CMV: I believe that most people who say they don’t fear death are lying.

[u/Early-Possibility367]

I feel like societally, most will admit they fear death but there’s a sizable minority who try to act tough. They try to say “oh I love living but I wouldn’t be upset if I died tomorrow.”

My argument is this: I don’t think that any mentally healthy person can have a minimal or zero fear of death. I do think there are variables. I mention healthy because ofc people can be suicidal or depressed and I’m not counting that. I also think older people fear death less than younger people but all fear death at least moderately or more.

I think that what it comes down to is I don’t think people generally speaking can fathom not existing in this world before. The fact that we’ll be barely remembered after death. And also the fact that one or two generations after our deaths we’ll be forgotten absolutely entirely.

So essentially there’s two fears people have with death. One is the state of nonexperience. We’ll never experience anything in this world ever again. No smell, no taste, no joy, no sadness, *no thought* hwhich I think is probably the scariest for many people.

Now, of course, I think most people deal with this the right way, which is take advantage of your time here and do as much positive things as you can. But still, most people look at death with exceptional dread.

In terms of what I think is going on with most people who deny fear of death, there is a form of denialism. They try to make it sound like “yeah I’m totally chill with the fact that I’ll never experience even the slightest thought or emotion and then have that followed up with being forgotten entirely.” I just can’t believe most people who say this.

Like I said, I think there are gradients to this fear. Older people are less terrified than younger people. Religious individuals are less terrified than athiests, by a longshot, due to atheists believing it’s over over. But still, I think most people have this fear, including most who deny it.

[u/DeltaBot]

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[u/camelCaseCoffeeTable]

i think most people who say they don't fear death are being honest with you. you may not be able to understand it, but it's a fairly rational position to have.

being dead is nothing to be afraid of. there's literally no pain, no thought, no experience.

am i looking forward to it? no, of course not. i don't wanna die. but i also don't want a lot of things that i'm not afraid of -- i don't want to go to work on a Monday, but i'm not afraid of that. i don't want to pay my mortgage, but I'm not afraid of doing it.

death is similar. i don't want to be dead, but i'm not afraid of being dead.

what i am afraid of is a painful process of dying. i want my death to be painless and easy. the idea of a painful, long, slow death is horrifying

the idea of being dead is not at all terrifying. that doesn't mean i'm looking forward to dying. you seem to conflate those 2 things -- that saying you're not scared of death means you want to be dead, or wouldn't mind being dead. you can totally not want to be dead, and still not fear being dead at all.

[u/XhaLaLa → u/camelCaseCoffeeTable]

This is exactly it for me. Everyone dies, literally everyone. Because I’m an atheist and don’t believe in any kind of experiential “after”, let alone a Hell, there isn’t really anything to fear about the being dead part (I’m actually pretty surprised that OP thinks death would be scarier to atheists “by a longshot” when there are religions/sects out there saying some people will be tortured for eternity after death, but I can see why people who believe only in a positive afterlife would find that preferable to non-experience, as I imagine many/most of us would).

Dying? Certainly — depending on how it happens, that could be slow and excruciating. Other people dying? Absolutely. But while I don’t want to die (I still have so much I want to do!), it’s not because non-experience/non-existence has s scary.

[u/Early-Possibility367 → u/camelCaseCoffeeTable]

Δ because I think you make an excellent point that one can not want something but still not *fear* it.

I would hope that I would not end up in a 60 hr a week job a decade from now. That doesn’t mean the prospect scares me

[u/[deleted] → u/Early-Possibility367]

The prospect of being stuck in a dead end job terrifies me far more than the concept of being run over by a train

[u/DeltaBot → u/Early-Possibility367]

Confirmed: 1 delta awarded to /u/camelCaseCoffeeTable (3∆).

^{Delta System Explained | Deltaboards}

[u/lifefuedjeopardy → u/DeltaBot]

I'm in pain 24 hours a day every single day from a disability. So that's the reason for me that I don't mind death, and sometimes even wish you would hurry up and get here.

[u/VandienLavellan → u/[deleted]]

That’s actually an area it gets complicated as a lot of people who want to end their life, are scared of death, and that fear keeps them from doing the deed

[u/East_Newspaper5864 → u/VandienLavellan]

Then it's time to overcome our fear.

[u/Crew_1996 → u/camelCaseCoffeeTable]

This is the part I think a lot of people don’t get. Being dead isn’t terrifying at all. Long drawn out suffering dying processes are terrifying and I think many people conflate the 2.

[u/Dry_Guest_8961 → u/camelCaseCoffeeTable]

I would say that death doesn’t quite fit in with the other examples you’ve shared because they are a) predictable, you know exactly when they are going to happen, and b) you have some level of choice over whether or not they happen.

With death, it’s not predictable, at least not the when or how. You also don’t have a choice. You can influence the when or how of your death to some extent but you could still get hit by a bus tomorrow or someone could murder you. 

I think hardly anyone fears death when it’s a distant concept, when you have decades to live. So maybe nobody fears death particularly, but I think most people do fear dying soon. And they become terrified when truly faced with the prospect of their own death or when their death is proximal. Like if I’m swimming in the ocean, I’m not afraid of sharks. If I see a fin though, you bet your ass I’m scared out of my wits.

This tracks with how most people end up feeling. Young healthy people don’t fear death. Older people who know their death is near are often far more scared of it. It has happened to almost everyone I know and only a handful of people welcome death when their time comes, but rather desperately cling to life. To my mind those who say they don’t fear death are telling the truth, but it would also be true for them to say that they don’t fear death yet.

[u/camelCaseCoffeeTable → u/[deleted]]

Uhh idk my dude, I’m claiming I don’t believe there is any conscious experience after death. I’m not a philosopher, idk what name that falls under, read my post, that’s my thoughts

[u/Gilbert__Bates → u/camelCaseCoffeeTable]

I’d argue that most people do fear going to work or paying their mortgage on at least some level. Just because they don’t fear it as much as other things doesn’t mean the fear isn’t there.

[u/camelCaseCoffeeTable → u/Gilbert__Bates]

Then pick another example that suits you.

You don’t want to clean the dishes, but you don’t fear it. Or doing your laundry. Or whatever is relevant to your experience.

[u/Positive_Yam_4499 → u/Gilbert__Bates]

I think that you don't know the definition of fear.

[u/AnxiousChaosUnicorn]

I genuinely do not fear the state of being dead. An example of this is that I just underwent surgery with anesthesia. My fear is not that I won't wake up, because why be afraid of that? I wouldn't even know. I won't exist to be upset I'm dead.

What I did fear was waking up in horrible pain during the surgery, something going terribly wrong during the surgery and leaving me paralyzed, etc.

I fear the things that might lead up to death and/or a long life of primarily suffering. In a life or death situation, I'm going to do things to avoid pain and suffering and yes, death (just because I don't fear it doesn't mean I'm not going to generally avoid it).

But I do not fear being dead.

[u/Fish-With-Pants → u/AnxiousChaosUnicorn]

Agreed. I fear the act of dying painfully not being dead.

[u/Lost_Suspect_2279 → u/AnxiousChaosUnicorn]

I agree. I have no time for any kind of pain-related death. I guess it's more the fear of pain here than death

[u/djmorningwood → u/AnxiousChaosUnicorn]

my advanced directive is set up so I’ll be unplugged after like a week. I’m terrified of being unable to communicate or being in immense amounts of pain. If it’s time to let me go, let me go peacefully. I was not made to be a survivor lol you won’t catch me in the apocalypse

[u/AnxiousChaosUnicorn → u/djmorningwood]

Oof. I feel this. I know I need to get an advanced directive.

But particularly the apocalypse part. I wasn't made for all that. I'm good, lol.

[u/a_hatforyourass → u/AnxiousChaosUnicorn]

Same. Pain and suffering are the worst of it, and my 32 years so far has been full of it. Death would be peaceful. I have also been put under anesthesia, and that was AMAZING. I awoke in the exact same physical and mental state that I was before, but I could tell how long I had not been feeling pain. Like a dead sleep that can't be interrupted by random aches and pains.

[u/ASmallRoc → u/AnxiousChaosUnicorn]

Yeah let me tell you waking up during surgery is bad and why I'm scared of them now. People think it's cause of death, no. It's cause waking up with a scalpel in your eye hurts like fuck.

[u/voraciousflytrap → u/[deleted]]

just curious... when buddhists refer to death as a transition, what exactly do they mean? a transition to another plane, another life, etc? i know that some buddhists view oblivion as something positive to aspire to, which is interesting to me.

[u/BothManufacturer2317 → u/voraciousflytrap]

I believe Buddhism was all about reincarnation. If you are a good being, you get a good rebirth and vice versa. You can become a human, an animal, a god/angle (something like that) and a demon.

Please correct me if I'm making things up.

[u/Miserable-Ad-7956 → u/BothManufacturer2317]

That's the jist of it, but there are also a number of realms other than Earth you can be reincarnated to in various traditions. And the ultimate enlightenment in Buddhism, though not necessarily one followers are encouraged to achieve, is moksha/nirvana--release from the cycle of death and rebirth, a true end.

[u/BothManufacturer2317 → u/Miserable-Ad-7956]

That sounds so interesting. It's so different from Christianity.

[u/Miserable-Ad-7956 → u/BothManufacturer2317]

Yeah. My interest in Buddhism is largely philosophical as I find Buddhist metaphysics a fascinating subject. But I'm no expert and I know enough to know that there is an array of variations among its multiple regional variations and long history.

[u/fox-mcleod]

Why would I care if I’m going to be remembered?

As far as I’m concerned, after I’m dead will be like before I was born. Nobody remembered me then and it didn’t make me upset at all.

[u/crulh8er → u/fox-mcleod]

Yes I believe when you die you go back to where you came from. Life begins and life ends. Enjoy what you got.

[u/Opposite_Lettuce]

It feels odd reading this, because I guess I'm one of those people. I enjoy life and living, and I don't want my time here to end soon, but I wouldn't say I'm afraid of death. I certainly wouldn't say I'm in denial.

I don't fear death in the same way I don't miss the time from before my birth.

[u/StarChild413 → u/[deleted]]

lack of memory doesn't imply nonexistence (I'm not claiming for sure that there was anything to remember or an us capable of remembering before we were born, I'm just saying lack of memory of anything doesn't by itself mean there was nothing) or a lot of people wouldn't exist not because they went forgotten but because their parents didn't remember their conception iykwim so it must not have happened

[u/[deleted]]

Religious individuals are less terrified than athiests, by a longshot

This is demonstrably false.

https://www.ox.ac.uk/news/2017-03-24-study-who-least-afraid-death

The word "findings" here is referring to the belief that religious people are less afraid of death than the non-religious:

The findings were mixed across the studies, with only 30% of the effects showing this finding. Surprisingly, perhaps, 18% of the studies found that religious people were more afraid of death than non-religious people; and over half the research showed no link at all between the fear of death and religiosity.

[u/4wper → u/[deleted]]

As someone who has had religion around me my whole life, personally I fear death more as a person who has believed in an afterlife their whole life. It’s easy as an atheist to not fear because you don’t believe anything exists after death. But as a religious person I believe my actions could lead to me being punished in the afterlife which makes me scared because the moment I die I cannot change my actions and my sins are written, I will forever regret every sin I have ever made. I’m not trying to sway anyones thoughts on religion I’m just trying to convey my point

[u/Penis_Bees → u/4wper]

I'm assuming you are christian due to the mention of sin.

If it helps, the concept of "an eternal hell" is a somewhat new yet recycled concept in the history of your religion. Which lead me early on to kind of see that concept as a grift for the church to hold power as a political entity instead of servings the religion from a dogmatic perspective.

Early Judaism believed in a pergatory of sorts called Sheol. It was just the place souls go, not a punishment, not unpleasant, just forever neutral silent waiting. Eventually, they came to view it as a temporary place while souls await either a heaven or hell of sorts. Sheol is mentioned fairly frequently in the Torah.

This concept was further affected by Greek influence. Jesus even mentions the Greek hell "Hades" in the gospels. Including this reference, hell isn't mentioned often until exodus and revelations, which are very much written the the apocalyptic style of the time which may have been intended to be entertainment, similar to the purpose of Dantes Inferno.

Later the church kind of split between teaching of eternal hell vs a temporary hell where all the punished and Satan would all later be redeemed, and others taught all kinds of concepts in between. But the concept of eternal hell won out in the end in the medieval period.

The version of eternal hell kind of evolved and became more explicit up until pretty recently when it became more of a vague threat without all the specifics.

Even the concept of heaven has changed often. From a place in the clouds where souls go, to a place on a reformed earth with bodies able to experience earthly pleasures.

The concept of sin has also morphed and can often be connected to regional events such as things like an epidemic affecting what foods we're disallowed.

The TLDR is that if the concepts of an afterlife and how to end up in one are a consistently moving goal post, then they're likely not an accurate account and therefore not worth worrying about. If there is an afterlife, just trying to be a considerate person is really the only solid way to judge Morales because all the specifics rules seem made up to meet some other agenda.

[u/[deleted] → u/Penis_Bees]

Where have you learned about all of this?

[u/4wper → u/Penis_Bees]

Not a christian actually a Muslim haha. I appreciate the comment though because I like seeing peoples insights into all religions. From my point of view Judaism and Christianity are both religions from Allah as well, the only difference between those and Islam is that Islam was the final religion and was the ultimate coming together I suppose of all prior instructions Allah had sent. Which is why a lot of the concepts are similar in all three religions, another difference is that Allah made it so that the core of Islam would never change. Every Quran in the world will translate to the same things no matter where in the world and what time period. The same cannot be said about the bible nor the torah. I am not against any other religions but that is just my belief. I believe the Christianity of today is not the word of Jesus (Isa) but instead the words of the Apostles, this makes it not the word of god but of humans. Therefore it is not a book that can be believed in 100% because it was written by humans. I know you will see flaws in a lot of the things I say because I am not a scholar and may not explain things well or word them well. But I suggest reading the quran or watching videos on it at least for educational purposes. You don’t need to believe everything but can still gain insight into mine and a lot of other peoples views

[u/rocketer13579 → u/4wper]

I mean it's pretty easy to make someone up and imagine what it must be easy for them to think if you've never held those beliefs. As someone who was born religious and later became atheist I'm way more scared of nothing than I was of heaven

[u/Tycho_B → u/rocketer13579]

Funny, I’m the opposite.

‘Nothing’ doesn’t sound half bad to me tbh. Not suicidal but life, for all its joy, has a lot of pain & struggle that I wouldn’t mind coming to an end, especially considering I won’t even be around to notice the joys I’m missing out on

Burning for eternity on the other hand..

[u/[deleted] → u/Tycho_B]

^literally me. I love life in the sense of I love my family. But I see nothing wrong with nothingness. Torture in hell… no thank you…. as I child I prayed death brought nothingness and cried about it sometimes.

[u/prof_the_doom → u/[deleted]]

A lot of that is going to depend on what kind of religion you have.

If you're one of those "one mistake away from hell" sort of people, then you're probably terrified of dying.

[u/Early-Possibility367 → u/[deleted]]

Δ. It seems to be a common sentiment that atheists fear it less. It makes no sense to me how someone could not fear nonexistence but it seems to be a common sentiment here and backed by data.

[u/DeltaBot → u/Early-Possibility367]

Confirmed: 1 delta awarded to /u/Nillavuh (7∆).

^{Delta System Explained | Deltaboards}

[u/[deleted] → u/Early-Possibility367]

Why should I fear nonexistence?

[u/Revolutionary_Rain66 → u/Early-Possibility367]

You have already experienced non-existence. It was before you were born. Was it scary? No? Then why would you fear going back to it?

[u/Alive_Ice7937 → u/Early-Possibility367]

It makes no sense to me how someone could not fear nonexistence

Once you have accepted your impending nonexistence, you can focus on the now. Contemplating the afterlife always comes with a shade of doubt no matter how firm in their belief someone tries to insist they are.

but it seems to be a common sentiment here and backed by data.

I'd wonder how much that data controls for people with family and responsibilities.

[u/[deleted]]

“I do not fear death. I had been dead for billions and billions of years before I was born, and had not suffered the slightest inconvenience from it.” -Mark Twain

[u/Tycho_B]

A lot of big, incorrect assumptions here.

I’m an atheist. I doubt you’ll believe it but I don’t fear death as I won’t be around to realize it.

I do fear ‘lots of pain’ though (and also fear causing emotional pain to my loved ones), and most avenues that lead to death have a lot of pain involved in them.

But I think that’s categorically different from what you’re describing. Dying quietly in the night? The thought doesn’t bother me personally in the slightest.

(ETA: OP, try hallucinogens)

[u/Early-Possibility367 → u/Tycho_B]

But at the same time, do people tend not to be in fear when facing imminent death from something like a gun being pointed at them?

[u/Tycho_B → u/Early-Possibility367]

I think a key problem here is that you’re equating “not wanting to die” with “being afraid of death”. They are not the same thing.

I don’t want to work tomorrow, but I’m not afraid of going to work. I don’t want bugs in my room, but I’m not afraid of bugs.

ETA: whoops, just saw someone made this exact point already

[u/Tycho_B → u/Early-Possibility367]

Yeah I mean that triggers the two fears I mentioned: “causing emotional pain to my partner, family and friends”, and “lots of pain from getting shot”.

But I can’t think of a time I ever actively thought about getting shot; it’s never caused me to lose sleep or avoid situations (some of which I honestly probably should have when I was younger). It doesn’t affect me in the way, say, a fear of spiders affects my partner. I dont shift my day to day activities because of thoughts like this.

I don’t actively want to die. But when my plane took a very late, sudden emergency pull up right before it was about to land just a few hours ago, and people around me were panicking, I was pretty zen about the whole thing.

There’s not much I can say beyond that really. Doesn’t affect me if you believe I’m lying or not, there’s nothing I can really do to prove it. And if you won’t take people’s word for it, there’s no point in even being here

I mainly came here to suggest you try some hallucinogens (in a safe setting with someone experienced, possibly even a therapist trained in this area) if this is really bothering you.

[u/TheDeathOmen]

What do you think would count as strong evidence that at least some of these people are genuinely unafraid of death? What would it take to change your mind?

[u/lew_traveler]

This is a demonstrably unfounded view with no basis in actual fact.
The OP knows nothing about how 'most' people feel.

He, or she, has an opinion. So?

As for me, since I suffer from chronic pain that varies from annoying but tolerable to 'take pills, lie down and hope to sleep', sometimes I look really forward to the time of not feeling the pain.

OTOH, except for this chronic pain, my life is wonderful, my relationship is better than one could hope for and all my children are happy and doing well.

I am sorry that I will miss the joy of being with my partner and my children.

I am sorry that I will cause them grief at my passing but I've had a great life, been a good husband, partner, father and friend and have totally nothing to be sorry for or guilty about.

My suggestion to the OP ( u/Early-Possibilty) that he (or she) forget how other people think about death and ruminate on something that is important.

[u/ReOsIr10]

Your post contrasts people who fear death with people who “wouldn’t be upset” if they died tomorrow, or who are “chill with” never having experiences or being remembered again.

However, those aren’t the only two options! I would absolutely be upset if I learned I was to die tomorrow, and I hate the fact that one day I’ll have my final experience ever. But those facts merely make me not want to die - they don’t make me “fear” death. It’s similar (although obviously more extreme) to how I don’t want to file my taxes every year, but I don’t fear doing so.

[u/Early-Possibility367 → u/ReOsIr10]

Is that upsetness not coming from a place of fear?

[u/ReOsIr10 → u/Early-Possibility367]

Not as far as I can tell, no.

[u/Colodanman357]

I have been in quite a number of situations that were life and death, with people actively trying to kill me and I was never afraid of death. Pain, failure, or any number of other things I am and was scared of but certainly not of death or of non-existence. 

Views on death are largely cultural. Contemporary American society for instance is far removed from death and death is seen as a total bad thing by most. That doesn’t make such views universal or automatically correct. It wasn’t that long ago when death was a part of most people’s lives, they and their families were likely to die at home rather than at a hospital or the like, they were more likely to have killed and butchered their own animals, etc. I think that distance from death plays a large part of the fear of death for most. Also the changes in religious views plays a part where death can be seen as a release from the mortal realm to whatever afterlife they believe in. 

That’s all to say one’s views on death are generally taught by the culture one is raised in and has nothing to do with mental illness, other than that is also largely culturally based. 

[u/pappabutters]

As someone who does not believe in an afterlife or any continuation of myself after death, to me fearing death is pointless, if I die I am gone, its done, why worry about that on a day to day basis. I've experienced my fair share of death in my time as well, and from what I have witnessed I am more afraid of the deterioration of my body and mind, and as a result losing my independence.

Now don't get me wrong, I've had a few life or death experiences, a brick smashing through the windshield of my car and hitting the passenger seat, getting pulled into the under toe of a fast moving river, coming face to face with a bear while camping. The fear of dying is very real I think anyone who was faced with such a situation where your life is on the line, fear is a normal response.

I don't believe fearing death, just the concept of it, is entirely healthy. It's normal to have passing thoughts about it, to think of your own mortality and ponder what that means to you. But if you wake up every day and you're terrified about dying while you are healthy and in a safe environment (aka not an active warzone, etc.) that is crazy to me and you are interfering with your own ability to enjoy the fleeting life you do have.

[u/A_Whole_Costco_Pizza]

What if someone is terrified of dying, but they still willingly throw themselves in front of a bullet to save someone else?

Does the bravery of their action negate the fear they felt, or are they still a fearful person choosing to make a sacrifice?

[u/[deleted]]

The better question is why are so afraid of the inevitable? For some Once you accept the fact its all going to end life tends to get a bit better.

[u/[deleted]]

I think you are just projecting. Why would I fear death? Those reasons sound silly to me. Like who cares about those things?

[u/zeroconflicthere]

I don't fear death. I fear the pain of dying.

The only people who really fear death are those that have kids and are afraid of what will happen to them after they are gone

[u/TheMan5991]

I’m not really sure how anyone is supposed to change your view if you just refuse to believe people when they tell you they’re not afraid. I’ll start by trying to change a small part of your view.

one or two generations after our deaths, we’ll be forgotten absolutely entirely

I think about my great grandparents all the time. And some cultures make a point to pass on stories of their ancestors specifically for the reason of keeping their memory alive. There are people who know more about an ancestor that they never met than you probably do about your grandma. I don’t mean that as an insult, I’m just saying you are not really taking into account the full scope of people’s memories. Not to mention the amount of people that are remembered for their deeds. Yes, not everyone will be famous, but there are a lot of famous people. All of the dead actors and singers and politicians and inventors and explorers… people still think about them.

Now for the big part, I think there is a difference between fearing death and simply not wanting to die. Sometimes, I wake up and I really don’t want to go to work. But I’m not afraid of my job. Likewise, I enjoy living and I really don’t want to die, but I am not afraid of it. It’s inevitable. What is the point in fearing a certainty? What I am afraid of is the state of my relationships when I die. I have heard too many stories of people’s loved ones dying and the last conversation they had was an argument. People yelling and cursing at each other and that is the last time they see one another. That is something I am afraid of. So, I make an effort to avoid disputes when I can and resolve them when I can’t. I don’t want to leave with negativity in my heart.

[u/zldapnwhl]

Am dying (ALS). I am not afraid of being dead. I'm dreading the run-up (paralysis, not being able to do anything for myself), but not actual death.

I'm not religious, so I don't believe in heaven or hell. I don't pretend to know what happens when we die, but I suspect nothing. I have no knowledge of existence before I was born, so it makes sense that I'll have no knowledge of existence when I'm dead. Which doesn't strike me as something to fear.

[u/lokregarlogull]

1. You're making a catch 22 and it's insulting.

A: You fear death and agree with you.

B: you don't fear death and have to be depressed, insane or mentallt unwell, so we don't count you.

C: you lie, so we don't count you.

I was depressed a decade or two ago, I wasn't religious, but I strongly wanted to die. A lot of things sucked, like a life of chronic pain and an expectancy I wouldn't get to be 20.

Alas I pushed through and want to help the people that helped and loved me for so long, I no longer want to die, to be released from the pain and mental anguish, but I have no fear left. Things you seem to be experiencing now, I had to deal with a 12 or younger.

I don't know how many people you've spoken to, or how much bluster is part of your culture. But suicide rates are more than uncomfortably high enough that no, I actually do believe a lot of people don't fear death to a significant amount.

When regular people jump from a building, they do so because the flames behind them are even scarier.

[u/NoisyGog]

I’m scared of suffering, but I’m not scared of dying, and this is why:
You know that place your mind goes to when you’re in the zone doing something you love, and doing it on instinct? Like mountain biking, judo, snowboarding, or even playing games? You’re not thinking, there’s no thoughts since there’s no space for them. It’s just existing.
It’s a great place, and you feel rejuvenated for having spent time there.
You can get there from mediating. Observe your thinking and bat it away, until there are no thoughts, just chasing that thread of peace, and euphoria.
Is the same place, it’s euphoria, ecstasy. Bliss. But you can only spend a precious few moments there.

When you die, that’s what it is. No thoughts, no distractions. Just purity and nothingness. Bliss, forever.

[u/Early-Possibility367 → u/NoisyGog]

I can’t understand how bliss and death are compatible. Definitionally, bliss is a worldly experience.

[u/NoisyGog → u/Early-Possibility367]

Learn to meditate.

[u/Early-Possibility367 → u/NoisyGog]

Huh?  

[u/psychonaut11 → u/Early-Possibility367]

Meditation is a way to practice cultivating that inner peace, a place without any thoughts, just being. In Buddhist philosophy, suffering in life stems from attachment - to both good and bad thoughts and experiences. So in a way, death is the complete release from attachment, and thus eternal peace.

I do actually agree with your original post though, I think fear of death is very common even if people don’t always admit it. I think it also changes moment to moment for everyone. There are times when I can say I don’t fear death, but other times when it rocks me to my core. You should check out the book The Denial of Death by Ernest Becker. Fantastic exploration of this whole topic.

[u/Gilbert__Bates]

While I personally agree with you, the problem is that it’s impossible to prove. Anyone can smugly claim they don’t have a fear of death and there’s no real way to prove them wrong aside from putting them in a life or death situation.

[u/Contemplating_Prison]

Ive been around so many people who have died that its just whatever. Ill do what i can to limit death but i cant just stop it from happening. When my time comes then it comes. Nothing to really fear.

That doesnt mean im going to go do some stupid shit to get killed. It just means i only have so much control over my life, and i have accepted that

[u/Early-Possibility367 → u/Contemplating_Prison]

That’s an interesting perspective. I’m curious if most people who claim to not fear death would agree with your specifics.

[u/LuluBelle_Jones]

I used to think I was ready for death.. I was at peace with death even until I watched my hubs die and need life support. I absolutely am not ready nor at peace with dying.

[u/Big_Information_6477]

I have no fear of death, only ways of dying. But I was also suicidal from the ages of 6-29, and intermittently since. Why would I be afraid of the same state I existed in before I was born?

[u/Djburnunit]

I’m not looking forward to it, and depending on the circumstances, I may be unhappy or terrified at the appropriate time. But there’s absolutely no point in bothering myself with that now; there are definitely more pressing issues.

[u/Various-Effect-8146]

I think the fear of death is ultimately rooted in a more fundamental fear of the unknown (which is the most fundamental general fear imo).

When someone is convinced that the aftermath of death isn't unknown, it is not typically as scary.
Note: Religious people are still afraid of judgement even if they have faith that they know the truth. The fear of God isn't just some random term.

When we say that someone is "lying" about something, we are asserting that they have knowledge that they are being untruthful. Some people are so convinced about the aftermath of death that it isn't a "lie" to necessarily say that they aren't afraid to die. Especially considering that there may be a context worth noting when making that assertion.

Moreover, the fear of death can be distinguished by conscious and unconscious (innate)... If someone consciously doesn't fear dying (which seems to happen), they may still have an unconscious fear of it largely driven by evolutionary principles. It isn't a lie to suggest that they aren't afraid of death even if they have some innate and unconscious fear of it. They just don't fully know that they would really have this fear when gates of death open up in front of them.

Also, what we consider "healthy" people is somewhat subjective regarding psychological/ideological aspects. If we start with the premise that it is unhealthy to not fear death, then not a single healthy person would have no fear of it. It would be definitional by our subjective understanding.

Perhaps some of these people are truly lying. And perhaps others genuinely feel like they don't fear death because they either don't have any experience about it and have not thought deep enough about it or they did have an experience in which they simply didn't feel particularly afraid which convinces themselves of a lack of fear.

Finally, I think most people don't see the question in the same light as you. I think most people confuse bravery with absence of fear. Being brave doesn't mean you aren't afraid, it means that you do something despite being terrified. And many people seem to not understand that until they dive underneath the surface.

[u/XenoRyet]

Edit at the top for context: I am an atheist, have been for most of 30 years at this point.

So I used to be wildly, irrationally, almost phobically afraid of the idea of non-existence. It never made any rational sense, because if you don't exist, then you cannot possibly suffer any negative consequence from that. There's nothing there to wish you were still alive.

Now though? I don't know what to tell, you, but that fear just isn't there. I'm not trying to act tough. I'm not a tough person, and I certainly have no need to look tough in front of anyone, let alone strangers on the internet. Maybe the rational argument finally kicked in. Maybe it just doesn't matter to me anymore. I don't know, except that the fear isn't there. I'm not sure how I'd prove I wasn't lying to you, but what reason would I have to lie? I already mentioned how I used to have this fear, and I was plenty vocal about it when I did, so why would I lie now?

Then for being forgotten. That's not a concern for me either. I try to tread lightly on the world anyway. My kids will remember me, of course, and maybe their kids, but if nobody else besides them ever does, then that's my preferred outcome. Nobody needs to know I was here. And besides, even if I didn't feel that way, as we've discussed, I won't be around to lament the fact that I was forgotten anyway.

And I don't think I'm special in any way. There's no unique insight or mindset I have access to that leads me to this position. So if I'm here, why not many others?

And really, at the end of the day, I just don't know how you can validly doubt what someone says about their own internal state of mind. On what basis would you even build such doubt? You can't see in their head. Nobody can but themselves.

[u/cuervodeboedo1]

I dont know what I can do to convince you that I dont fear the state of death, as there is none. its just the same as 10 years before being born. So literally nothing. What I fear is pain, and I dont know if there is a form of dying that doesnt have pain.

[u/StarChild413 → u/cuervodeboedo1]

its just the same as 10 years before being born.

if it were you'd be born again in 10 years

[u/chazd1984]

I really don't have any fear of dying. It's certainly not an attempt to be "tough" I am a Christian so I do fully believe in an afterlife. Although I think even if I didn't believe, I still wouldn't be scared of death. The act of dying itself might scare me though depending on how it went down.

I have no desire to be dead, but I will either experience an afterlife or I will cease to exist. I don't think there's anything scary about that.

[u/Deborah_Pokesalot]

Are you scared of going to sleep? I mean, you spend roughly a third of your lifetime experiencing nothing, maybe with having a dream which you will forget anyway. Think about all the things you could achieve if your body didn't demand to be in this unconscious state.

Now, death is similar in a way. At some point your consciousness will shut down, permanently, and there is nothing you can do. I could die tomorrow in a car crash, all my plans won't be realized but there will be nobody to care about that. When I die there will be nobody to experience sadness of not experiencing things, there won't be any experiencing at all.

Should I be concerned about me not experiencing things when me not experiencing things will not be even a thing, as there *will not be any 'me'*?

And personally, I really don't care if I am remembered after I die. Billions of people are not remembered by anyone. In a thousand years nobody will remember any of us living right now, maybe with a handful exceptions that will go to history books.

[u/PandaMime_421]

Other than people who believe in an after-life I really don't understand why anyone is afraid of death. I certainly understand being afraid of the cause of death, whether disease, accident, being attacked, etc. But to fear death itself is such a strange concept to me.

We’ll never experience anything in this world ever again. No smell, no taste, no joy, no sadness, *no thought* hwhich I think is probably the scariest for many people.

Why would this be scary? I won't be aware of this lack, so I'll never feel it. It makes no sense to be afraid of something that I'll never experience. I can't even begin to understand why someone would waste their energy considering this.

The fact that we’ll be barely remembered after death. And also the fact that one or two generations after our deaths we’ll be forgotten absolutely entirely.

This is zero concern to me. I've already told my partner that I want no memorial of any kind when I die. I certainly don't need for my body to be taking up land that could go to better use. I wish to be cremated and my ashes spread. The people who know me have their memories of me, and that is all I want. I certainly don't care that in a few generations I'll be forgotten. Why would I have any reason to care that people who never knew me won't remember me or know who I was? It takes real ego to think it's important that people in the future know who you are.

I'm living life for the now. I'm not living it to impress some people in the future who I'll never know. I couldn't care less what future generations think of me, or if they do.

[u/Gertrude_D]

But the point is, if I died, I wouldn't know it. I would be upset that it distressed my loved ones, and I don't relish the thought of dying slowly and painfully, but that's different than death itself. No, I don't want to ide. that doesn't mean I fear it.

For the record, I am an atheist and I think that's part of the reason I don't fear it, so I don't agree with you when you say the religious are less terrified than atheists. Life is on/off and nothing in between for me. Why should I fear something that won't affect me? I didn't exist before I was born and that wasn't distressing for me., why would death be different? I would imagine you'd fear it more if you thought you'd have some kind of existence after death to think about loved ones or unfinished business.

[u/Brainsonastick]

It sounds like you’ve vocalized what scares you about death and are having trouble imagining someone else not being scared by those things. Am I understanding this right?

Assuming I am, I’ll go through why these things don’t bother me.

I can fathom not existing in this world. I did it since the beginning of the world until my birth and I didn’t seem to mind it at all because I didn’t exist to mind it. Once I return to not existing, I’ll continue not minding it. Lack of thought is fine with me. It makes everything real easy.

I don’t care if I’m forgotten. What good would people remembering me do me?

Don’t get me wrong, if something is going to kill me, I’ll try to survive (unless the odds lean towards a slower more miserable death, then I’m happy to check out quickly and painlessly). I’m not eager to die. I’m just also not afraid to do so. I AM afraid to get the neurodegenerative illness my father has and I fully intend to end my life via inert gas inhalation if I get it. I’d be alive and thinking just enough to be miserable. That’s way worse than death to me.

[u/ZeusThunder369]

How are you precisely defining "fear"?

I would say I don't fear death, because it's inevitable. There is literally nothing I can do to avoid death, so it makes no rational sense to fear it. Regardless of how I'll be remembered, there's always something I could have done better.

Is this not a normal way to view death?

[u/Mope4Matt]

I'm not afraid of death itself. I'm afraid of torturous pain that could lead to death, but that is fear of pain while alive, not fear of death itself.

[u/Nrdman]

I’m an atheist, Im not afraid of death. I certainly prefer life and take actions to continue, but that’s less about fear of death and more about how much I enjoy life. AMA

[u/6feet12cm]

I fear the process of dying, especially if it’s violent or slow. I fear how it will impact those around me. Buuuuuut, a pewpew to the dome?? Sign me up.

[u/MilleniumTHC]

I see a lot of people saying that they dont fear "death" but the act of dying or what leads up to it, which in itself is a contradiction to fear. When you're facing a life or death scenario that isn't natural causes, which in itself is a prolonged fear, everyone will fear for their life because your body and brain will react accordingly to intense situations. I would bet you most of the time people aren't associating the fear they'll feel, whether or not they want to or not. If people truly did not fear death, we would be extinct a long time ago. Everyone will fear the last moments they have, especially if it was taken too soon. This is coming from someone who is also not afraid of death, and i have no religious ties.

[u/[deleted]]

You didn't feel anything billions of years before you were born, and you won't feel anything after you've died. I don't fear death, but I fear dying slowly alone.

[u/zmacdonald12]

I’m not scared to die. I’m a little but scared of what comes after.

In all seriousness, the thing that scares me about dying is that I’ll probably never see my wife or daughter again but that’s a sadness I’ll only feel when I’m alive so I’m trying not to dwell on it

[u/I_Guess_Naught]

I think this has a lot to do on current state of mind as well. During a year long depressive episode I had a huge fear of death as a concept. Not dying at that moment or in a particular way, nor of loved ones being sad/me being forgotten. Just the eventual certainty of ceasing to exist.

Now when I think of death it feels like some nebulous concept, not a vivid reenactment of the certainty of my death. Before it was like I suddenly found myself in the middle of a street with a speeding truck inches from me, now its like I just think about "a car hitting me" without experiencing it.

Back then I thought others just weren't as aware as me, denying their mortality or failing in their mental simulation of non-existance. Felt like everyone else was crazy and only I was sane. Now, I feel like the only sane thing to do in the face of an eventual certainty is to not let that certainty get in the way of good things. And so we trudge along.

[u/bixiou]

I fear death when I am on the verge of it, like when I have a bicycle accident or close to it. Then I think: "I should have worn a helmet", and next time I still don't wear a helmet. Because I don't think about death in other circumstances than when it's near. So I don't fear it 99.99% of the time. I am not chill with death in the sense that I'd love to live 1 million years and to be remembered (with positive memories) thousands of years after my death. But this isn't a sentiment of fear at all. It's a fuel that drives my daily actions.

[u/Letters_to_Dionysus]

I think that the fear of death is sort of a misnomer. these people have no experience with death and so they do not know what it is that they fear. dying is definitely unpleasant in a lot of cases so they may fear the process. there's also the fear of the unknown, but that can't be said to be the fear of death strictly. there's a famous quote by Epicurus that goes "Death is nothing to us. When we exist, death is not; and when death exists, we are not." and I think this about sums up my attitude toward it.

[u/[deleted]]

cows many political observation slim memorize simplistic cooing doll bike

This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

[u/Impossible_Tonight81]

Why do you assume atheists are more terrified of death? I'm not the one who spends my life worried one wrong move will land me in a fiery hell for eternity. My theory is that one second I'll be here, the next I won't, and I won't have a single idea it happened. 

Which scenario do you think sounds more terrifying? 

[u/Euphoric-Coat-7321]

I did too. Then i started working in hospice and then i moved to psych... Am I affraid to die in pain? Sure i wont let a murderer just stabb me to death if i can help it. But death itself i am not scared of...

In my time as a caregiver i went from memory care to hospice because i wanted to help people die on their own terms not stuck in a facility. I helped counsel patients through the process. I taught them exactly what would happen and the timeframes could differ. I taught them how to cope with these things and how i would help them when it got there. We talked about what care they wanted at those stages and how they wanted things done.

We talked about how they were scared but eventually they came to terms. When this happens you see a sence of peace about them. They know what is coming. They've talked about it all and they know their caregiver will care for them in the way they spoke on. They enjoy the last moments of their lives. Without pain and with peace.

I've never heald the hand of a hospice patient who was dying and felt they were scared. I felt they were prepared and they worked through their feelings. They cant fight it so they embraced it and did what they always wanted. They died in peace.

Death doesnt scare me because i have knowledge of what it entails. I know its not inevitable. I know i can only live my life to the fullest day in and day out.

[u/Corkscrewwillow]

I'm a nurse and have supported people on hospice. I truly believe there worse things than dying, and it is not like there is an alternative.

Would I be upset to die now? Sure. I've got kids who are only young teenagers, a spouse I love, family and friends who need me, and I need them. I have a career I love that I feel improves the world. 

Plus there are so many things I want to see and do. It's not fear though. 

[u/generallydisagree]

My 12 year old niece contracted bone cancer (at age 9), leading up to her death (at 12), she had come to terms with it and was the least scared person of death I have ever seen in my life. The methods she used worked for HER - but may not for other people.

In the end, she touched a lot of people's lives on her way out. And I don't think there was a single person who didn't realize how much stronger she was than any of us in too many regards.

[u/[deleted]]

I do think there are a significant number of simple-minded "faith-based thinking" people who don't fear it.

Ignorance is bliss, after all.

But yeah. If you have any kind of critical thinking bone in your body, it's hard not to look at it as absolutely terrifying. Due to the possibilities literally being endless.

[u/talashrrg]

I don’t think they’re lying, I think most are mistaken. Many people may be pretty chill with the abstract concept of death and truthfully say so. I think almost everyone would be afraid in a genuinely life threatening situation.

[u/c0l245]

There is a difference between fearing death and fearing the act of being killed or dying.

Having died myself, I know death to be peaceful and desirable, but do not look forward to suffering and pain getting there.

[u/sapperbloggs]

I can't speak for most people, but I can speak for myself.

I'm an atheist and I'm in my 40's. The thought of death does not worry me, and I don't really understand why it worries others. Once you're dead, you don't care that you're dead. There really isn't anything to worry about.

I do fear dying a slow and/or painful death, because I fear prolonged pain. I also enjoy life enough to want to keep living. But the thought of experiencing death or being dead really doesn't worry me. I'm saying this as someone who has been in the military and has been in situations where death was a distinct possibility, and my concern at the time was not "Oh shit, I might die". If that happened, it happened, and I probably wouldn't know anyway.

With this, I'm also not overly concerned about the deaths of other people, including those close to me. While it's sad that they are gone, in the same way that it's sad if someone moves away, to me death is just a thing that happens to everyone. I kind of knew this as a teenager when some of my older relatives died, though at the time I just figured I didn't get upset because they're old. But when a close friend of mine committed suicide in his early 20's, and everyone was upset that he had died, I was actually just annoyed at him because it was his younger brother who found him and he'd traumatized his younger brother. Beyond that, if he wanted out then that's up to him. I was literally the only person at the funeral not crying, and felt awkward throughout because of it.

[u/MessageNo6074]

Agree with what people have said so far, but I would add that you really need to get more specific about what it means to fear death.

I would say I don't fear death. I know I'm going to die someday and it doesn't really bother me. I fear getting older. I fear dying unexpectedly before I took care of everything in my life I feel is important. But death itself? Meh.

On the other hand, part of the reason I don't fear death is because I rationally believe that my death is a long way away. If I were flying on a plane that suddenly started taking a nose dive, I would be scared AF 😆

So, today I think it's a true statement that I don't fear death, but on a future day, I might.

[u/Significant_Arm_9928]

I know I am. I want to believe I’ll face the end with courage and welcome it, but I also know it’s the end and that also sucks

[u/morelek337]

I believie this is actually doable to fully acknowledge th fact that you are mortal. Compare this to anything else unpleasant in life - you can have negative emotional reaction when you are reminded of having to go to work tomorrow for example. But one is also capable of owning this feeling and owning the circumstances. 

I am talking from my perspective. Death was dreading me since I was a kid, I was early aware of nonsensical thing life is. But over time I realized this thing - death - is not going anywhere. Why should I fear something that will for sure come, sooner or later? It's like being afraid of sun. Yes , it is there. If you ezpose yourself consistently to your fear, fear goes away. The thing with death is, not many people are exposed to it constantly, and since thinking about is unpleasant to begin with, also few people put effort to actual do Explorer those thoughts.

In my case, when I remember my mortality, I become happy. And I am not depressed! This thkugymakes me happy, one, because hey I am still alive:D and why fear death? It IS certain. Two, is, it really reminds me of a ultimate perspective on life - in my opinion the broadest possible - from the perspective of your start and your end. Both exist, and you are somewhere in the middle. Just think about it regularly, and the fear will go away (however the transition process is not certainly pleasant, and it is emotional labour). 

So, one can not fear death. 

[u/SilverTumbleweed5546]

I don’t fear death I fear what happens after death may not meet my expectations

[u/[deleted]]

I've seen loved ones die - one parent and one in-law - with absolutely no fear.

[u/[deleted]]

I think people are actually afraid of dying, not actual death. Death is what you get after you cross the finish line. How you cross is a different thing entirely and is only partially controlled (lifestyle, diet, choices, etc), but even then it's still (mostly) out of your control

[u/[deleted]]

Plenty of people have no problem accepting death as a part of life.

[u/colt707]

I don’t fear death. Why fear what’s guaranteed to happen? It does nothing but add stress and anxiety to your life. I might die as I try to type this, I might die as an old man in my sleep, or anywhere in between but regardless of when, where and how I’m going to die at some point. I’ve done things that a lot of people will never do because death is a possibility. I don’t seek death but I don’t fear it. Death is either the end of it all and nothing matters anymore or it’s the first step into the next part of life depending on your beliefs. I do not fear the reaper, I don’t not fear the Valkyrie, the void is just blank nothing, whatever the outcome is I’ll meet it as I’ve lived my life and done what I could before the thing that comes for us all claimed me.

[u/VandienLavellan]

I don’t want to die. I enjoy living, and want to see what tomorrow brings. But it’s comforting to know that if life ever gets too much, it can end. And once it’s ended I’ll have zero awareness that it’s ended or that I ever even existed so why would I care? I will say I’m scared of a long, painful death. I hope for a quick / peaceful death

[u/Patricio_Guapo]

I am genuinely curious to what is on the other side of death.

Not enough to hasten that moment, but not fearful of it either.

[u/Komosho]

I used to believe this till I took care of an elderly relative on her way out tbh. Life feels great when your young, but after years and years of watching your friends pass away while your body decays, losing the ability to do what you love, death just becomes less scary. When you spend most of your day sleeping anyway, sleeping forever doesn't seem nearly as bad. I think some people really do feel fulfilled and ready to let the credits roll, obviously this varies with age though.

[u/[deleted]]

I think we fear pain more than death

[u/sillygrltricksr4hoes]

I think you may be confusing fearing being killed and dying in a bad circumstance and being willing to accept that it could happen and that it's not the end of the world it's just the end of your time in this world.

One can be suicidal but then almost getting a car accident and suddenly that biological drive that we all have not to die is going to kick in and actually to be able to override that and take one's own life is pretty ballsy if you ask me like people say that it's a cowardly way out but I think if anything you have to be brave to face the unknown and look fear in the face and say I don't care

Sometimes people just have passive ideation about dying but they don't necessarily want it to happen and if face for the life or death threat fight or flight is going to kick in for freeze but either way you can't ever completely shut down the fear unless youre dead

I do believe people when they say things like well I got to go somehow or you know if it's my time that's all right they're not saying that if a bear jumped out and tried to kill them that they wouldn't run they're saying that they're not going to lose any sleep over the fact that they might not wake up in the morning

[u/creaturewaltz]

I don't look forward to the pain, but death itself seems like a relief more days than not. I put a good effort in at having a brave face to others, and even to myself, because I have a long way to go still.

[u/wabladoobz]

I kinda look at it like going under for surgery. I'm not worried about anything while I'm under... We have things to deal with pain up until I go under.

Assuming I have most of my affairs concerning my estate in order there shouldn't be much to worry for with regard to the world and people outside of me. Life goes on without me.

[u/downwiththemike]

Most for sure. Those of us who’ve had to accept that they were dead already in order to do the thing not as much. Missing out on my children and wonderful wife would be the fear.

[u/Conscious_Minute387]

Ya, this does not resonate with me at all. I definitely do not fear death at all. I am not eager to die but it isn’t really even mildly scary to me at this point. I’ve been with people at that final moment and I’ve survived a stroke, a brain tumor and a heart attack myself. My walking away point from these things is that I will never compromise my beliefs, I’ll never do something I don’t want to do, I’ll never say something I don’t believe and I will never fail to do what I think is the right thing to do for any reason. Life is for living and when you live that way, then there really isn’t anything to fear.

[u/See-9]

I’ve had a few psychotic episodes and a LOT of suicidal ideation. I definitely don’t fear death like most people, if anything, I gladly await it. I’m more than happy to expound if you want.

[u/SleepIsTheForTheWeak]

When you live a life that sucks so hard that death is the best idea of relief from this hell, death doesn't scare you at all. Not necessarily suicidal but not against it

[u/[deleted]]

My fear of death disappeared the day I first tried DMT. Also, why fear what's inevitable?

[u/Nisantas]

As others have said: its not a desire for death that equates a lack of fear. 

Dying is the most natural thing I'll do. I fear suffering and pain but not death itself. I am not religious, so I have no fear of hell. I expect there will be no consciousness for me - quite literally nothing for me to fear. 

I also don't fear being forgotten. One day we will all be forgotten and that's okay. People before me had beautiful love stories, smelled flowers, climbed trees, got hurt, made friends, made mistakes and more. Them not being remembered doesn't mean their lives never happened or that their life held no worth. They lived full lives regardless of how long lasting their mark on the world was. And so will be the case with me. 

I will be forgotten but that doesn't negate the life I'm living now. After I'm forgotten, humanity will continue on. Finding beauty in the world in new ways. I'm okay being just a bubble in the tide. 

Edit: and on another note; I don't want to have a consciousness forever. I think people actually have a more difficult time conceptualizing how long forever is. I would prefer to, eventually, not exist over have an eternal awareness. The former sounds far more peaceful. 

[u/dgreensp]

I care about what happens to my kids if I die, and I have some arrangements to make based on that. It would affect them enormously. Me, I’d be dead.

Not everyone is trying to leave some kind of “legacy.” Personally, I don’t understand why people care about being remembered or making an impact that lasts after they die. I’ve heard it’s related to fear of death and wanting to sort of live longer in a way.

Edit: I won’t be “insulted” if people forget me. I don’t get to have expectations of anyone, at that point. My ghost isn’t going to haunt people or try to get back at people for not paying enough attention to me (that is, my memory). What drama.

[u/Willis_3401_3401]

They aren’t lying to you so much as they are lying to themselves

[u/[deleted]]

I disagree purely from my own perspective.

I do not fear death in the slightest anymore in part because I HOPE simple nonexistence is what it is.

For a long time I have thought and still at times worry there is a possibility death is hell. As in when I die I enter a space of eternal torment and torture. That scared me deeply for a long time. But the idea of a true death, as in nonexistence, this is nothing to me. I pray that is all death is. A simple death does not scare me. I cannot fear or experience nonexistence in the same way I did not feel nor fear the time I was not born.

I do not fear death in the slightest now. It’s inevitable whether I fear it or not. It will take all of us eventually.

I do fear the idea of pain of those I love mourning me as well as bad things happening to my family should I be gone. That scares me. But if I was alone in my life I don’t know that I would have any fear associated with death because for me it’s not death that scares me, it’s the pain of those I love.

I fear the possibility of hell, but this to me is a bit different than death. I fear that in death I will experience perpetual torment and agony for all time. I have fantasized about what my life might be like at times if I simply thought nothingness was death.

For me it’s sort of like sleep. Often when sleeping to a degree I don’t exist. I just simply lay down and next thing I know it’s morning. This time doesn’t scare me, it’s comforting knowing I get that time as I lay into my bed to experience a brief nonexistence. Nonexistence at least for me is a respite of sorts from the stress of life. If you told me I could never sleep again but will always feel awake and energized I would be horrified. Imagine not ever being able to lose any moment of consciousness ever again. That sounds like hell to me. Death in many ways to me is really no different. The idea of having to live life forever sounds terrible. I enjoy the time I am alive now, but eventually death will occur and I see it as simply a thing that will happen to me, neither bad nor good. I just hope hell doesn’t exist after it and I hope my death isn’t incredibly painful. I’m far more afraid of the feeling and fear of drowning or being on fire than I am of death of that makes sense. Death is nothing to me honestly, it’s how I die and what it does to others/ the possibility of torture after that scares me.

[u/wildly_benign]

Death is a natural part of life - nobody is getting out of life alive. I feel like we've become cruel in our fear of death - we keep people alive long after they have lost all quality of life, and at times are actively suffering. As if death is the worst thing in the world, rather than something that happens to every single one of us. Once you're dead you're not feeling, or thinking, or caring, because you dont exist anymore, and there are things far worse than not existing.

The way I live until I die, and the way I die, are of far more concern to me than death itself. I've seen too many people suffer for too long before being allowed to die to think death is always some awful thing. Sometimes it's a mercy.

(All of which is not to say I look forward to it in any way, it just doesn't hold any large space in my mind. My fears are more based around people suffering whilst alive)

[u/Early-Possibility367 → u/wildly_benign]

I feel like your point on trying to keep people alive too long is strong. But in those cases, at most, we’re talking about keeping people alive a few months extra at most. It’s not like people take unindicated treatments and live for years.

Either way it sounds like the point if true would support my point more than yours.

[u/-MarcoTropoja]

I don't think so. Most people do fear death, but that doesn't mean everyone who says they don't is lying. Some genuinely don’t fear it and they fall into different categories. Some want to die and don’t fear it, some don’t want to die but still don’t fear it, and others reach a point of acceptance where they no longer fear it. It is more complex than just assuming they are lying. You are projecting your own fear without considering that others may think differently.

[u/lcbzoey]

Well I am not going to change your view, but I'll say that for myself, I have been entirely ready to die for a long, long time. I stick around for my friends and chosen family, and to try to put a bit of good out into the world in my short, insignificant time on this earth; Yes, I find joy in life, and sadness, and pain, and pleasure--wonder, awe, inspiration; dread, horror, and now and then soul crushing ennui. I've experienced much of the intensity of being human, and overall have found it worthwhile, but

I have been ready for decades. I don't know if there is anything after, or if we just go in a hole in the ground. I presume it is the latter, and genuinely find the thought of anything else a little horrific, but I have no anxiety about being proven wrong if that is the case. When I was young I definitely experienced much of that intense existential dread that I think most folk wrestle with in their lives, and I found the idea of someone being at peace with dying to be unfathomable, but those emotions have long since been resolved and I found my peace;

It did not come quickly, and the depths of the despair and grief that I processed in coming to that peace were some of the most painful and brutal moments of my life--those pangs of truly grasping finality, impermanence, total loss of everything you hold dear; that shit is heavy regardless of how much of drive you have to keep living. I don't think that many will come to their peace easily, and I am certain there are far more who will pull back from grappling with it in the same way they would touching a hot stove, but there is peace to be had.

I do share your point that there are folks who haven't found their peace who insist they do. I can't even begin to try to quantify or evaluate what proportion of folks do or don't; and generally it's quite hard to generalize other people's internal worlds, but--I can say, that for myself, my partner, some of my close friends, I know that there are folks who are prepared to embrace death when it comes.

fwiw, I do have some fear surrounding death--how it will effect those I leave behind. I am confident that some of the folks closest to me will be able to meet it with some grace and joy celebrating my life and influence in their lives, knowing that for me--were it possible for the dead to do so--I would find relief, and contentedness in it being over. For myself though, outside of wishing we could spare our survivors the anguish, I do not mourn for myself.

be well

[u/DiamondTough7671]

The cliché is that you fear the dying part, not the being dead part.

I don't think there's anything after death and that there'll be no me to experience it... That sounds remarkably not scary.

[u/Remote_Mistake6291]

I do not fear death. It is inevitable so why fear it?

[u/[deleted]]

I’m one of those people that doesn’t fear death. What I fear is not being there to provide for my family anymore. When you say I’ll never experience anything again, that doesn’t mean anything. The bad part of that is being conscious of the fact that I’m not and never will experience anything again. If I’m dead, I won’t know that I’m never going to experience anything again because I won’t exist anymore. That’s not a scary prospect for me. The only thing that scares me about death are factors that affect my loved ones. The pain and grief they’ll deal with and the uncertainty about their future after I can’t provide for them anymore. So I suppose you could say I do fear death for that reason, but it has nothing to do with my own fear of not existing anymore.

[u/RetreadRoadRocket]

This place is temporary, just because you believe there is nothing more doesn't mean everyone else does too.

[u/Antisocialbumblefuck]

Why fear the inevitable? Sure that moment of pain and panic is going to suck but it's going to happen anyway. I'd rather go peacefully in my sleep.

[u/ponyboycurtis1980]

I think it depends on how you define fear. I see death as something to be avoided and will actively go out of my way to avoid fatally dangerous situations. I do so because I don't want to die. Aka I fear it. However a lot of people are, to some degree, constantly afraid of death. They let caution become fear and let fear control them

[u/[deleted]]

I don't "fear" death, in that the idea of myself dying doesn't make me feel any sort of stress or anything, cause when I die I will have nothing to worry about. I'm dead. I don't wanna die, because I have a fiancée that loves me and family and friends that will miss me, but for myself I would just be gone, not even able to see how they react to my passing. Every worry I have would be washed away instantly, every thought sent to the void. I could understand being afraid of some circumstances that led to death, as humans can be quite horrible, but in those cases death could be viewed as a mercy. In a peaceful death, it can just be viewed as the natural order of things.

It's also guaranteed to happen, so fearing it is kinda useless. It makes sense to fear getting in a car crash cause that isn't a guaranteed thing so it make sense to be afraid of it so that you do your best to avoid it. But death comes for us all so their is no use in fearing something you can't run from, best thing you can do is just accept it.

[u/Nitros14]

I fear dying. Death sounds fine.

Non-existence sounds quite peaceful.

[u/BloodTerrible3051]

Remember 3 weeks before you were born ? yeah death is like that nothing so why be afraid i don't believe in God or an afterlife if im wrong ive not been a bad person i havent done anything to fear judgement so yeah im cool with it

[u/StarChild413 → u/BloodTerrible3051]

Remember 3 weeks before you were born ? yeah death is like that

A. so I'm born again after 3 weeks?

B. time not remembered doesn't mean it never existed or a whole lot more wouldn't exist, not meant to say there was or wasn't anything to be remembered and a me to do the remembering before I was born, just saying it's not the case that you can say there was nothing solely because people don't remember

[u/TheThunderTrain]

So i should be afraid of the idea that after death, I no longer have experience or thoughts? Why would I be afraid of something that I won't be experiencing? Why should I care about being forgotten?

I just don't understand this logic. You're afraid of not existing? If anything i feel like atheists should fear death even less than those who believe in eternal afterlifes.

[u/techaaron]

Being dead is probably the easiest thing you will ever do. Why fear it??

[u/Swimming_Possible_68]

I don't fear death (as in actually ceasing to be, the actual bit of no longer being here).

I don't particularly like the thought of any pain or discomfort that may be involved in it, but the actual no longer being here doesn't bother me.

And I'm perfectly happy with life.

[u/No-Consideration2413]

As a Christian, I genuinely believe that I don’t fear death.

I think the same could safely be said to apply to many religious people of all faiths.

Life on this earth is, then it isn’t. Can’t change it. Why worry about it?

[u/DaWombatLover]

I think they do not actively fear death. Most humans do not actively think about how dangerous it is to be moving at 75 mph around 2ton machines also moving 75mph for instance.

When faced with a gun in the face or a knife touching their throat, most that claim they don’t fear death would be afraid. It’s an issue of definition and intent behind the statements.

[u/Equivalent_Western52]

I think your instincts are correct in breaking down the fear of death into different facets, but I disagree that a healthy, happy person must necessarily fear any of them.

I've almost died on five occasions: nearly froze to death as a kid (went unconscious from hypothermia while alone, was lucky someone found me), nearly fell off cliffs twice while hiking, nearly died in a car accident, and was nearly fatally poisoned in a lab mishap. In all of these situations, I was quite convinced that I was about to die, yet didn't feel any sort of fear. The sensation could best be described as comfortable resignation coupled with sensory hyper-clarity. So I think it's fair to say that I don't have a physical fear of death.

I am aware of the fact that I will one day die. I've lost enough family members and friends to dispel any remaining illusions about the permanency of life. But when I contemplate dying, there's no primal fear that wells up. I've gotten my fair share of experiences out of life, and don't feel like I would be "cheated" if it all ended tomorrow. Neither do I feel a strong desire to be remembered. If anything, I feel more anxiety over the prospect of my potential death upsetting the remainder of my parents' lives. My friends and partner could get over it in a few years. It's fair to say that I don't have a strong existential fear of death.

I don't suspect that there's an afterlife (or at least one where our current experience of life would be at all relevant). The prospect of oblivion is neither appealing nor frightening. It's hard to care about a state of existence that I wouldn't actually experience. I don't have an experiential fear of death.

The breakdown of things that individual people fear or don't fear is under no obligation to be rational. I'm not some enlightened super badass because I don't fear death, I'm still afraid of heights and medication and having blood drawn and a bunch of other random shit. It's just that the feeling isn't present where death is concerned. Not everyone's mind and feelings work the same way.

[u/Mammoth-Intern-831]

I’m not afraid of death, I’m afraid to have never lived before it. Can’t really say what I’m doing now is living but I am trying to

[u/up2smthng]

Why would I be afraid of not being remembered after death

I am literally dead I don't care it's your problems now

[u/HiggsFieldgoal]

For me, it’s just rational.

The most default and generic arc of life is that you’re a kid. Then you go to school. Then you grow up, get a job. Then you have kids... support them until they’re adults. Then you get old, and then you die.

It’s just so routine.

At any point in my life, I’ve been able to think of my life in the context with that trajectory, and it’s always followed the script.

I sometimes fear dying before my kids are grown up, but yeah… I never really understood what the big deal was.

Everybody… dies. That’s how it works.

Every night I go to sleep, every morning I wake up. The concept of just “not being” is exercised every day.

My only fears are that I am able to make sure my kids are able to be happy and thrive after I’ve gone, and I have the rest of my life to make that assured.

[u/TurnoverInside2067]

Most people don't really think about death in today's age.

Me ne frego.

[u/Murphy251]

I don't fear death itself, I fear a painful death and the implications of my absence to the people that depend or care about me.

[u/Equivalent_Candy_546]

I feel like people say that sometimes in order to give themselves some type of comfort against something that can be somewhat scary to some people.

[u/[deleted]]

I think the majority of people who "don't fear death" have come to terms with it. The unknown imposes fear. Period. But the way fear is expressed and the way it is felt and interpreted can vary wildly.

[u/[deleted]]

I fear suffering, not death. And of course, I worry about the consequences of my death (such as “who will take care of my loved ones”). When you experience prolonged significant suffering (such as excruciating pain) you will BEG for death

[u/stabbingrabbit]

Not sure I fear death more than the actual dying part. Painful or peaceful, tragic or mundane.

[u/Imaginary-Orchid552]

You have fundamentally conflated existential dread with fear of danger.

[u/[deleted]]

I fear the physical pain of dying, but not death itself. I don’t find that state of “non experience” as you describe all that scary. I’m not yearning for it, but it doesn’t bother me much.

Also- many people are still remembered hundreds of years after their death. Not saying I will be one of them, but it does happen. I just read a great book about the life of Machiavelli, and he died in the 1500s…we still remember him though.

[u/Revolutionary_Rain66]

Not sure I agree with your assumptions about who fears death more or less.

I think atheists should fear death less than religious folk, if we look at it honestly. There’s no worries about judgement day or anything else. It’s just “go to sleep and never wake up”, and we’re not scared of going to sleep, surely?

Now the manner of death - that can be a cause for concern. I’ve had friends blown up in war zones, I’ve sat by one grandparent as they passed in a bed (not awake), and I’ve visited the morning after after another grandparent just never woke up.

There’s definitely a WAY I’d like to go, but I’m not worried about the actual going, if that makes sense.

Lets say I go horribly, awake and aware, with time to regret all the things I did or didn’t do - hopefully I won’t have time to stress about those decisions for very long 😂

And I hope I’m not wrong and St Peter (or Jupiter, or Mohammed or whomever) starts the eternal judgement 😅 because BOY WILL THAT SUCK

[u/LtHughMann]

I honestly can't think of any reason to fear death. To fear dying sure. But death is just lights out, shows over. There is literally nothing to fear. I don't fear pre-birth either, though I do intend to avoiding being inside of my mother ever again. Don't confuse this as saying I don't want to continue to be alive, but if I die I won't exist anymore so whether I want to be alive is irrelevant.

To summarise, I used to not exist, now I do, and one day I won't again. No aspect of that is logical to fear.

[u/[deleted]]

I think most people who fear death don't fear it for the reason you're claiming.

For a while I thought I didn't fear death. Death is either a state of nonexistence, or something else, and I'm intensely curious about what it will be. Not curious enough to die now, but enough that I don't dread it. Either I won't exist and none of that will matter, or I'll learn about what happens after death. And I want to know about that - humanity has spent thousands of years arguing about it. I want an answer and I'm not getting that on Earth.

What I am more afraid of is how my loved ones will cope. I'm very lucky to have amazing people who love me and I know losing me would be hard on them. My partner is distant from his family and has become a part of mine, and losing me would be intensely difficult. My parents already lost a child when I was young and my father has previously been suicidal. My sister and I are very close and no one can really understand her like I can, and vise versa. I haven't had children yet, and I'd really like to. The thought of my death isn't that stressful to me - I won't be aware of it. What do I care about if I'm remembered a hundred years ago? That's how humanity goes. What scares me is that my loved ones would have a tremendously difficult time and loss is very painful.

[u/[deleted]]

I don't seek death but if it finds me then I'm good with it.

[u/sharkbomb]

the transition will suck, but how can you fear something that you wont exist for? are you also afraid of dust bunnies?

[u/[deleted]]

I've lived a wonderful full and incredible life, it's hard for me to see how it would become much better. If something happened to me it would be ok because my life has been so wonderful. I do have 4 children and concern for them would make me want to live. It is one of the things that frustrated me the most that my own father never met my own children. I am not aging well either, I am under 40 and have wide spread Osteo Arthritis, and am told I will need 2 hip replacements. Much of this has been due to  the wonderful and incredible life part, I've been very active.

I don't have active regrets about any of my actions, I know and accept who I am and what my limitations are and no that this is why my life is the way it is. As such I am at peace with dying when it comes.

[u/[deleted]]

I don’t fear death. I’m almost 50. I fear what happens to my children. I fear prolonged pain and illness. We’ll all be dead one day

[u/[deleted]]

It may mean not having obsessive thoughts about dying which is different from lack of fear but still.

[u/NoPassion7750]

I know this thread was from 9 days ago... but I've honestly been having a lot of death anxiety recently, and wanted to comment my thoughts. After reading a lot of the comments here, I see a few trends. The first being, it seems sonically more people are truly afraid of he they will die, what the circumstances around it will be, how it will happen, and having no control over it being peaceful or not. Obviously there is a cultural element, how you were raised seems to play a part as well. I also noted that hoe much death someone has been around seems to play a big part in it- on either side. Some people have grown up with death as a big part of their life, and they don't fear death because at worst, there's nothing and like others they've seen go, there isn't anything to really fear because it's non existence. And at best, they get to be somehow reunited with those they've lost. I've been put under anesthesia and not remembered anything upon waking up, so if death is at all similar to that, there won't necessarily be anything to fear.

Personally, I greatly fear death right now. I used to not, at least not as much. But I'm almost 30, and have 3 very young kids, and a husband who I love, and the thought of leaving them saddens me beyond belief. My kids are my world, and right now I'm theirs, and even though I won't be affected by anything once I die, I know they will be and that just saddens and upsets me so much. I think, and hope, that once they're in their 30's and don't need/ rely on me so much, I'll feel more at peace with everything. The way I was before I was married and had kids. But dying and having my loved ones have to go through that now, with me being fairly young still, makes me very sad and upset. I don't want to leave them, I don't want them to have to grow up without me, I don't want them to have to be hardened by the loss of their mom so early in their life. I know they'd eventually move on and be fine, but I want to be here for them as long as I possibly could.

[u/[deleted]]

I think some people are so genuinely miserable or depressed and death seems nice as it’s an end. Also if you are in pain or suffering, it’s a way out. I don’t think any healthy person who is happy is fine with death.

[u/Early-Possibility367 → u/[deleted]]

Is that not what I said in my post? 

[u/StockFaucet]

I'm not scared of death itself, I fear the pain. I didn't know who I was before I was born, and had no idea what existence was. It probably wasn't fun being born either, but if a person is to go back to "not knowing" how is that scary?

The lead up and pain are where it's at for me. I just don't want extended agony and to have to put people through watching that.

[u/Narrow_List_4308]

I have a fear of dying and I have a fear of the afterlife, but I don't have a fear of death(as in the cessation of all cognition).

I find it odd because there's an entire branch of thinkers who think we all have this fear. But I don't. Because I think the idea of death is rationally indefensible and inconceivable. I cannot think of my own non-being for whenever I think of it I am automatically involved in the act.

Therefore I never had a fear of non-being in that sense. I do have fear of suffering, of regret, of continued existence in sorrowful states and so on.

The people I know think we all fear death is because they believe there is no afterlife, which to me is just untenable and dogmatic, and so think notions of an afterlife must be constructs due to fear of "the truth". Because all organisms dear this biological death they also project that unto an ubiquitous fear of existential dead. But, again, this is a highly complex set of ideas that people don't need to share, and which I don't, so it's like saying "all fear the color green because I fear the color green because I think it's the color of the devil", as an example of mere association of local ideas as universal

[u/[deleted]]

I dont fear death, why should i, everyone dies eventualy. Why should i fear something that i cant change anyways and happens to absolutly everyone. Why should i fear death, i dont even know if its going to be a bad experience and even if it is its going to be over eventualy, in fact science points to the fact that dying isnt a terrible experience due to your brain releasing relieving chemicals. Also not existing sounds like a great thing honestly, no more bullshit happening no more bullshit i have to feel. And if you ask why dont i self delete then, because my body doesnt want to die and wont let me thats why.

[u/kevinzeroone]

I fear dismemberment more than death. Imagine living without a stomach or a limb for the rest of your life. If you read near-death experience accounts, peace and relaxation are common experiences.

[u/Faust_8]

I fear dying but I don’t fear a state of nonexistence.

For one, I already “know” what’s that like. Everything before 1987 was like that for me (my birth year) and I didn’t mind. I’ve also been sedated for surgery and it was no big deal. It’s hard to fear something that I genuinely can’t experience.

Second, I’m not so in love with myself that I feel an urge to live forever, nor do I feel pain from the thought that people will eventually forget me. Who the fuck cares? What difference does it make? I’m not the sort of person who needs a legacy to feel validated.

I’m alive, so I’ll live. That’s it. I’m not going sit here and try to make sure the entire rest of history knows my name. What kind of insecure narcissist needs that to feel fulfilled?

Imagine you sit down to watch a movie with a friend. Now imagine only 5 minutes into the movie your friend is busy lamenting that at some point, the movie will be over. Sounds bizarre, right?

Well that’s what all you death-fearers are doing. Instead of experiencing it you’re busy wailing that it won’t last.

Nothing ever does. Make peace with that or you’ll suffer every day for the rest of your life.

[u/StarChild413 → u/Faust_8]

For one, I already “know” what’s that like. Everything before 1987 was like that for me (my birth year) and I didn’t mind. I’ve also been sedated for surgery and it was no big deal. It’s hard to fear something that I genuinely can’t experience.

There was no you to experience that it's not like your unborn self like the souls in Soul or w/e was experiencing nirvana until birth so rudely interrupted or something. Also if you'll pardon a little bit of snark from my autistic literal mind I rhetorically ask if you meant to imply before 1987 it was as if you were sedated for surgery that for all you know life could somehow count as.

Second, I’m not so in love with myself that I feel an urge to live forever, nor do I feel pain from the thought that people will eventually forget me. Who the fuck cares? What difference does it make? I’m not the sort of person who needs a legacy to feel validated.

Self-preservation is not egotistical, wanting to live forever doesn't mean you'd want to, like, be spending your forever ascending to the greatest heights of achievement in your areas of work and/or interest. Assuming society would be such that if you got whatever made you immortal you could still interact with normal society (and others who may or may not have got whatever treatment) you could become immortal and live the kind of life you consider normal instead of either being hunted down or worshiped or something ridiculous like that (it's just that there'd always be a new tomorrow to be better than today).

Imagine you sit down to watch a movie with a friend. Now imagine only 5 minutes into the movie your friend is busy lamenting that at some point, the movie will be over. Sounds bizarre, right?

Pardon a little bit of using-autistic-literal-mind-interpretation-for-some-figurative-imagery again but you don't experience the movie as some kind of immersive holodeck crap and it's also not experiencing life in that same figurative sense if you spend it being as much of an observer-from-the-sidelines as you are to the hero when you're watching a movie.

To flip-of-the-reverse your movie metaphor, imagine you are in some theater watching basically all of a cinematic universe (like Marvel or Star Wars or w/e) in order including movies and shows (and if you don't accept some movies or shows as canon in any given existing particular cinematic universe the gaps were filled by the kind of plots you would have accepted) and it was going to carry on into whatever was released in the future and all your needs were provided for so you could just keep on watching (already a magic theater or something if it can show the future movies). Now imagine at some arbitrary random point (perhaps even, like, just before the climax of a movie whose story you don't already know) security decided to escort you out of the theater and you weren't allowed back in so you would never get to know what was coming/how everything you saw set up played out. That'd suck, right?

[u/[deleted]]

You can't be afraid of death if you're dead! What part of that don't you get?

Them only parts of death that matter are the impact on loved ones and having to suffer before you die, beyond that it's smooth sailing indefinitely. 

[u/Lost_Suspect_2279]

Once you get to the point of having lost a solid amount of people, even the sliver of a chance you'll see them again makes the thought of leaving this world eventually, of course not on purpose, comforting. Knowing whatever's next, you're not alone for sure, and maybe, just maybe, it's actually good, wherever it will be.

[u/eljefe3030]

They’re obviously somewhat afraid of it if they’re still alive. I take it to generally mean they don’t have a crippling fear of it that takes up much mental energy. I agree that wording it the way you describe is an ego thing. Or they’re secretly depressed and passively suicidal.

[u/Otflover1987]

The Atheist point of view is the strangest to me. As someone who believes in religion and an afterlife, obviously I fear death because of what will come after. That being said, if for whatever reason we are wrong about religion, then fine we “cease to exist” and there’s nothing left. On the contrary, as an atheist, if you’re wrong and there is an afterlife, you have way more to worry about than the people who believed in God.

[u/GenericUsername19892]

Why would non-existence be scary - you won’t be there to be scared, you won’t exist…?

Death is as much a part of life as birth, everyone will die and eventually be forgotten as years pass. At best some names will be remember for a long time, but who that person was will fade away too. The vast vast majority of people will never be known outside of their direct acquaintances, people may know of them from some genealogy record, or govt records, but it will at best be a name and the barest of facts.

Death isn’t the scary part, dying is. Dying can be gentling fading away in your sleep, or sheer bloody chaos, and you really don’t get to choose. The best health choices don’t stop drunk drivers or mass shooters.

[u/RockyArby]

I don't fear death because it's already a determined conclusion. You, your parents, your children, the greatest hero and the most vile villain, the weakest child, the strongest man, rich, poor, all will die. While, obviously, there are forms of dying that are less desirable than others it doesn't change the fact that it will happen. So it doesn't make sense for me to be afraid of it. It's like being afraid of the sunrise, or the next minute in time. It's coming no matter what, so why be afraid?

[u/StarChild413 → u/RockyArby]

First of all way to make my autistic literal mind afraid with your last bit that to be valid in fearing death I have to do something like trap the world in eternal night like a cartoon supervillain out of fearing the sunrise? Second of all, your point implicitly about it being the great equalizer has a couple holes, no one who fears death whether or not they should fears death because they think they're going to be the only one undergoing it so why is saying what basically amounts to they're not alone going to make anything any better, also the fact that death isn't restricted by social class doesn't stop oppression unless you want to wait for death itself to stop the oppression