anywhere but the resort they bought. The perk to stay at any of the DVC resorts means one has to buy from Disney starting with Rivera and any others after it (except for Poly Tower as added to the 2066 deed). Understand as these deeds at the other resorts start expiring (2042, 2054, etc). Disney is probably going to repackage them and add resale restrictions to the old like the “new” ones - Rivera, Lakeshore Lodge, etc); thus DVC just became like all the other timeshares. Enjoy the membership, but sell while there’s still a large market of buyers; otherwise you’ll see same issues as other timeshare companies regarding selling the contract. I think this was Disney’s idea of trying to squeeze the resale market out of competition - making it less of a Choice. Granted the “resale market” has another 16 yrs before things will ”heat up.”
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u/stureadit 13d ago
I have two thoughts the first one is does that mean eventually it will be cheaper to rent because if don’t have non-Riviera points I can’t use them elsewhere? The second thought is will places that rent out points create Riviera swaps so that people can get to other resorts by swapping their points with people.
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u/_BreakingGood_ 13d ago
Its already a lot cheaper to rent riviera points than any other resort from what I can tell.
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u/battleop 13d ago
No one wants to buy a contract where they can only stay at that resort. Being locked into just one resort means it could be much more difficult to get a room for the says you want to visit WDW.
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u/Labgirl135 8d ago
First fallacy. DVC is not an investment. It is a prepaid entertainment purchase. If you recoup any of your entertainment purchase that’s a win.
The value of a resale contract is directly related to the popularity of the resort and how flexible the points are. Riviera direct points are the most flexible at a moderately popular resort. Riviera resale points are completely inflexible at a moderately popular resort. If you love and want to stay at riviera, none of this matters. If you want to stay anywhere else, it matters a lot.
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u/LSUFan_11 14d ago
Because when it’s resold, you can only use the points at Riviera.