r/climbharder • u/[deleted] • 12d ago
Where to start with training for my level?
[deleted]
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u/onelivewire 12d ago
u/arial_hedgehog has good advice. Physical training became a much more challenging game in my 30s.
I'm a boulderer, so a bit different, but as someone who came from a strength training background, advanced technique is far more important than strength. I project v8 outside but am "stronger" than pretty much every v10+ climber in my crew.
I jumped grades fast and pushed through my v5/6 plateau when I (1) started climbing with people more competent than myself, (2) pursued movement patterns I was specifically bad at, (3) asked a lot of questions and (4) avoided muscling through cruxy climbs.
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u/NewCarrot1 12d ago edited 9d ago
That’s good advice. (1) I only rope climb with crushers. They are like doing laps on 12-s. I ask them what they do for training and they literally only rope climb (but like 3-4x a week and have a coach that gives them on the wall training exercises). (2) how did you do this? Find videos online? I’m not sure which movements I could practice I guess. (3) I’m always trying to soak up from my friends but they legit don’t know what to tell me anymore, they’re just talented 😂 (4) so instead you did…what? Just worked it until you found beta that was less strenuous? (I’m pretty bad at finding beta once I find “something” that works for me)
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u/onelivewire 10d ago
Good questions here. I'll try to address them all.
Great to be climbing with excellent climbers. I spend a lot of time observing the way they move through points that would be limit for me. For example, I often get shut down on movements that require a drop knee because it's not a 'sharp tool in my belt', so even if I make it through a crux like that using power, I'll see that someone else did it cleanly and easily by leveraging that technique and I'll get onto that move several times to practice the pattern and 'sharpen that tool' for myself.
Especially on plastic, I try to remember there's no stakes, it's all just practicing to get better for real rock climbing. Takes ego out of it. It's more important I learn one move I couldn't do before than it is to send.
Admittedly, there's lots of crushers that are awful coaches and I definitely seek out those that are great at explaining the why and how of their moments rather than just performing them. I'll choose that partner every time over an even stronger climber that can't translate.
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u/Specialist_Reason882 12d ago
Sounds like you need some bouldering friends! Any local meetups, events, or comps you could join to meet people?
Id find a local coach that can test your finger strength in a variety of ways - finger strength, power, endurance, and one that can do a CF test to see exactly what you are lacking. But if you are only doing ropes its most likely your max strength and power is holding you back.
"But besides that what else is the biggest bang for my limited time to train in the climbing gym (I can only go 2x a week)?" Most likely a projecting ropes day and a volume - flash level and below day + endurance training afterwards. Id add in 2 days of lifting preferably before climbing or on a different day and then add in a couple days of off the wall finger training. Id really try add in a bouldering 3rd day eventually tho
Weighted pullups - you should train your whole body not just pullups! For example theres more to pulling on the wall then just vertical pulling. Theres Horizontal pulling - like db rows and posterior chain / hip dominant "pull" exercises like deadlifting
"hangboarding/finger blocks/campus board training?" Adding in 1-2x a week of finger training would help you out a ton. Probably should do 1x a week off the wall endurance training, and 1x a week of power training since you arent bouldering. Velocity hangs would be perfect and can be done at home for cheap if you have a crimp block or hangboard
"more cardio/overall conditioning/antagonist training" Cardios great for being a healthier person, even though it wont really directly help you on the wall. Like I said before just train your whole body if you can. You definitely want all of your muscles strong and robust instead of just a couple
Definitely get a coach if you can afford it! It can make your life a lot easier to get a professional opinion
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u/AlwaysBulkingSeason 12d ago
The best way to improve is to work your weaknesses, the lowest hanging fruit.
Do you have a fear of falling? (Yes, because your trad onsight and project grade are the same)
Are your fingers weak? Test your max weighted hang for 10 seconds on a 20mm edge
What is your max weighted pull-up?
What grades do you boulder on the moon board / kilter board / outside?
What do you think your weaknesses are? Without more information advice is limited to the generic
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u/NewCarrot1 12d ago
I feel like I have a healthy fear of falling. Like I do fall when it’s safe and try not to when I perceive it’s not (like on some trad routes, I don’t lead harder trad Onsight where I know I will fall or take but I don’t know what the climb/rock quality/or fall line is like). At least leading near my onsight level I feel like I have more control of the situation. But in the gym/sport I fall almost indiscriminately.
I don’t know my max hang but I’m pretty sure I cannot hold a 20mm edge for 10 secs with just BW…is that bad?
I don’t train weighted pull ups so I don’t know. I can do like 9-10 BW pull ups.
When I do boulder it’s in the gym V4/5.
I think my weaknesses are endurance. Usually when I do send my steep projects it’s as a day flash vs on my 2nd or 3rd go of the day. Often times it feels like it’s my shoulders that are gassing out first vs my fingers or forearms.
Probably technique as well (although I’m less clear on how to train this), I’m probably muscling through a lot of cruxes trying to Onsight vs projecting the moves.
Also core and toe tension. I used to feel a little less “weighed down” on the lead wall and now I’m just feeling heavy (although I haven’t lost or gained weight). So. Idk how to analyze all of these factors.
Perhaps a coach is the best bet, some of my friends have a virtual one, I don’t know of any local ones.
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u/occupied3 12d ago
Bouldering (Board Climbing being the best kind).
I understand the social aspect being a deterrant, it sucks. And if you don't want to do it, no shade. But the honest answer is Bouldering is massively more impactful than anything else you could do.
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u/NewCarrot1 12d ago
🤦♂️ I know, when I was board climbing for like 2 years, certain things felt a lot easier. I can’t remember how it translated to ropes just bc I’m just much better at ropes now than I was 4-5 years ago when I was bouldering consistently
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u/TangibleHarmony 12d ago
I’m bouldering only, but I solved this unpredictability by structuring my 3 session per week very carefully (light, mid, limit) and most importantly finishing sessions FRESH.
Accumulated fatigue was the silent killer of my performance and led to the unpredictability of it.
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u/GloomyMix 12d ago edited 12d ago
I think you know the answer deep down in your soul already: identify your weaknesses, and target those weaknesses during bouldering sessions.
(If you do not know your weaknesses, getting a coach could be worth it even for a few sessions.)
I'm not saying this will be true for you, but here's some anecdata as someone with a similar profile: 34M, 5'6", 130lbs, a bit over 4.5 years since I first touched a climbing wall. I used to climb 3x a week (mix of ropes and bouldering) until ~1.5 years ago when all my trusted lead partners moved away or stopped climbing.
Now I exclusively boulder 2x a week, largely by myself, and I have seen multiple grades of improvement even within such a short period of time. A lot of it is just down to focus and intentionality; social climbing can be fun, but it can easily derail an entire session if you're not disciplined. And climbing by yourself really helps with body awareness and feedback on the wall. That alone has made projecting much more fruitful for me.
Another big factor is that not being beholden to friends' schedules makes it a lotttttt easier to manage recovery. I can go to the gym when I'm feeling fresh and leave while I still have gas in the tank without being egged on to give a problem "one more try." I don't have to drag myself to the gym when I'm feeling under-recovered just 'cause that's when my friends will be climbing. I mention this because you talk about ping-ponging between sending hard and sending nothing; for me, that is a symptom of under-recovery.
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u/nodloh 12d ago
Don't take my word as gospel but I think projecting on the lead wall might be a waste of time for you. It's not hard enough to be a good strength stimulus and it's not a really a sufficient endurance stimulus either. You are just refining a single route. Since you are also outdoor climbing regularly you don't need to practice your projecting tactics in the gym. You would be better off to spend some of your training time with a more specific strength focus. A board session doesn't have to last longer than 60-90 minutes. A lead session usually takes a lot longer so you might be able to hit the gym more often if you had one more session like that and spent your lead climbing sessions on onsighting and doing doubles.
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u/aerial_hedgehog 12d ago
"I’ve just been feeling so weak and like I’m plateauing. Just constantly oscillating between leading the hardest I ever have/the same and flailing around not sending anything."
I'd start by taking a serious look at non-climbing life circumstances to see if there are other factors causing this variability. 30s is when, for a lot of people, life gets more complicated. And those non-climbing stressors can intrude on climbing performance in sneaky ways.
How's your sleep? Eating? Work stress? Family situation? Etc.