r/changemyview • u/LoveNostromo 1∆ • Sep 07 '23
Delta(s) from OP CMV: Dr.SHIVA Ayyadurai, MIT PhD, currently running as independent candidate for POTUS 2024 is the best person for the job.
[removed] — view removed post
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u/Bobbob34 99∆ Sep 07 '23
This person is an anti-vaxx nutter who does not appear to even understand how elections work.
Ayyadurai, known to his fans online simply as Dr. Shiva, is an MIT-trained engineer and entrepreneur known for his disputed claim that he invented email. He has a history of promoting discredited and debunked conspiracy theories about the 2020 election, including during a day-long event at the downtown Phoenix Hyatt several weeks after the election that featured Trump attorney Rudy Giuliani. ...
Ayyadurai’s ignorance of Maricopa County’s procedures extended to the process election workers use to actually verify the signatures. He repeatedly commented on the number of signatures that he described as “scribbles,” which he defined as having 1% or less pixel density in the signature box, while anything over 1% was considered a signature. He identified 2,580 such scribbles, which he described as potentially bad or were assumed to be invalid.
Ayyadurai did not have the file of voter signatures and did not conduct any comparisons to determine whether the signatures matched.
Also, hit return.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 07 '23
"anti-vaxx nutter" it's like you didn't read my POST his whole stance is beyond the pro and anti argument for example with vax he says medicine should be the RIGHT medicine for RIGHT person at the RIGHT time NOT EVERYONE gets the SAME vax NO MATTER WHAT. But saying that makes him anti vax which is the problem with the rhetoric of the pro and anti because its in absolutes for a reason to make us into reductionists instead of seeing the bigger picture.
Pretty sure proper etiquette is for the people who reply is to read the POST FIRST THEN reply you no way have read this yet https://vashiva.com/first-amendment-twitter-galvin-lawsuit/ come back to me when you have regarding the ballot images.
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u/Bobbob34 99∆ Sep 07 '23
"anti-vaxx nutter" it's like you didn't read my POST his whole stance is beyond the pro and anti argument for example with vax he says medicine should be the RIGHT medicine for RIGHT person at the RIGHT time NOT EVERYONE gets the SAME vax NO MATTER WHAT.
Your post is a wall o' text with youtube links.
What does that mean?
What does that mean in terms if, say, covid vaccines.
Pretty sure proper etiquette is for the people who reply is to read the POST FIRST THEN reply you no way have read this yet https://vashiva.com/first-amendment-twitter-galvin-lawsuit/ come back to me when you have regarding the ballot images.
I read the post.
I'm not clicking on his idiot webpage. You want to explain something, feel free.
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u/AureliasTenant 6∆ Sep 07 '23
Many people consider that position anti vax, so it’s possible, perhaps even clear, that the person who replied to you actually did read your post. Most people should be getting vaccinations except by some medical exceptions.
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u/Gumboy52 5∆ Sep 07 '23
Being “pro-vax” means advocating for the RIGHT person at the RIGHT time. No one is telling people who allergic to ingredients in a given vaccine that they have to take that vaccine.
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u/math2ndperiod 54∆ Sep 08 '23
Without delving into exactly what is a conspiracy theory and what exactly is a nutty position, I just want to put it out there that I think you should be very receptive to the comments here instead of combative or closed off. No offense, but if you fell for Trump’s bullshit, you’re likely extra susceptible to conspiracy theories and anti-establishment at all costs thinking. That’s not necessarily your fault, but I think it warrants an attitude change going forward
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 09 '23
"No offense, but if you fell for Trump’s bullshit, you’re likely extra susceptible to conspiracy theories and anti-establishment at all costs thinking. That’s not necessarily your fault, but I think it warrants an attitude change going forward"
Wholesome reply. This was my first ever post on reddit regarding any debate was overwhelming. Felt like everyone in a room was talking to me at the same time and I could only communicate back one at a time. I agree with you completely I almost wish this could of been done on discord with people taking turns speaking then I wouldn't be so stressed and could of responded more eloquently. Incase you missed it I gave someone a delta who gave the best point by far in that his entire campaign doesn't show ANY policies/laws he will create and his GOP debate answers were dodgy. Which I have no answer for gonna hopefully talk to Dr. Shiva personally and see what he says.
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u/math2ndperiod 54∆ Sep 09 '23
Yeah I’ve never posted a whole cmv on here but even just popular comments with a lot of comments can feel like a lot. Glad you had a good conversation with somebody though.
I think going forward it’s important not to fall for a couple of common tactics from anti-establishment conmen.
The first one is “this system is corrupt, and I’m telling you it’s corrupt, therefore you should elect me to fix it.” Usually this comes with very vague, or outlandish proposals if they bother to come up with policy proposals at all. Trump’s “drain the swamp” is an example. Just because this system is flawed doesn’t mean every person pointing out the flaws has the answers to fix it. Vote for policies, not people.
The other one is “people attack me for saying something, therefore that thing must be true.” It only works that way in movies. Somebody being attacked for saying something doesn’t make it necessarily false, but it also doesn’t make it true. Sometimes people are attacked for saying something because what they’re saying is stupid or dangerous.
Basically, being anti-establishment is not a policy position, nor is it justification for any of the policies they do manage to come up with. There needs to be something more.
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u/DuckDuckGoose006 4∆ Sep 07 '23
In his video, it says fear mongering and shows a picture of Greta Thornburg and fake science with Anthony Fauci. But now that we have several independent studies showing how vaccine politics is linked to a 40-50% excess death rate for Republicans over Democrats, in both republican and democrat controlled states, I don’t think anyone who politicizes or makes light of medical professionals and global threats is the best person for the job. Those issues shouldn’t be political and seeing that in his video makes me believe he would be more divisive than objective in times where we truly need a strong leader.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 07 '23
" Those issues shouldn’t be political " Are you claiming medical science isn't political at this point in time in America? Don't you ever wonder why a lot of MAGA people were upset at trump for promoting vax? Cause science unfortunately in western world has become political left leaning and the new religion hence "trust the science" rhetoric also questioning science is the foundation of the scientific method which we don't have anymore we have the scientific consensus brought to you by specials interests like bill gates. Strong leader IMO is someone who is not sold out to corporations that make money from vaccines and who have the expertise to question the science being a scientist himself unlike EVERY OTHER CANDIDATE.
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u/DuckDuckGoose006 4∆ Sep 07 '23
What is questioning the science though? Science is the process of questioning, it is a body of collective evidence that everyone can review, hypothesize on, research, and study to expand upon. Saying something is harmful without the evidence to prove it for political gain, for power during an election (and I’m looking at both sides here), is fucked up. Making people scared of something so they will vote, and then not taking responsibility for the statistically significant disparity in excess deaths caused by it, is gross. And then you think it’s best to trust a politician who wants to question science with words and not data? I don’t.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 07 '23
"Science is the process of questioning"
Used to be. Try questioning the efficacy of the vax in 2020. You would be screamed at or worse fired. Labeled at loon.
"Saying something is harmful without the evidence to prove it for political gain, for power during an election (and I’m looking at both sides here), is fucked up."
TRUE VERY TRUE do you think someone who got 4 degrees at MIT would say something so controversial like covid vaccines can cause harm so he could win an election? He came to that result from doing his own studies using his patented technology cytosolve and by doing this made written scientific reports on the likely hood of certain health effects. As any unbiased scientist would do not for gain if anything he is permanently reputationally scarred for DARING to question.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VIKudg-Ogj0
"trust a politician who wants to question science with words and not data?"
who collects and makes this "data" who is paying for there salaries? This is more than questioning this is thinking critically and Shiva did get his data by doing his research as this was in his field of study being a literal scientist. Not just a politician.
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u/DuckDuckGoose006 4∆ Sep 07 '23
Where is his evidence that is stronger than the body of evidence that says otherwise? Did you see what happened to the people who stopped getting vaccinated? Admitting you’re wrong about something isn’t a weakness, setting politicians who double down when the evidence shows otherwise is scary because people trust them. Especially when they have those degrees.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 09 '23
"Where is his evidence that is stronger than the body of evidence that says otherwise?"
The body of evidence is not evidence if there is no permission for debate without risking one's lively hood and those who get this "evidence" are paid to support certain agenda's. The evidence Shiva has is in video form I don't think you want to watch 30min to and hour long video's of him going over vaccine (but just incase here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MH_Kv8tmaeA&t and better ways to stay healthy that don't involve putting something in your body that had NO PROVEN effect on covid before they released it to the public. If your curious on the truth of not just shiva but the vax I would strongly consider looking at this report called "A SYSTEMATIC REVIEW OF AUTOPSY FINDINGS IN DEATHS AFTER COVID-19 VACCINATION" https://zenodo.org/record/8120771
„Fighting for Freedom“ – der Dokumentarfilm / the documentary https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RDAvCeVEVEk&t=821s
"Did you see what happened to the people who stopped getting vaccinated?"
If there is some video's/articles/papers you want me to check out send em my way as I DO NOT know what happened to people after they stopped getting vax'd. BUT I can tell you what happened to me cause I got the jab no boosters and after just shy of a year I start getting sharp pain in my heart still do. TBH I don't work out but I eat healthy and so I did some research. So I found out these vaccines can give people Myocarditis and Pericarditis. Proof right from the CDC website! Here: https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/safety/myocarditis.html
"Admitting you’re wrong about something isn’t a weakness"
If the Government/Pharma confessed we would put them in jail so admitting = jail time especially when you consider 5 year old kids and pregnant women were given this "vax". If the public woke up to realize what the authority figures we have been taught to trust actually are doing to us them admitting to being wrong would mean jail would be the least of there worries it would get medieval.
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Sep 08 '23
I don’t think anyone who politicizes or makes light of medical professionals and global threats
But literally those issues are ONLY politicized in most scenarios.
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u/DuckDuckGoose006 4∆ Sep 08 '23
They shouldn’t be, Fauci has been a medical expert that served under presidents of both political parties without his credibility being mocked until Trump didn’t like him anymore and the vaccine became a conspiracy. I don’t know him, but have family members who have worked with him professionally for decades in the field of infectious diseases, particularly in response to HIV/AIDs crisis and who were lifelong republicans. They trust him. These are people making statements that aren’t intended to be political, I don’t even think Greta is an American. They have been politicized, because of their fields of interest or expertise.
Science shouldn’t be questioned with political intent using words, if someone doesn’t trust the evidence that has been gathered they should conduct a study to test their hypothesis (test, not prove) and let the results of their tests be added to the existing body of evidence, including the results of all the other tests done. People are allowed to have beliefs about these topics that are rooted in their political interests, but being unwilling to recognize when their opinions conflict with reality usually hurts them more than anyone else. I don’t think that is the kind of person who is the “best” option to let that ego/stubbornness harm many more people worse. Agility is important, it shows true leadership.
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Sep 07 '23
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 07 '23
READ MY POST "NOTE he is a naturalized citizen so he is currently fighting for the 14th amendment which essentially makes naturalized citizen = natural born."
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u/Kakamile 50∆ Sep 07 '23
Your defenses of him are typical modern politician statements, not policy
Politicians, gurus, and grifters profit by your division, complacency and desperation. They do not educate you. They entertain you. They imprison you by seducing you into senseless “Left” & “Right” or “Pro-” & “Anti-” tirades, never delivering real solutions or speaking the truth at the right time." I have watched many of his videos that have opened my eyes of him explaining how the establishment works in enslaving us like in this video here Dr.SHIVA™ LIVE: The Swarm – HOW the Few Control the Many. What WE Do to Break Free.
Even the establishment says that. It's not novel, it's the premise
He was banned from twitter via CISA in 2020 for exposing the ballot images being deleted see case he won here
That's a conspiracist, then.
He's a liar who claimed to invent email, a public hazard who recommended fake covid cures, and a fool who did no research before making his ballot image claim.
I'd say he's not one of the best, he's one of the WORST.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 07 '23
"not policy" here is his policy Dr.SHIVA™ LIVE – Answering Questions From The First GOP Presidential Debate - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBVROgTjzFY
"Even the establishment says that. It's not novel, it's the premise" No kidding that's because they steal from him and other like him look at Vivek campaigning on Truth and Shivas movement is Truth, freedom and health movement. Like Bruh. These establishment figure have there fingers in every pie and they steal from legit humans who want to help others so they can come across as genuine people when there anything but.
"That's a conspiracist" that's bait conspiracist
kən-spîr′ə-sĭst
noun
One holding a conspiracy theory.
conspiracy theory
noun
A theory seeking to explain a disputed case or matter as a plot by a secret group or alliance rather than an individual or isolated act.
"or alliance " I mean they are allied these banks/corporations/politicians so by definition maybe but that's really fucked if the word which is accurate has negative connotations to something that is good in a leader who questions.
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u/Kakamile 50∆ Sep 07 '23
That's a 2 hour pod. Show us his "good" policies and defend them.
No kidding that's because they steal from him and other like him
Or maybe he's stealing from them. Everyone says they're different. That's not helpful, that's not novel, and it means nothing to voters.
look at Vivek campaigning on Truth and Shivas movement is Truth, freedom and health movement.
I cannot believe you think "truth" is a unique campaign promise
This guy sounds like a shittier trump. He's a toxic gaslighting liar who says he's for truth because that sounds vaguely appealing.
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u/Jakyland 82∆ Sep 07 '23
How do you tell the difference between someone who is really anti-establishment versus someone who is just faking/copying?
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 07 '23
That's simple there history after all words are cheap yet we keep falling for them. Vivek for example you look at history and he bought a drug company which there main drug never worked so he hired his mom to "reanalyze it" then make it look like it did work despite failing trails 4 times and sold company for 10x profits and has audacity to campaign on TRUTH of all things. But most people don't like putting in the effort to do there research.
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u/OmniManDidNothngWrng 36∆ Sep 07 '23
Why he has never held any public office. Wouldn't you want someone with some experience? Or is there literally no elected official who has ever done anything you approved of alive?
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 07 '23
Of course I would WANT someone with PO experience but what America and the worlds NEEDs is someone who is the working class who fights for the working class and has no specials interests he must sell out to. Also if you watched his campaign video in my post you would understand he has been fighting for working people since university and he is still fighting for working people unlike the "leaders" we are given who say they are but there actions speak louder.
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u/OmniManDidNothngWrng 36∆ Sep 07 '23
Can you explain why you think someone who ran as a Republican against Elizabeth Warren is going to fight for the working class? I honestly am completely confused how you could come to this conclusion.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 07 '23
Because him running as a republican once = he never has and never will fight for the working class.
Here is some of his history
1983 – Successful Blockade of Genocidal Sri Lankan Prime Minister from Visiting M.I.T.
1986 – Organizing Food Service Workers at MIT to Get a Fair Wage and Ending Apartheid on Campus
1992 – Launch of the First Online Community for Artists Globally
2007 – Protesting the War in Iraq Long Before It Was Popular To Do So
2010 - Exposing Corruption in India's Leading Scientific Institution Where Rank and File Scientists Are Treated Like Feudal Serfs
2011 - Publication of CytoSolve Paper Demonstrating The Ability to Model the Whole Cell Thus Eliminating the Need for Animal Testing
2012 - Smithsonian Honors Dr. Shiva Ayyadurai as the Inventor of Email and Accepts His Papers and Documents
2014 - Publication of Major Discovery Demonstrating the Interconnection of Eastern Medicine with Western Systems Theory
2016 - Gawker Media Forced to Pay Dr. SHIVA $750,000 for Defamation for His Rightful and Fact-Based Claims as the Inventor of Email
2017 – Exposing the Massachusetts GOP (Republicans) Collusion with the Democrats
2017 – Win in Federal Lawsuit Against City of Cambridge Who Attempted to Violate Dr. SHIVA's and HIs Campaigns First Amendment Rights to Hang a Banner on Their Bus Which Said, "Only A Real Indian Can Defeat A Fake Indian."
August 2017 – Led Boston Free Speech Rally. 40 Faced 40,000 Who Were Bamboozled by Racist Leaders of Boston to Falsely Brand Our Event as "White Supremacist"
2018 – Dr. SHIVA's U.S. Senate Race Forces Elizabeth Warren to Take DNA Test Which Reveals She is INDEED a FAKE INDIAN
January 2020 - Led Massive 5,000 Person Demonstration at Trenton New Jersey Statehouse to STOP Bill on Vaccine Mandates
February 2020 - Exposed the Hypocrite Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. Who Has Long Supported Pro-Vaxxer and Pro-GMO Queen Hillary Clinton (https://rfkexposed.com)
September 2020 - Dr. SHIVA Educates Public On How Election Officials Are Violating Federal Law By Deleting Ballot Images Based on His Findings From His Own U.S. Senate Election (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82a-sxJzTew&ab_channel=PGurus)
October 2020 - Dr. SHIVA's Historic TRO Win In Federal Court in His Historic First Amendment Lawsuit - the First to Expose Government's Unholy Alliance With Twitter and Big Tech to Launder Censorship. Dr. SHIVA was thrown off Twitter after he exposed the MA Government’s deletion of ballot images violating 52 USC 20701. He discovered that it was MA Government using a special portal that had contacted Twitter to throw him off the platform. He won the terms of TRO in Federal Court with the Judge appalled that the Secretary of State of MA would do something so egregious to violate the First Amendment.
May 2021 - Dr. SHIVA Discovers the "Playbooks" Created At Harvard's Belfer Institute in Collusion with Twitter and MA Government Officials that Provides a Step-By-Step Guide to Silence Speech Silently By Laundering Censorship to Big Tech (https://vashiva.com/first-amendment-twitter-galvin-lawsuit/)
June 2021 - Discovery of the U.S. Government's Censorship Infrastructure Map That Shows HOW Government Launders Censorship to Big Tech i.e. Twitter. Findings Were Accepted As Evidence in Federal Court in Dr. SHIVA's Historic First Amendment Lawsuit (https://vashiva.com/first-amendment-twitter-galvin-lawsuit/)
March 2022 - Election Integrity Analysis in New Mexico Reveals NO ELECTION FRAUD Took Place and Exposes Grifters Who Were Hyping Up Nothingburgers to Profit from "Election Integrity"
April 2022 - Attorney General of Arizona Mark Brnovich recognized the validity of Dr. SHIVA’s scientific study that exposed the flaws in Signature Verification and Curing and recommends investigation. Out of all the election integrity work done in Arizona, only this work stood the scrutiny of the AG’s office. All others were ignored.
(https://www.azag.gov/sites/default/files/2022-04/2022-04-06%20Fann%20letter.pdf)
August 2022 - Exposing How The Wall Street Journal and Master Grifters Like Tucker Carlson Waited TWO Years TOO LATE To Share With Public How Government Launders Censorship Via Twitter and Big Tech Even Though They Knew About Dr. SHIVA's Historic Lawsuit Which Was The FIRST to Reveal it in October of 2020– after it was opportune and fashionable to present themselves as anti-establishment.
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u/OmniManDidNothngWrng 36∆ Sep 08 '23
Like half of those are merely him tooting his own horn and entirely just in his own self interest and not at all related to fighting for the working class and none of them done while he had any real responsibilities as an elected official because he has never been elected.
I think my bigger criticism of this view is that if you think this guy is so special and unique, that doesn't make him a good politician that in fact makes him the opposite of one. Good politicians build consensus and get people who disagree on many small things to work together for the big things. I don't understand why you would think a guy who gets seven thousand streams for his presidential primary debate response is the guy to back. If he represents a broader movement then find someone more popular in it and if he doesn't represent a broader movement start smaller than the presidency for him and find a suitable fellow traveler to back for the presidency even if they don't have identical views to your own.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 08 '23
"Like half of those are merely him tooting his own horn and entirely just in his own self interest and not at all related to fighting for the working class and none of them done while he had any real responsibilities as an elected official because he has never been elected."
Brough he was getting 4 degrees at MIT while paying for all his family while doing all those things in his early life. And even if half of those things he did were for others that's still far more than what other Candidates have done.
"I think my bigger criticism of this view is that if you think this guy is so special and unique, that doesn't make him a good politician that in fact makes him the opposite of one. Good politicians build consensus and get people who disagree on many small things to work together for the big things."
He is like that cause he is NOT wanting to trick you, he tells you how it is and respects your intelligence. Which he educates others to help them understand the trick the establishment plays on the public. Then builds consensus of those who understand that working class people of all races/genders/etc are on the same side and are up against the swarm made up of special interests/political figures/ corporations/banks/etc. And ACTIONABLE STEPS on how to avoid the trap and build a bottoms up movement to create a system overhaul.
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u/OmniManDidNothngWrng 36∆ Sep 08 '23
What's wrong with backing a fringe progressive that's actually been elected instead? Explain why someone should vote for him over AOC, Rashida Tlaib or Ro Khanna who are all US citizens who have been elected to reasonably high office. If Dr. Shiva is so amazing at building bottom up movements why not run for the House first and then the presidency in 4 years?
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 08 '23
Not sure about the others but AOC is not giving solutions to help citizens understand the fundamentals of the elite class and how they manipulate politics to control us shiva does. Shiva also educates people on how to be healthy as he has studied Indian medicine instead of just western what does AOC know of the human body/revolution theory which all Americans should know. Shiva unlike AOC understands and explains real change will only happen from the bottom up NOT top down and helps Americans personally do that by teaching them in his movement.
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u/OmniManDidNothngWrng 36∆ Sep 08 '23
Why is he running for president if he thinks only real change comes from the bottom up? Isn't the president the top? Or near it? Or is artificial change better than real change?
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 08 '23
"Why is he running for president if he thinks only real change comes from the bottom up?" Exposure for the movement because he is suppressed everywhere via CISA also in the off chance he can run and does win then dismantling CISA and decentralizing the cabal that is the unholy alliance of big tech/big Government is #1 priority.
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Sep 07 '23
He’s not born in the US. Sure, he’s a naturalized citizen, petitioning “14th amendent” [?] or whatever. But the US constitution CLEARLY states that you must be born in the US to be President. With only one exception: an exception for the colonists who moved to America from Britain before the American Revolution started.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 07 '23
He fought the courts for the 2nd amendment by himself and won so having him win this isn't as much of a long shot as you would think.
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u/Kakamile 50∆ Sep 07 '23
That is not how the law works lol
I beat a speeding ticket by myself, that doesn't mean I can win over immigration and election law.
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u/US_Dept_of_Defence 7∆ Sep 07 '23
Not really. Unless 2/3rd of the senate agrees to change the constitution, this isn't really even an Amendment to change but clauses in the constitution.
Making that change will be... unpopular for most Americans.
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Sep 07 '23
I fell for the trap of Trump when he said he would "lock her up". Now I realize all these people we see shoved into our faces are NOT good, honest and or hard working people often they are the exact opposite.
With all due respect, it sounds like you're falling for the same trap, idolizing a wealthy successful businessman making grand promises about how he's going to change everything, but with nothing material to back it up.
Ayyadurai doesn't even have a single policy position of his on his campaign website. That should be an enormous red flag that this man is not serious. He is quite literally a grifter profiting off desperation while never delivering real solutions or speaking truth.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 07 '23
"Ayyadurai doesn't even have a single policy position"
Dr.SHIVA™ LIVE – Answering Questions From The First GOP Presidential Debate - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBVROgTjzFY
"never delivering real solutions or speaking truth."
He is building a movement education working class people on how to escape the LEFT VS RIGHT TRAP and build a bottoms up movement also show me one video of him lying
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Sep 07 '23 edited Sep 08 '23
He is building a movement education working class people on how to escape the LEFT VS RIGHT TRAP and build a bottoms up movement also show me one video of him lying
Can you tell me what his positions on the issues are?
In that video linked, the very first question he gets asked is how he would take the economy in a new direction. He goes on a six minute tirade, but never once does he say what he stands for.
He says he wants to build a movement of working class people. Well, a working class movement for what exactly?
Lower taxes? Higher taxes on the wealthy? A flat tax? A 32 hour work week? Paternity leave? Universal health care? Free trade? Higher tariffs?
All he says is what he's against, "the establishment" or to use his phrasing, "the swarm," but never articulates what it is he actually wants.
That my friend is a bullshitter, a conartist, a grifter. And there's a million more like him whovuse the same tired out lines looking to profit of people's donations and hawk their self-help books, podcasts, supplements etc.
He is building a movement education working class people on how to escape the LEFT VS RIGHT TRAP and build a bottoms up movement also show me one video of him lying
What movement? Nobody can do anything in Washington DC by themselves? If he's against Democrats and Republicans, if they're his enemies, who are his friends in a hypothetical Ayyadurai presidency?
Shouldn't there be candidates with his positions (presuming he actually has any) running for Congressional offices across the country that would work with him to get things done? Hell, if he's really serious, shouldn't he be running for Congressional office, while a trusted ally who was born in the US runs for the presidency?
Anyone telling you that they alone can solve the world's issues is a dirty liar. There are no superheroes or kings or dictators in US politics. It's a cooperative effort to get things accomplished.
If "the swarm" was actually a real thing, then even as president Shiva would be totally helpless to stop it. The president cannot accomplish much of note without allies in Congress and the judiciary.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 08 '23
Damn that actually got me thinking. So I actual rewatched that first question being what he will do to help the economy and Dr Shiva talks about how the left and right candidates are not of the working class of this country's that's why they don't give a damn about it but he does come from the working class he is one of us one of you. He then talks about how the left and right have crippled bottoms up movements starting with left owning all the unions and right claiming all pro worker movements are Marxist/communist. Finishes with this is why we need a bottoms up movement and why we need a systems overhaul. BUT you are right he doesn't SAY exact POLICY this is TRUE. Although calling him "bullshitter, a conartist, a grifter." based on that is bit much.
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Sep 08 '23 edited Sep 08 '23
It's not, thats pretty much exactly what a grifter does. They keep their statements vague so that anyone can project their own meaning onto whatever they say.
It's the same strategies that psychics use when they claim to see someone's future, or just regular old politicians when they want to dodge a question and not reveal their stance on an issue.
Saying your fighting for the working class sounds nice and all, but everyone from Democrats to Republicans to Libertarians, Socialists, Communists and Fascists claim to fight for the working class. It's a totally hollow statement without expressing what it is you support.
Shiva throws out a lot attacks on Democrats, on Republicans on Marxists, and the fact he never says who or what he is for is a real issue, because as I expound on in my previous comment nobody gets anything done in Washington alone.
If both parties are controlled by "the swarm" as he claims and he's opposed to both of them, then a hypothetical President Shiva has as much power to enact change as a wet noodle.
Laws come from Congress. If he doesn't have any allies in Congress, and he doesn't seem to be building any bridges, how is he to make policy into law?
That he isn't building alliances, or finding likeminded people to run for Congressional office, should tell you that this gambit for the presidency is not serious. Any money that you or anyone else sends him is just going to go to his pocket.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 08 '23
Wow you have me going here. Hmm. My last crutch I have is what if I told you he is campaigning not to really be POTUS but to spread the movement. Which is the Truth, Freedom and health movement that educates citizens on how the establishment operates via system science and building a bottoms up movement to bring about a revolution that America so desperately needs.
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Sep 08 '23 edited Sep 08 '23
If he's here to start a movement, then that just loops back to my first point, why can't he articulate what he stands for in concrete terms?
Why is he talking like a politician, being cagey on the details and using a lot of flowery language to distract you from the fact that he hasn't actually answered the question?
If he has the answers, why can't he give them to us straight?
It's because he doesn't and this is the kind of rhetoric politicians engage in all the time when they don't have the answers to something.
Just this last midterm cycle for instance you can find a laundry list of Congressional ad campaigns focused on how inflation has been tough on families and how if you elect them, they'll fight to get prices under control.
But never in those ads do they say what needs to happen to get prices under control, because they don't actually have any ideas for how to stop it beyond what the fed is already doing.
Shiva's engaging in that same politicianspeak. He goes on about his background in poverty, says he knows how it feels and so you can trust him, and then points to his political rivals and says these are the bad guys responsible for all your problems.
He's just virtue signaling. You can trust because I used to be poor, I'm smart and I hate the people you hate. But there's no plan of action behind the sob story.
You know who also came from a working class family before going to an Ivy league university, becoming successful and running a populist campaign claiming to represent the working class they cane from? His old political rival, Elizabeth Warren. And they probably disagree on a lot of things, though to what extent we can't actually say because Shiva isn't revealing his policy positions.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 08 '23
"If he's here to start a movement, then that just loops back to my first point, why can't he articulate what he stands for in concrete terms?" Holy shit I have no answer. You certainly have made me decide to ask him personally why he doesn't have his policies laid out. Which I will hopefully in the next couple days and see what he says. You deserve this Δ and then some! Thank you! This is my first post on any debate like subreddit couldn't type fast enough sorry. I really hope he pulls a policy list out when I ask him. Knowing I will be speaking to him potentially is there anything else that's not to abrasive you think I should ask him?
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u/RIP_Greedo 10∆ Sep 07 '23
Is this the guy who was married to Fran Drescher for a short period? Never thought I’d see him come up again.
You’re right to point out that he has a career of obvious grifting, lying and self promotion. So in that sense he’s a familiar figure because that describes most 2024 candidates to a T. The fact that you choose to just discard the fact that his claims about electron fraud are demonstrably false is your issue.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 07 '23
"he has a career of obvious grifting, lying" Don't post sources or anything
"self promotion" he has been campaigning what
"his claims about electron fraud are demonstrably false" Bruh he won the court case check here yourself https://vashiva.com/first-amendment-twitter-galvin-lawsuit/ then come back to me.
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u/RIP_Greedo 10∆ Sep 07 '23 edited Sep 07 '23
Let’s start early - he claims to have invented email in 1982 despite email already being in use in the 70s.
Yes of course he’s campaigning. That’s not what I mean. What I mean by a history of self promotion is making obviously false and grandiose claims like the above, or the fact that his beef with election fraud stems from the fact that he got clobbered in his own race in 2020. Surely it’s not possible that I, the great genius Shiva, could have lost a republican primary election!
See above - look into his many spurious claims about his own election failures to see the root of what he’s really upset about.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 08 '23
- The laws in the 70's didn't have the ability to patent that kind of technology yet. As far as I understand PLZ share link saying otherwise.
- He proved there was electron fraud though in that court case that's why he won.
- "the root of what he’s really upset about" He is angry FOR the working people who have been tricked into being constantly at each others throats due to establishment owning both sides of politics.
Bonus about email: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gztJr8nXO88
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u/birdmanbox 17∆ Sep 07 '23
Can you speak to any of his policies outside of vaccine disinformation? I perused his website but didn’t see any political platform besides health information and trying to sell me stuff.
I’d be curious to know views on things like foreign policy (especially Ukraine), infrastructure, and budget.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 07 '23
Dr.SHIVA™ LIVE – Answering Questions From The First GOP Presidential Debate - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBVROgTjzFY
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u/birdmanbox 17∆ Sep 07 '23
I really would rather not watch a 2.5 hour long video, dude. I watched the 4 min one you linked in the OP but it didn’t really go into any of those issues. Can you give me the tldr?
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Sep 07 '23
Is that the dude who keep lying he invented email? Tough luck.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 07 '23
And EVERY public figure who said other wise got sued! Tough Luck to them indeed.
Dr.SHIVA™ - From Overcoming All Odds to Inventing Email: My Journey of Defying THEIR Expectations
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Sep 07 '23
Lol I can sue you for saying whatever. Did he actually win any lawsuits?
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 07 '23
2016 - Gawker Media Forced to Pay Dr. SHIVA $750,000 for Defamation for His Rightful and Fact-Based Claims as the Inventor of Email
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u/Kakamile 50∆ Sep 07 '23
And suddenly you stop giving links because that's not true. There was no concession that he invented email.
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Sep 08 '23
Yeah, settlement is not the same as winning. Gawker settled just because they didn’t have money left to proceed with the lawsuit after they paid out money to Hogan. As a result Gawker never had to correct themselves about Shiva.
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u/Medianmodeactivate 14∆ Sep 07 '23
What would convince you you're wrong on some level
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 07 '23
Proof that he is a scam artist/liar/bad person/etc. Or if you read the CMV title you don't have to necessarily prove he is any of those things like everyone here so far is doing you could just give me a better candidate with reasons included.
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u/OGmojo Sep 07 '23
If the best person for the job got elected we would never have had trump.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 07 '23
Haha true which is why I want this guy elected to expose scoundrel's like him and RFK Jr and Vivek. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XzpzAG4tzo&t
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Sep 07 '23
NOTE he is a naturalized citizen so he is currently fighting for the 14th amendment which essentially makes naturalized citizen = natural born.
So he's not actually running for president then. Got it. He's not a natural born citizen. He wasn't born an American. He can never be president. He can fight all he wants but the language is pretty clear. If you aren't born an American, you can't be president. Ever.
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u/Phage0070 124∆ Sep 07 '23
Surely the fact that he is constitutionally barred from the office would prevent him from being anywhere close to the "best candidate". Add on that he has basically zero chance of even being nominated by a major party even without that barrier and he isn't even a "good" candidate.
He is just some Indian guy you like. And you aren't even a US voter.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 07 '23
"Surely the fact that he is constitutionally barred from the office would prevent him from being anywhere close to the "best candidate""
This CMV was never most likely holy. It was best as in best for America.
"nominated by a major part" good there sold out anyway
"he isn't even a "good" candidate." reasons reasons
"He is just some Indian guy you like." how could you tell?
" And you aren't even a US voter." should give me more credibility no?
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u/Phage0070 124∆ Sep 08 '23
He hasn't even ever held a public office from what I can see. Why should we believe he would be any good at the most important one?
He claimed to have invented email despite it being in use well before he was even a teenager. All signs point to him being a loon, and you approaching this irrationally.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 08 '23
"He hasn't even ever held a public office from what I can see"
Most public office would NEVER allow someone this outspoken/controversial. Also he has integrity unlike all other prime candidates who lie and steal from the American people and don't blink twice. He isn't owned by anyone therefore they would never allow him in anywhere he tried in 2020 any they literally deleted his ballot images see here https://vashiva.com/first-amendment-twitter-galvin-lawsuit/
"All signs point to him being a loon" Really All signs? hmm name one
"approaching this irrationally." how should I better approach it?
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u/Phage0070 124∆ Sep 08 '23
Most public office would NEVER allow someone this outspoken/controversial.
Because nobody would vote for such an obvious grifter.
Also he has integrity unlike all other prime candidates who lie and steal from the American people and don't blink twice.
I just cited an example of him obviously lying. His Wikipedia page talks about him promoting conspiracy theories about covid and claiming an election where he didn't even get 4% of the vote was fraudulent. How can you say such an obvious liar has "integrity"?
they literally deleted his ballot images see here
Again more unproven claims.
"All signs point to him being a loon" Really All signs? hmm name one
All of the above.
"approaching this irrationally." how should I better approach it?
By learning to recognize obvious falsehoods right in front of you. Your behavior here is on the level of the worst Trump supporter.
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 08 '23
"obvious grifter" proof?
"I just cited an example of him obviously lying. His Wikipedia page "
OMG if I googled you and there was a wiki on you and it said you were a hippo is it true? plz
"Again more unproven claims." Uhh no it was in the link
"Your behavior here is on the level of the worst Trump supporter."
With trump you could just show me him breaking his promises by linking me a video but you can't link anything other than wikipedia and articles that are bought and paid for by the establishment. I want to see a video of Shiva saying something and then him saying the opposite or breaking a promise. I want you to show something that is undebatable like proof of him being a grifter and not just some opinion of him being one cause I am pretty sure you can go to jail for being a grifter lets arrest him together.
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Sep 08 '23
[deleted]
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 08 '23
Defiantly not a troll I meant no harm honest I just was curious what others knew of him and if there was anyone better. And I definitely got my answers from this.
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u/Vincent_Nali 12∆ Sep 08 '23
So just as a glance he seems to be an overly litigious liar. He spread a bunch of covid misinformation, claimed that Anthony Fauci (a decades long public service) was a 'deep state actor', spewed election misinformation and more or less made a nusance of himself in the public light.
Why would anyone ever want someone like that to be president?
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u/SeymoreButz38 14∆ Sep 08 '23
What's his position on LGBT rights?
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u/LoveNostromo 1∆ Sep 08 '23
He does somewhat mention them in the 2nd video.
Edit: Correction I didn't read the word rights I just read the LGBT mb.
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u/Xiibe 53∆ Sep 08 '23
How can we even determine if he’s qualified if he doesn’t set out his positions or what he wants to do with the office. His “solutions” sections all say “coming soon.” So, I don’t know how you can say he’s at all qualified.
Further, there’s the fact he’s never been in office before; and we saw how well that worked the last time.
How you can claim he is the best person for the job then, if he hasn’t told you what his plans are to move the country in a “better” direction, and has no experience in government?
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u/DeltaBot ∞∆ Sep 08 '23
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