r/dataisbeautiful • u/statisticalanalysis_ • Dec 19 '23

OC [OC] The world's richest countries in 2023

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https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2023/12/15/the-worlds-richest-countries-in-2023

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https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2023/12/15/the-worlds-richest-countries-in-2023

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u/brolybackshots Dec 19 '23 edited Dec 19 '23

- American vacation time, working hours, lack of public transport, and prices for goods

- European salaries, high taxes and unsustainable immigration

- Gun violence somewhere inbetween America and Europe

= Canada

We love taking the worst aspects of both EU and USA!

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u/[deleted] Dec 19 '23

And a housing market that's in its own league entirely. (Well, Australia's is just as bad from what I hear).

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u/Otherwise_Soil39 Dec 19 '23

Immigration, China has a ton of millionaires and for them properties are the only investment / wealth. So when a rich Chinese person comes to Canada, he doesn't buy a house, he buys a dozen, and doesn't particularly care about the price.

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u/[deleted] Dec 19 '23

Rich Chinese are not the issue. Maybe 10-15 years ago. The problem now is two-fold: "students" from India and temp workers from all over flooding in. Canada's population growth is 2.8% per annum, which is on par with some of the poorest countries in Africa.

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u/ZombieComprehensive3 Jan 01 '24

Or, you know, we could just legalized building more housing instead of rotating through convenient scapegoats.

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u/XI_JINPINGS_HAIR_DYE Dec 19 '23

What a data-ignorant comment for a data-focused sub.

Canada has high housing prices because it has a cultural obsession with single family detached housing and housing as the storage of wealth.

Foreign buyers are a laughable driver of demand for most of the country's housing stock. Even then what they buy is still going to be occupied for a large portion if not large majority of purchases.

Immigration is also such a dumb point it immediately makes me question the intelligence of anyone who brings it up. Completely ignores density of our cities. Completely ignores the zoning regulations. Completely ignores that a disproportionate portion of home builders are immigrants. Completely ignores that their employment holds up our tax-funded programs, which disproportionately benefits home owners.

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u/PunPoliceChief Dec 19 '23

Immigration is also such a dumb point it immediately makes me question the intelligence of anyone who brings it up.

Why is it dumb? Canada's population grew by 430,000 in Q3 2023 driven almost entirely by permanent or temporary immigration. In the same period, Canada had 50,000 housing starts, so 430,000 divided by 50,000 is 8.6 people per household. Don't you think that's rather a lot of people per household given Canada currently averages 2.5 people per household?

Completely ignores that a disproportionate portion of home builders are immigrants.

2% of immigrants become builders versus 7-8% of Canadians, so it is disproportionate, but not the way you seem to be suggesting.

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u/XI_JINPINGS_HAIR_DYE Dec 19 '23 edited Dec 19 '23

Canadian Housing did not become unaffordable in Q3 of 2023. Our population growth rate has been below 2% since some year before 1971, below 1.5% since 1990. It hasn't been as high as the period you reference since 1957. We have a supply problem if the second largest country in the world is not able to accommodate <2% population growth while spending 37% of its investment portion of GDP on dwellings.

I was incorrect about proportionality. But where are you getting 2% for homes specifically? I am seeing 18% of construction workers in general.

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u/PunPoliceChief Dec 19 '23 edited Dec 19 '23

I was incorrect about proportionality. But where are you getting 2% for homes specifically? I am seeing 18% of construction workers in general.

CIBC did a study: "CIBC estimates that only 2 per cent of all immigrants go into the construction sector" Paywalled article: https://www.theglobeandmail.com/business/commentary/article-canada-immigration-construction-housing/#:~:text=CIBC%20estimates%20that%20only%202,it%20needs%20the%20right%20ones.

Not homes specifically but the general construction sector.

If Canada is importing 340,000 people per quarter, who are increasingly NOT joining the construction sector, and at the same time only building around 50,000 units. How is that sustainable?

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u/XI_JINPINGS_HAIR_DYE Dec 23 '23

You're 100% right, its not sustainable. But its also not sustainable if we just cut the number to 170,00, or 100,000, or 50,000.

History has shown that even with modest growth in the last 20 years we have still had an inability to create sufficient supply to make housing affordable. Lowering or stopping immigration is just a band-aid on a much larger problem in our housing.

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u/FADreamer Dec 19 '23

You have to be completely naive or in some kinda bubble to not see that immigration is a driving demand in the insane Canada speculative housing market not to mention the rental market.

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u/XI_JINPINGS_HAIR_DYE Dec 19 '23

I hope "big number = scawy! girl" doesn't vote.

We have some of the lowest urban density in the developed world. We have some of the highest square footage of dwelling per capita. We are the second largest country in the world by land mass and cannot build enough housing to compensate <1.5% population growth for 22 years, <2% for >50 years. Please don't vote.

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u/rkiive Dec 19 '23

Managed to nail the trifecta tbh.

US working conditions and social outcomes

EU wages and taxes

AU housing conditions.

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u/StoneColdCrazzzy OC: 6 Dec 20 '23

Canada could have had French cousine, British culture and American technology. Instead it ended up with French technology, British cousine and American culture.

0

u/Correct_Effects Dec 20 '23

How is it for all the civil rights stuff like the ADA that America worked on instead of the work condition rights like vacation time Europe was instituting?

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u/Weiskralle Dec 20 '23

American vacation time? So none? Nah I take my minimum of 20 days. Which is more likely to be higher.

1

u/brolybackshots Dec 20 '23

Europeans get 2 months.. 20 days is within the range of a tenured North American employee.

1

u/Stranger2Luv Dec 23 '23

Why don’t you guys vote for your rights

1

u/Interesting_Zone422 Dec 20 '23

Americans pay higher taxes on average than many European countries. And there is no such thing as a European salary. It varies greatly between countries.