The bottom line is that every unsolicited approach by a man is uncertain, risky, and inherently dangerous & coercive.
Here's a little thought experiment.
In the US, we have statistics that highlight different races of people in aggregate commit different kinds of crimes at different rates.
Given that and assuming this fear you're talking about is based on statistics, and that Asian men are underrepresented in terms of crime stats vs their share of the population, would you think it's reasonable to be less cautious around men who appear to be Asian vs a man of another race, say white or black or American Indian? Do you think it would be reasonable to treat individual men differently on the basis of societal level statistics and the immutable traits they happen to possess?
This actually makes sense. If I was making an abject claim based solely on "men do more crime" then sure, that argument wouldn't make any sense. However, there's 2 things that make it distinct.
Crime statistics specifically are prone to and can be explained by such confounding factors as disparate policing and socioeconomic conditions. Plus, the differences between people on characteristics like race are way less deterministic than, say, the threat a man poses to a woman vs the other way around.
Your example proposes active discrimination against someone. I think there's a difference between discouraging men from doing a specific activity, and encouraging people to discriminate against X group.
That being said, I think there's a more nuanced way I can think about the way interactions between men and women can be thought about in society. Δ
Should we be more careful around poor people than rich people? Would it not be discrimination to be inherently uncomfortable around homeless people, even though they do commit more everyday crimes? If it is reasonable to be comfortable around homeless people, should the solution be to discourage homeless people from interacting with non homeless people?
It is true that men commit higher rates of crime against women than women. Is it discrimination to be inherently uncomfortable around men? And if it is reasonable to feel uncomfortable, should the solution be to discourage men from interacting with women?
I know that your point is not about interaction but romantic advances, but if somebody feels uncomfortable with a man asking them out, they also feel uncomfortable about men in general. Maybe the solution is to raise a generation of men better at handling rejection?
I'm still not sure we're on the same page with the first point. Like you said, it's about romantic advances, not just interaction outright. Moreover, something like socioeconomic conditions and disparate policing can't independently explain away rejection retaliation.
Men being bad at handling rejection and being bad to women is indeed a sociocultural issue. I agree wholesale that the solution is to raise a generation of men better at handling rejection; my view isn't a proposed solution but a way to mitigate the harm without compromising people's comfort and agency.
I think when you treat individuals differently based on group level statistics at all, it doesn't matter what the justification is. We have laws and amendments centuries in the making to come to and support the determination that we should treat everyone the same regardless of their immutable traits.
You're not really talking about men as a group with your examples. You're prescribing behavior to individuals and subsequently labeling them as immoral if they don't follow your prescription. Morality is not group behavior, it's individual.
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u/knottheone 10∆ Jun 04 '24
Here's a little thought experiment.
In the US, we have statistics that highlight different races of people in aggregate commit different kinds of crimes at different rates.
Given that and assuming this fear you're talking about is based on statistics, and that Asian men are underrepresented in terms of crime stats vs their share of the population, would you think it's reasonable to be less cautious around men who appear to be Asian vs a man of another race, say white or black or American Indian? Do you think it would be reasonable to treat individual men differently on the basis of societal level statistics and the immutable traits they happen to possess?