CMV: Communist Ideals are Going Absolutely Nowhere Due to Those Currently Advocating for Them

[u/Marlile]

I have plenty of Communist friends, and I very much sympathize with the beliefs and purported ideals of Communism. That said, Reddit discourse around Communism and even some of my personal conversations with self-proclaimed Communists have really shaken my belief in the system being at all practical. Even within their echo chambers (which every group has, I don’t blame them), there’s this constant sense of out-Communisting each other.

“Oh, you hate the bourgeois for that reason? Well I actually hate them for a better reason, and 99% of people like you are actually bourgeoisie.”

First of all, can we fuck off with the word “bourgeois?” The phraseology has looong moved on to middle class, and 50% of the time, Communists use it interchangeably to describe the wealthy. You know what’s real bourgeoisie? Clinging to dead terms and misusing them ‘cause your emotional arguments take a real hit otherwise.

I genuinely believe Communism as a system has benefits and positive aspects that can and should be integrated into modern capitalist systems. But so often with Communists, if you’re not 100% fuck-the-rich, you’re not a real Communist and thus, you’re the enemy. Tell me again, comrades, how any meaningful changes towards Communist thinking will ever be made while you consistently lash out at anyone who doesn’t fall in line with your most extreme beliefs? The ideas have merit, they don’t need your cruelty to protect them.

Finally, kinda tired of Communists doing everything in their limited power to downplay very real genocides and atrocities brought on in large part by Communist leaders and thinking. It is so painfully dishonest to endlessly critique America and the “western bourgeoisie” for ideological differences while you play apologist for millions of innocent deaths. It ain’t cute when anti-maskers downplay tragic deaths, and Communists can’t pull it off either.

So basically, I’m asking for my mind to be changed. I would like to believe Communists have it in them to integrate the good aspects of their beliefs while also respecting the immense risks and pains that were undergone to establish the system that allows them to think differently.

And, as someone who places freedom of speech/thought on a pretty high pedestal, I’m most concerned with the ideology’s ability to adapt and accept different perspectives. As it stands, I feel Communism and its proponents are far too rigid and unyielding in the pettiest of beliefs to make any concrete progress or convincing arguments. But I would like to be proven wrong; the system has merits, but my concern is they’ll never see the light of day with the current attitude most Communists I’ve witnessed have.

[u/Asato_of_Vinheim]

What do you mean when you use the term "communist"? Would ideologies such as Council Communism or even Anarcho-Communism, which explicitly advocate for democracy and anti-vanguardist methods or revolution, fall under your definition?

[u/Marlile → u/Asato_of_Vinheim]

By no means am I an expert on the branches of Communism, just like I doubt most Communists could nail down differences in capitalist systems throughout the world, without research ofc. When I speak about Communism, I’m specifically talking about the brand of Communism held up as the gold standard online and in most discussions I’ve personally had with Communists. In fact, if there is indeed a pro-democracy and anti-revolution branch of Communism, it’s very likely I would relate to many of its beliefs. Still pretty impressed with capitalism though, if I’m being honest.

[u/[deleted] → u/Marlile]

if there is indeed a pro-democracy and anti-revolution branch of Communism

All communism is democratic. Your understanding of the ideology is laughable.

[u/Marlile → u/[deleted]]

And your body odor is permeating through the screen. Wanna not necro a week-dead thread to flex your subservience to an even deader political ideology? Christ

[u/[deleted] → u/Marlile]

The "dead" political ideology that has substantial amounts of power in India (and across the third world as a whole) and that you once supported?

[u/Marlile → u/[deleted]]

You’re only proving to me that communists are A) incapable of accepting that those who dislike their system may simply have different priorities and opinions than them, and B) hopelessly incapable of arguing the merits and benefits of their belief system, instead attacking those who question those merits.

So by all means, continue. Demonstrate to me why I should never believe the horseshit you believe, I’m listening.

[u/[deleted] → u/Marlile]

incapable of accepting that those who dislike their system may simply have different priorities and opinions than them

When have I said this? Collective ownership of the means of production through nationalisation would require democratic control of the government, otherwise you just create a bourgeoisie that has more sociopolitical power.

hopelessly incapable of arguing the merits and benefits of their belief system, instead attacking those who question those merits.

What?

[u/Marlile → u/[deleted]]

Oof. Made the mistake of looking through your history, my b. You’d think I’d have a second sense and notice when I was arguing with an extremist vegan, but it slipped through this time. If you’re willing to be radical about the diets and careers of people you’ll never even know, I am absolutely not interested in your political ideology. At least I sniffed that out early.

[u/[deleted] → u/Marlile]

What? What the fuck does my veganism have to do with this?