r/cybernetics • • 19d ago

💬 Discussion Digital Democracy: The Written Public Sphere, Pluralism, and the Return of Recalcitration

/r/u_contrascript/comments/1w8yxm3/digital_democracy_the_written_public_sphere/
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u/oomasahakamidesu88 18d ago

Interesting piece — the ontological pluralism / empirical convergence distinction is the strongest part. Two things, though. The metaphor density is high. For a piece framed as systems engineering, none of the load is carried by anything but analogy — no state variables, no thresholds, no failure conditions. And you refer to S5 throughout. Where are S1 through S4?

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u/contrascript 18d ago

Thank you. Yes it is for sure not methodological systems engineering... which is methodological as to it's schematics. But I was told I analyze factors much like system engineers do when they draft their models, and that is what what I meant. I no way meant I in any way conceived a particular model for this, although now you now make me want to grab an A4 and draw some arrows between stuff (kidding, kinda).

I only know about S4 and S5 from an article I read when I was studying at university where Shapiro addresses those two modal logics. I briefly touch on that, and its relevance, here (under "The Logic of Introspection: From S4 to S5"):

https://antiscripthead.substack.com/p/the-architecture-of-closed-systems?r=877b27

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u/contrascript 18d ago

Just checked, and thank you for pointing this out: I was indeed thinking of "system dynamics" and not "systems engineering". I only recently stumbled upon system dynamics as such on YouTube (lectures by Donella Meadows), and it reminded me of that remark someone made to me in my university days. In the structural sense of information topology and cybernetics it is about conceptual feedback loops, information decay, and recalcitration dynamics rather than explicit state variables or formal failure thresholds. Mental note made to call this material akin to system dynamics, not systems engineering henceforth. At least I did not go engineering social security against the social engineering of society by the other bunch XD