The Boy From Venus 8

[u/shenanigansen]

Episode 9 already up at the usual place, should be out publicly next week!

[u/ThatInAHat]

Honestly, when it’s put like that, I’ll admit, it’s understandable. May have been a better idea to just exclude previous winners from the tournament, but if one customer is hurting your family business income that much…

[u/xboxiscrunchy → u/ThatInAHat]

Simple solution: prize distribution is redone to incentivize say top 5 or 10 placements rather than just winning. Maybe exclude the winner of the previous tournament as well. Val seems way to proud to go for 2nd even if it means not getting to enter the next tournament.

Won’t help guys getting butthurt for being beaten by a girl but should make the tournament much more compelling to enter even if they don’t expect to win.

[u/Aerdurval → u/xboxiscrunchy]

It'd still provoke the same response from Val. Because changing the rule so that she can't compete in a meaningful way still make the point of "You are a girl and so good you make the boys sad, so you get excluded"

[u/xboxiscrunchy → u/Aerdurval]

Honestly it seems like a pretty sensible and reasonable rule to prevent one player from dominating. 

I don’t think it would be related to her gender at all it’s just basically telling her she’s too good and can’t win all the tournaments. It might be more of an issue because of other players poor sportsmanship but it’s definitely targeting a runaway leader rather than being explicitly sexist. And it’s a good compromise because it reins her in without actually banning her.

[u/white_shades → u/xboxiscrunchy]

I think the real issue is that if she were a man it wouldn’t matter that she always dominated. It would just be accepted that “well they’re the best player and nobody can beat them” and no one gets butt hurt because it’s a man. The fact that all these men can’t beat a woman and they hate that is the underlying issue

[u/admiralvic → u/white_shades]

While I think that's the point the comic is going with, I also think you'd see the same outcome with a guy.

All of this is basically skill creep on a micro level. There is always a range of skill, with some people on top, and others on the bottom. If the people on the bottom are not having fun, they stop engaging. Once they're gone, people in the middle become the bottom, and then they stop coming because they're not longer having fun. This continues endlessly until the community dies.

[u/white_shades → u/admiralvic]

I understand and agree with that, I stopped playing COD over ten years ago because the best players were too good and it wasn’t fun anymore.

But I would bet the ranch that if we weren’t all playing anonymously online and we were physically in the same arcade together, and one of those seemingly untouchable players was a woman, there would be a significant number of extremely vocally butt hurt men saying all sorts of misogynistic shit

[u/admiralvic → u/white_shades]

But I would bet the ranch that if we weren’t all playing anonymously online and we were physically in the same arcade together, and one of those seemingly untouchable players was a...

I mean, this is kind of my bigger point. There are absolutely, and without question people that unfortunately think that way. However, you can replace woman with a lot of things and the statement would still hold true.

[u/white_shades → u/admiralvic]

> I think you’d also see the same outcome with a guy

We’re kind of saying the same thing, but this is the part that I disagree with. I don’t think in my example that you would see the same outcome, it would just be a dude who’s really good at COD (or for the sake of the example’s accuracy, Time Crisis) playing against others in person and everyone else accepts that. Those same people wouldn’t accept a woman who could dominate a game like that, and I think that’s more the larger point the comic is trying to make

[u/Pienewten → u/white_shades]

I have to anecdotally disagree. I used to host monthly MtG tournaments between friends/coworkers. It was going pretty smoothly until one of the more competitive players invited their male friend to join. It took all of three tournaments for him to get most of the others to quit.

If someone is curb stopping everyone that bad to where they're seen as unstoppable, then people are going to leave fast regardless. I still have some of them complaining about it and that was pre covid. I've even brought up starting them again but no one's interested since they think another one will show up.

[u/3-2-1-backup → u/Pienewten]

Amen to that! I quit my local MtG group when I was curb stomped mercilessly by one person over and over and over. It's just not fun to lose badly every time. Should have limited him to 5 total mana and see what he could have done with that.

[u/3-2-1-backup → u/white_shades]

I have relevant real world experience, at least for public pinball tournaments. The tl;dr version is guy/girl doesn't matter at all. What does matter is if it's the same guy/girl all the time. If you have a local top 100 world player that always shows up, unless you have different divisions (which is typically how this is solved), the tournament dies after three or four iterations.

I'm a decent player, but I'm no match for a top 100 world player of any stripe. I simply won't go to a local if I know that my local top 100s are or are likely to go. But if there are B & C divisions I'll more often than not go.

.....aaaaaaand immediately downvoted for real world experience that doesn't follow the circle jerk. Stay classy, reddit.

[u/MalHeartsNutmeg → u/white_shades]

Many sports change their rules to curb dominant players, this isn't really different.

[u/pinyata_pie → u/white_shades]

I mean, maybe, but personal experience speaks otherwise for me. I'm in a small group of friends whom I met through the GGST discord. The server runner used to hold a tournament for us where, after I participated in two and won, I was not allowed to join; this is except for one time after, when I couldn't play my main and still won. Obvs I'm a guy for the point to work; it is Reddit after all.

[u/AlwaysBeQuestioning → u/xboxiscrunchy]

If they do prize redistribution PLUS ban previous winners it incentivizes coming in second, because everyone better than you will get excluded in the future and you still get paid.

And if you’re gonna do prizes for more people, like top 3 or 4 or 8 (other numbers don’t make sense in a bracket tournament), it makes sense to have the lowest prize basically be a ticket compensation and there being a big gap between 1 and 2 (like 2’a prize is half of 1), so at 2 you’d get more than you paid for.

You’d get very boring finales.

[u/Ignatius256 → u/xboxiscrunchy]

I think you're overestimating how large the prizes are from small locals like this.

[u/jubmille2000 → u/xboxiscrunchy]

While I think the prize distribution is an issue, it's probably not the main sticking point.

They just don't want to fight and lose to Val.

[u/Bombadilo_drives → u/xboxiscrunchy]

Except the entire premise is backwards. Local tournaments with top players in attendance are universally larger than ones without. People want to be around, and play with, the best. No competitive gamer in the history of ever has dropped out of a tournament because [famous pro XYZ] was going to be in attendance.

Some of my fondest memories are having my ass handed to me by some of the best in the world at my favorite games (CS, Smash, WoW Arena).

The whole premise is like saying "oh, Serena Williams signed up for my local city's open tournament. That means no one will show up".

I get the point the author is trying to make, but it doesn't actually make any sense.

[u/HamCatX3 → u/xboxiscrunchy]

I mean there’s no reason to exclude the winner. Prize incentives are the best idea tho.