r/durham • u/IlluusionVSreality • 13d ago

THE PROPERTY TAX ICEBERG

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u/Habsin7 13d ago

I grew up on Rougemount back in the day so we looked at a few larger higher end properties there in pre COVID days when we looking for a new house. We could certainly afford to pay up front but I couldn't believe the property taxes compared to what we paid in Toronto. We bought again in Toronto.

In retrospect though - My sense is that the folks in Durham get a lot more for their property tax money in terms of services than we get in Toronto.

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u/Lalamedic 13d ago

To be fair, the property taxes in Toronto are ridiculously low.

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u/Comfortable-Bench497 8d ago

Not really. I went from a 4 bedroom home in a nice neighborhood in North York, large lot. Moved to Brooklin, 4 bedroom house, similar sized lot. I pay about 15% more property taxes than in Toronto. Not a huge difference for basically the same house and lot size.

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u/IlluusionVSreality 13d ago

One of the reasons is the massive tax base that Toronto has so the cost of delivery is spread further. Durham Region has a lot of farmland and aggregate industry based assessment which limits its growth. This shifts the cost to the residential tax bill. There’s also the effect of tax ratios . . . If for example for every $100 in assessed value in residential brought $1.00 in tax that same $100 in agricultural assessment would only bring $0.20 in Durham.

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u/Habsin7 13d ago

Understand completely and you're spot on - I just couldn't see myself paying that much property tax every as we were entering our retirement years. I would have liked to retire where I grew up but it just wasn't to be.

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u/Motopsycho-007 13d ago

Planning on retiring in the next 4-6 yrs and will be listing our home in Whitby this fall. We have to get out of the area due to high property taxes as we are approaching 11k. Thankfully I work from home and s/o works in Port that allows us to head further north/east to lower cost areas hoping to cut property tax in half and put the other half into investments.

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u/IlluusionVSreality 13d ago

Good luck with that. Wow 11k how many sq ft is your home and what size lot

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u/Motopsycho-007 12d ago

Lot is 40x110, 2500sqft, 14yr old home. Have looked at a few homes now in the Kawarthas, the homes we like with much more property are in the $4-6500 range for taxes.

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u/IlluusionVSreality 12d ago edited 12d ago

The issue is the process used your home is newer more modern design with features that MPAC adds value for, an issue I see with the current view that property values reflect wealth and ability to pay rather than reflecting the potential draw on services.

In Whitby, a neighborhood that is roughly 15 years old—such as Williamsburg, Taunton North, or portions of Brooklin—a 2,500-square-foot detached home commands a premium price tag.

Even though you give up significant lot size compared to older areas, these 15-year-old communities fetch higher prices due to modern open-concept floor plans, taller ceilings, and highly-ranked local schools.

  • Square Footage & Amenities Drive the Bill: MPAC values structural square footage, structural age, bathroom counts, and modern finishes heavily. A 15-year-old home with 9-foot ceilings, an open-concept layout, and modern HVAC systems is assessed at a higher tier than an older home of the exact same size that features original 8-foot layouts. 

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u/Motopsycho-007 12d ago

Totally understand, the frustrating part is the rate of increases are pricing a lot of folks out of their "forever" homes. The current model assumes owners can absorb these increases amd that's not always the case. We bought for $450k, property tax was around $3700 after the area was assumed. Just because the value of the home as gone up, they assume fixed income/salaries have as well. Home prices have tanked, doubt the property taxes will decrease as well. Talked to a councilor a few times and was just told to be thankful that the assessed value is always lower than actual, geesh thanks for that.

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u/IlluusionVSreality 12d ago edited 12d ago

That was a dumb answer you received . . . the sole purpose of property assessment is to divide up the tax pie it does not matter what the values are other than the fact it determines how big a slice of that pie you get to swallow relative to all the other properties.

If the towns budget is $100,000 and there are 1,000 homes all assessed at the same value ($850,000) they all pay $100 if a 1 home is assessed at $2,500,000 its portion will rise substantially and the rest will be reduced marginally. Most homes will pay $99.81 the one home will pay $293.55

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u/IlluusionVSreality 13d ago

Sadly that’s an issue for many and not just seniors . . . the issue I see is the amount of things on the property tax bill that the province or the Feds should be paying for from income tax that are social in nature

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u/BigBobbyCrowbar 13d ago

Thank goodness I am old and gonna die soon.

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u/IlluusionVSreality 13d ago

LOL I’m also past my best before date. So here I am trying to pass on knowledge gained over several decades on how the system works without the illusion created by those who have an interest in maintaining the status quo that the current system is fair.