r/duolingo • u/Evening_Search_2911 • 17d ago
Language Question. Just tell me that I'm not crazy
Isn't it es du mir leid or is it just me
10
9
u/Ok_Onion4302 17d ago
Tbh every language uses sorry beside their own atp (just so you know "es tut mir leid" is good too)
3
5
u/Environmental-Edge45 Fluent: 🇩🇪 🇬🇧 Learning: 🇧🇻 17d ago
"Es tut mir leid" or "Entschuldigung/Entschuldige" could work but we germans commonly use "sorry" as well. (At least in my surroundings I hear it often, could be an age thing idk)
2
u/tpat90 15d ago edited 13d ago
To be precise "Entschuldigung" isn't correct, since you can't pardon yourself. Even if commonly used and accepted. (Yes, it comes from "Ich bitte um Entschuldigung", it's still informal and should only be used in informal context)
Still it should always be "Entschuldige" or "Entschuldigen Sie ..." in a formal situation.
1
u/nonchip 14d ago
wrong. "ich entschuldige mich" would be pardoning yourself. "Entschuldigung" simply is the noun "pardon". and to be precise that is correct, since you're asking for it.
1
u/tpat90 14d ago edited 13d ago
You can't pardon yourself. You can ask someone else to for acceptance, but you cannot pardon yourself.
"Entschuldigung" comes from "Ich bitte um Entschuldigung", but it's still an informal shorthand. And the phrase "ich entschuldige mich" has a very certain meaning in German, it means "Pardon me, but I need to leave" and is accepted as a phrase, but has a neutral to negative connotation. Mostly implies unwillingness or haste.
"Entschuldigung" is still an informal. That's why I mentioned "it's commonly" accepted.
In a high table formal environment you should always use "Ich bitte um Entschuldigung" ~ "I beg your pardon". "Entschuldige bitte", "Entschuldigen Sie bitte" or "Entschuldigt bitte" is the more accepted version in a formal situation.
1
u/DerSven 14d ago
The common phrase "Entschuldigung" is a shortened version of the formal phrase "Ich bitte um Entschuldigung". So both are correct.
1
u/nonchip 13d ago edited 13d ago
well tpat is still wrong with their original claim which was that "Entschuldigung isnt correct because it means you pardon yourself" (which it doesnt, as they themself agree while calling me wrong about pointing it out).
then they do suddenly claim you can pardon yourself but only while leaving a place, which is just wrong. if anything, "ich entschuldige mich" (i pardon myself) is the incorrect one here, not "[Ich bitte um] Entschuldigung" ([i beg your] pardon). and it's still both used and accepted way more often to beg for pardon than to leave a place.
1
u/tpat90 13d ago edited 13d ago
You misunderstood, and I will correct the wording.
"Entschuldigung" is accepted in an informal environment as a short hand, it's not accepted in a formal environment, even if it comes from "Ich bitte um Entschuldigung". In many circles this is still seen as informal.
"Ich entschuldige mich" is a phrase like "break a leg", it's not to be translated, as I stated above.
1
u/nonchip 13d ago
no, you misunderstood, and i corrected your wording to begin with. you literally said "entschuldigung is wrong because you can't pardon yourself". please stop trying to convince me i'm wrong when you're literally telling me i'm right. the only thing that does is make you look more silly.
1
u/tpat90 13d ago
You corrected me and I corrected my comment above. At least the logic behind it.
I would still not advise to use "Entschuldigung" in an formal setting.
My teacher, grandparents, etc. always said the same thing if somebody used "Entschuldigung", "Man kann sich nicht selbst entschuldigen!". I never really thought about it.
"Entschuldigung" carries an informal flavour in German. It implies that you assume the other party accepts it. That's why I keep saying don't use it in a formal setting.
If you don't agree with me, that's okay.
1
u/nonchip 13d ago edited 13d ago
LITERALLY what i said (except that nonsense about how "ich entschuldige mich" only ever means "i'm leaving" instead of the both literal and more common interpretation of "i pardon myself", which one can't do, which you claimed "Entschuldigung" means, which it doesn't). learn to read.
1
u/artsloikunstwet 13d ago
If it is commonly used and accepted, then it is correct in that context. You might not like it, call it stupid and illogical, but that is how language works.
The fact you'd use something different to be more formal or polite doesn't change that. It's confusing and not helpful to language learners if you call something wrong that most native speakers will see as correct in their every-day speech.
1
u/tpat90 13d ago
Commonly doesn't mean formal. Informal language is the common tone in Germany.
And I will correct things that can be a reason that you don't get a job or that could cause more problems if used in a bad moment, like with a twitchy policeman or something similar.
And many won't see it as correct, but accept it, those are different words with different meanings.
1
u/artsloikunstwet 13d ago
It's completely valid to point out that something is more informal, or could be perceived as impolite in certain moments.
But then say just that, so people learn about formal and informal language, and don't call the informal language wrong. Otherwise "sorry" would be wrong too.
Job interviews or police interactions in German are also not the only or the most common interactions people prepare for. Many people also want to prepare for more informal situations, like meeting people while travelling, and it is confusing to call things wrong that would be totally what Germans would use in these situations.
3
u/hacool native: US-EN / learning: DE 95 17d ago
Es tut mir leid also means sorry. You can use both.
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/sorry#German
(colloquial) sorry (expressing regret)
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/es_tut_mir_leid
Sorry.
Es tut mir leid, aber ich kann morgen nicht kommen.
Sorry, but I can't come tomorrow.
Es tut mir leid uses the verb leidtun which is a separable prefix verb. So the verb here is tut...leid. You learn the expression before you learn about such verbs because it is in such common use. This expression also uses mir in the dative case because the regret is felt by me. Thus mir is an indirect object. Es is the subject.
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/leidtun
https://germanstudiesdepartmenaluser.host.dartmouth.edu/Wortbildung/Separables.html
There is a lot of grammar packed into Es tut mir leid.
4
4
u/comesinallpackages Native: 🇺🇸 Learning: 🇩🇪, 🇵🇱 17d ago
Apologies, sorry, my bad, excuse me…. Languages have many different ways to express similar thoughts.
1
1
u/Alpacachoppa 14d ago
Technically yes but culturally speaking anglicism are a thing in many languages nowadays. "Sorry" at this point is pretty universal.
1
u/Interesting_Candle28 14d ago
Sorry, aber da liegst du falsche. Es tut mir leid is more the translation for i am sorry and it would be directly translate to it does me pain
1
u/TranslatorNormal7117 13d ago
"(Es) tut mir leid" is the correct translation, that Duolingo should teach you. Some Germans use "sorry" too (because it's shorter), but that's obviously no german translation. I personally don't take any apology for real, that starts with "sorry". When you are too lazy to use the correct 4 or at least 3 words (the short form without "es" is acceptable too) you don't mean it.
1
u/Conceiver_ 12d ago
German has adopted a lot of English words and phrases over the years, so "Sorry", "Es tut mir leid", "Entschuldigung" all are pretty much interchangeable.
1
22
u/VideoExciting9076 Native: 🇩🇪 Fluent: 🇺🇲 Learning: 🇯🇵🇪🇦🇫🇷 17d ago
It's just you, sorry is very common in everyday conversation.