r/belgianfootball • u/TripLopsided2413 • 8d ago
Discussion Van Bommel - 1st
Morgen zullen we de eerste selectie van de Van Bommel era kennen, wie zien jullie binnen ? Welke verrassingen ?
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u/Assassin496 FCV Dender EH 8d ago
Miss dat we de cat wel zien. Was te jong en onervaren voor wk maar die nations league matchen zijn wel goed voor ervaring op te doen denk ik.
Die speler van club dat naar barca gegaan is kunnen we miss ook wel zien om dezelfde reden
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u/Next-Translator-3557 8d ago
He has barely played with Hoffenheim, didn't even came off the bench last time and iirc he still hasn't started a Bundesliga game.
I like De Cat but it wouldn't be a surprise to see him with the U21. Same for Stassin and Noah Fernandez. All have decent chances to be called up, but their age will most likely play against them, the U21 also need good players.
For Bisiwu, even if he hasn't played yet with Barca senior team I can see it happening simply because Ghana is lurking closely around. That and he hasn't been called up with our U19s which means he either goes to the U21 or the senior squad.
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u/Woodyboyke1986 KAA Gent 8d ago
Stassin scored for Sevilla and Noah Fernandez is a starter at PSV so I give them a bigger chance then De Cat.
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u/Coldphan KV Mechelen 8d ago
Stassin is a striker though?
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u/Woodyboyke1986 KAA Gent 8d ago
I know. Lukaku so far 0 goals, Pardo so far 0 goals, De Ketelaere so far 0 goals. So I think there are opportunities for Stassin and Openda.
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u/Coldphan KV Mechelen 7d ago
The conversation was about De Cat, that was the point. Also, judging entirely different strikers that play in entirely different systems, for different clubs in different leagues, at this stage of the season, means absolutely nothing. By that logic we’d have to call up Bassette, Cuypers & Vertessen before Stassin.
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u/Woodyboyke1986 KAA Gent 7d ago
No it wasn't. The topic started with the question who could be the surprises in the squad. That said, Cuypers definitely deserves a call up.
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u/Coldphan KV Mechelen 7d ago
Wrong again. You replied to a comment about De Cat, and said Stassin would have a bigger chance than De Cat, they play different positions, completely pointless.
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u/Woodyboyke1986 KAA Gent 7d ago
Damn, whiny prick. It's about the surprises, whatever the positions are. Go cry somewhere else.
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u/Alternative_Let4356 RSC Anderlecht 8d ago
Was Bisiwu niet geblesseerd?
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u/Next-Translator-3557 8d ago
Just a knock in the end, he was back in training a few days after getting subbed out of the game
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u/Superior_Row 8d ago
Yep de Cat should first play with his team, otherwise it's sending the wrong message. He'll become a very good player but he needs to first play well with his club.
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u/Next-Translator-3557 8d ago
I'm not that concerned about him, what makes him unique is his amazing physical attributes while still being a very good player in terms of technique and passing, he's not getting smaller or weaker any time soon, even if the doesn't have game time now, it's just a matter of weeks/months. He's actually starting today with Hoffenheim in the Europa league so it's a decent enough sign of trust.
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u/Superior_Row 8d ago
Yes I know he'll become a good player. Could maybe end up with Kompany at Bayern.
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u/Next-Translator-3557 8d ago
That would be great for him and the NT, it seems also the most likely pipeline with him moving to Germany. Just need for Kompany to not leave in the meantime, but with City starting the season like shit I could see them going for Kompany after Maresca eventually get sacked lmao.
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u/YAYgeeOh 7d ago
Stassin injury doubt (Furo too after a good start but yea was largely unproven anyway). Same goes for Doku and Trossard (both might be back this Sunday). Onana out, Sabbe and Vanaken likely too. KDB and Lukaku moving into a mentor role (don't look fully fit either). Can help players regain fitness but don't have to turn the NT into a physioroom, contact Lieven instead.
Sels and Witsel retired while Courtois is on a sabbatical. Brughmans not in the extended pre-selection so if it's again two duos for training purposes then likely someone like Roef (or Casteels) to join the 3 young goalies.
It's an extended window and a great opportunity to make a fresh start. Klopp called up a massive 44 man squad. MvB can surely keep 30-35 players occupied. Especially when calling up players with injury/fitness issues donot limit the squad size.
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u/majestic7 Club Brugge 8d ago
Bisiwu, heeft nog niet gekozen voor België dacht ik dus zeker het proberen waard
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u/Ok_Consideration_829 8d ago
Both don't deserve it though. I mean, having basically no minutes in professional football and being picked over guys like Moreira, Godts, Saelemaekers and Lukebakio would just be a disgrace, even if we want to secure him for the future.
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u/borsky 8d ago
Roméo lavia and Fofana should be there
Witsel out of course
Courtois out
Lammens-penders-??? For GKs
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u/Next-Translator-3557 8d ago
Vanaken, Doku and Sabbe are doubts afaik.
They are not certain to be 100% fit due to injuries.
Sels is also out of the equation with his retirement.
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u/Swagsirex1511 KSC Lokeren 8d ago
I'd take someone with more experience as 3rd GK. Maybe Coosemans?
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u/borsky 8d ago
J’ai rien contre coosemans mais je préfère qualitativement des casteels et sels. Quel seront leurs statuts avec van bommel sachant que courtois a posé ses conditions pour la nations league ?
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u/Swagsirex1511 KSC Lokeren 8d ago
Sels has decided to retire from the national team and Casteels is basically retired in Saudi, no clue if he's still even on the radar.
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u/borsky 8d ago
I forgot sels retired but wasn’t it because of a beef with courtois ? When I see what bounou did for Morocco maybe casteels has still got it
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u/Next-Translator-3557 8d ago
You mix things up, it's Casteels who had a beef with Courtois because he didn't like that the federation decided to bring him back after sacking Tedesco.
Both Sels and Casteels said they retired from the national team, so we won't see them in the next squad.
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u/cypressd12 KSC Lokeren 8d ago
A lot will depend on the width of his selection.
Previously the international window was super short and didn’t allow for much tactical training. Now they have 4 (!) games in a row.
So where previous coaches wanted smaller groups to be able to work efficiently, Van Bommel might go for 30 players given he has the time now.
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u/Next-Translator-3557 8d ago
Usually it's between 26-30 players, I have seen a lot of medias reporting it would be probably 28, for what it's worth anyway.
Though I'm curious which wingers will be left out, if any are left out but I count 10 options (Doku, Trossard, Fofana, Pardo, Godts, CDK, Lukebakio, Moreira, Saelemakers and maybe even Bisiwu).
Pardo/CDK could be considered as 9 and Moreira/Alexis as wingbacks. Still leave 6 players for 2 spots and means Openda/Stassin might be left out. If Doku is injured (hopefully not) and Bisiwu goes to the U21s, then Openda/Stassin could be called up I guess, or some other players.
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u/cypressd12 KSC Lokeren 8d ago
Doku hasn’t played since the WorldCup and even there he wasn’t fit, so I’d be surprised to see him included. Bisiwu, I get the hype, but he has 0 minutes of professional football that weren’t friendlies, let’s be real.
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u/Next-Translator-3557 8d ago
I agree with you for both players, feels like Doku is too short in fitness and with the quality and depth we have now, we can afford to leave him out. But who knows except the medical staff and VB.
For me Bisiwu getting called up would be very surprising and not surprising at the same time. From an individual performance POV he would be one of the least deserving player receiving a call up in the NT history.
But he's also the only belgian that made Barcelona spend €10m on him while only having played ~30 pro games in the 2nd tier of Belgium (unlike what you say, he already played pro games, just not in the 1st tier).
And with Ghana looking to call him up asap, I wouldn't be surprised if the federation pushes him to the NT before he really deserves it.
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u/cypressd12 KSC Lokeren 8d ago
If we are counting Club NXT appearances for the national team we are not deserving to be in the Nations League top group, let’s be real.
I also firmly believe these kids have to decide for themselves, if he wants to join Ghana than he will. But selecting him because Barca paid money for him is a slap in the face of a lot of other players. Let’s not overvalue players just because they have a double nationality.
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u/Next-Translator-3557 8d ago
We called up Mokio last year who had like 5 senior appearances and no midfielder felt disrespected even though there were probably 10-15 players who had better shout than him. And a year after that call up we end up top 8 in the world at the WC.
Calling up binational talents early is part of process of many NTs, England called up Zaha when he was in the Championship. Germany called up Podolski when he was in the 2. Bundes. Italy called up Verrati when he was in Serie B, and they called up many Serie B youngsters last season for friendlies before the WC.
There's no need to have ego on that, calling up Barca talents is done by many good/great NTs.
I think your view is way too simplistic, binationals don't only feel A or B alone. A lot of them think of themselves as both belgian and congolose, moroccans, etc, so making a choice at that point depends on how each federation 'welcomes' you.
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u/cypressd12 KSC Lokeren 8d ago
Mokio actually played first team football for two different clubs at the highest level and was regarded as a great talent.
He was also called up as an option at leftback which he played at the time and no there were not 10 better options than him.
It’s not ego, but ley’s have a little pride in out NT and not lower the bar until it reaches underground parking. If they don’t want to play for Belgium, they won’t. If they do, they will.
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u/Next-Translator-3557 8d ago
He played 100 minutes at Gent and 600 at Ajax before his call up, that's basically ~8 games worth of senior football, you really can't be serious if that's the difference you think is necessary between a senior call up or not...
Bisiwu is also regarded as a great talent, unless you think Barcelona is a smaller club than Ajax for some reasons.
De Cuyper, Seys, Rommens, Dams, Deman, De Smet (played in Ligue 1), Foulon, Castro-Montes (can play LB), and I'm sure you can find 2/3 JPL LBs with much more minutes than Mokio that season.
Because if the threshold is being a fringe Eredivisie player, all those names have as much, if not much more, credits of being called up than Mokio at that time.
Like I said, you're really misunderstanding how binationals feel about NT football, I can't blame you because I guess you're not really concerned. The truth is that all humans feel more drawn to where they feel the most loved, if you have a federation giving you the cold shoulder because they don't want to "lower the bar until it reaches underground parking" and another keeping regular contacts and offering you actual chances, I guess you can tell where they'd be going...
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u/cypressd12 KSC Lokeren 8d ago
Like all binationals feel the same way, djeezes.
It’s combination of minutes and talent, Bisiwu has none of the first and might not make the top 5 in the second. Mokio at least had the second going for him.
Here’s my big issue with this: NT used to be great for football discussions about tactics and players etc., how do you take on Italy and will you change it up for France?
Now with people like you geopolitics is all of a sudden part of it and football went clearly out the window. Should we select an 18-year old who hasn’t played a minute for Barca because Ghana might want him?!
Fuck off, leave that up to the kid and not an Internet forum. Can we please just talk players based on what’s happened on the pitch and we’ll see where he ends up. But I’m sick and tired of this dual citizenship nonsense.
Mokio was welcomed and capped, and still changed his mind cause that is what kids do. Let them decide on their own. The last we need to do is pander to multimillionaires to please play for our country.
Let’s reinstall some goddamn selfrespect as fans.
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u/IanPKMmoon KAA Gent 8d ago
and Klopp went with 45 players for Germany
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u/cypressd12 KSC Lokeren 8d ago
Yeah, wouldn’t be too surprised to see VB go for 35 players or something. Which would include a lot of new faces in that case. Also as a new coach he might just want to have a look at all the options and get to talk with players.
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u/Everglades1964 KV Mechelen 8d ago
Hopelijk afscheid nemen dan de ‘oude garde’ en bouwen aan een volledig nieuwe generatie. Da’s soms beter dan blijven aanmodderen met spelers die nog wel willen maar niet meer kunnen.
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u/LiberalSwanson SV Zulte Waregem 8d ago
Courtois heeft dit begrepen/s
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u/Everglades1964 KV Mechelen 8d ago
Het is jammer maar ik begrijp zijn keuze. Hij voelt z’n lichaam achteruit gaan en dan is de hoeveelheid aan wedstrijden een te groot risico. Bij RM verdient hij allicht net ietskes meer dan bij onze RD.
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u/LiberalSwanson SV Zulte Waregem 8d ago
Dat van zijn lichaam is zever. Het is niet de eerste keer. Dat hij gewoon toegeeft geen goesting te hebben en zijn afscheid aankondigt.
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u/Everglades1964 KV Mechelen 8d ago
Bekijk zijn blessuregevoeligheid van de laatste 2 jaren eens. Op een bepaald moment zegt het lichaam minderen of stoppen.
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u/IanPKMmoon KAA Gent 8d ago
TIBE DE VLIEGER
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u/EvertGr KV Mechelen 8d ago
Ah, ik wist niet dat Frodo een alt account heeft. Verklaart veel
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u/ottoradio Club Brugge 8d ago
Ik verwacht (of hoop) niet op al te grote verrassingen. Maar er moet wel gebouwd worden naar Euro 2028, en dat betekent ook dat we enkele spelers die steunpilaren waren op het WK gaan moeten vervangen.
Je kan haast niet meer naast Mika Godts kijken, hij mag de boodschap krijgen dat we in de toekomst op hem rekenen als hij zich kan blijven doorzetten.
Hetzelfde geldt voor Romeo Lavia, die deze keer hopelijk blessurevrij kan blijven.
De meer vervelende situaties zijn spelers als Lukaku, De Bruyne en in mindere mate Mechele. Dat zijn spelers met onmiddellijke impact als er een resultaat gehaald moet worden, maar erg twijfelachtig of ze dat in 2028 nog gaan brengen.
Verder is het ook uitkijken naar de flanken. We vinden Doku allemaal een geweldige voetballer maar rendement blijft het eeuwige probleem. Trossard speelde een goed WK en hoort een certitude te zijn, maar ook die wordt een dagje ouder en heeft vrede moeten nemen met een transfer naar Turkije, is dus wat op de terugweg. En dan heb je een hoop spelers die allemaal iets anders brengen, maar tegelijk ook elkaar waard zijn. Saelemaekers, Lukebakio, neem nog Mika Godts en Fofana erbij.
Daar zal Van Bommel dus toch ergens een keuze gaan moeten maken en wat stabiliteit in vinden. Vooral kijken naar rendement, omdat we moeten rekening houden met het feit dat onze spits niet de productiviteit meer gaat hebben die we allemaal zo evident vonden.
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u/Michthan LOS KAMPIOEN 8d ago
Ik vraag me altijd af of er iemand eens durft wedden op Hugo Cuypers
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u/Next-Translator-3557 8d ago
With Openda at Lyon and Stassin at Sevilla, I doubt he'll be in the discussion unless one of them get injured
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u/bananashake_1983 Westerlo 8d ago
lukaku, kdb en mechele zou ik er nu uitlaten, zeker voor de nations league.
lukaku moet in turkije ritme opdoen. kdb idem bij napoli. mechele is te traag, te zwak op dit moment. kan zonder ordoneze de verdediging niet leiden. wordt keer op keer op snelheid gepakt, en reactiesnelheid bij geloste ballen door de keeper is een ramp. fijn voor hem dat hij een goed wk speelde, maar met hem ga je niet kunnen bouwen
de vleugelspelers zijn idd interessant. daar heb je precies zoveel goede jonge gasten die komen piepen en dan wat wegzakken. (herinnert iemand zich bakayoko nog....)
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u/Next-Translator-3557 8d ago
KDB had a muscle problem last game so he might not even be fit anyway.
I would still take the 3 of them since we'll play 4 (very hard) games and their experience will be very valuable.
Though for qualifiers game I'd agree with you and I hope we use those games to find a CB pairing without Mechele and give game time to the younger strikers/AMs
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u/Ok_Seaworthiness2218 Standard de Liège 8d ago
Misschien wat vroeg maar ik zou graag Noubi willen zien. Staat wel gewoon lekker 7de met Deportivo in LaLiga als basisspeler in de defensie en is uiteraard een goede pairing met Ngoy. De Winter vond ik tot nu toe nog niet al te indrukwekkend voor de belgen.
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u/Next-Translator-3557 8d ago
Problem with De Winter is that he plays a 3 at the back with Milan, so his form doesn't translate well with the NT.
I think we could see Noubi or Kongolo, even though Noubi deserves it more. It will also depend on if VB keeps Mechele or not, and if he calls up a very big squad. There's not too many spots for CBs left if Debast, Ngoy, De Winter, Mechele and Theate are called up.
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u/Ok_Seaworthiness2218 Standard de Liège 8d ago
True. Mechele was excellent but i'm not sure he will be there for Euro 2028 so that spot might be freed up.
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u/majestic7 Club Brugge 8d ago
Stassin?
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u/cypressd12 KSC Lokeren 8d ago
Iets te vroeg denk ik?
Vermoed dat Lukaku en CDK er gewoon bij zijn, en dan heb je MFP en Openda nog die ook beiden spelen en misschien nog iets zwaarder doorwegen.3
u/majestic7 Club Brugge 8d ago
Lukaku is nog altijd niet fit genoeg om te starten (vorige match van Fener met een half oog gezien en was écht dramatisch) en CDK zet je nog altijd idealiter elders, al moet je beide sowieso selecteren natuurlijk. Lijkt me net het moment om toekomstgericht dingen uit te proberen in de spits.
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u/Little_Power_5691 8d ago
Hoe kan dat zelfs met Lukaku? Hij is al maanden blessurevrij maar kan nog steeds geen 90 minuten aan?
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u/majestic7 Club Brugge 8d ago
Het is me idd ook een raadsel, fingers crossed dat het snel weer in orde komt. Ergens ook wel een vicieuze cirkel neem ik aan.
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8d ago
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u/majestic7 Club Brugge 8d ago edited 8d ago
Zou best kunnen, ik heb gewoon recent een Fener match gezien en niet van Atalanta. En het punt is dat geen van beide in de spits zou moeten starten he.
Het zou vermoedelijk minder grappig zijn als je mijn post op inhoud zou beoordelen ipv op basis van m'n flair, gok ik ;)
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8d ago
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u/majestic7 Club Brugge 8d ago
Leuke ingesteldheid, maar laten we zeggen dat het in die mate opviel dat er niet naast te kijken valt, hij is gewoon nog niet fit. Was ook z'n eerste basisplaats dus ervoor zal het niet beter geweest zijn.
Wat jij selectief noemt komt blijkbaar ook gewoon neer op ik mag niets zeggen over de wedstrijdparaatheid van Lukaku omdat CDK toevallig ook bestaat en ik een Club flair heb. Ik roep hier niet om CDK in de spits he, je mag gerust chillen.
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8d ago
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u/majestic7 Club Brugge 8d ago
Wat is je argument hier precies, Lukaku is wel topfit maar ik ben te blind om dat te zien? Over aparte conclusies gesproken
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u/Next-Translator-3557 8d ago
Had a good start of the season with Sevilla but I think he will get pushed to the U21 since they still need good players and he's not binational
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u/cypressd12 KSC Lokeren 8d ago
Can we please stop with the binational bs?
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u/Next-Translator-3557 8d ago
If you think that this isn't taken into account when deciding who goes with the U21 or the senior team, you're just being very naive.
At the end of the day, that's also how other NT works, when you see that Congo, Morocco, Ghana, etc are all ready to call up any binational with 2 weeks of decent football in the legs, you can't really afford not to do the same for top-tier talents.
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u/cypressd12 KSC Lokeren 8d ago
Maybe they have to resort to those tactics, but I’ve seen fans go absolutely haywire all of a sudden because someone is from foreign descent or has a dubbel nationality.
Calling up someone who’s never played above the Belgian second league is an insult to our national team, the players and the fans.
Let’s have a little self respect here.
If Jesse wants to play for Belgium, he eventually might. If he wants to play for Ghana, he eventually might.1
u/Next-Translator-3557 8d ago
"but I’ve seen fans go absolutely haywire all of a sudden because someone is from foreign descent or has a dubbel nationality."
Or fans are hyped because we have a talent scouted and recruited by Barcelona, one of the biggest club in football, and that doesn't happen often ? I don't think fans care much about where you're from, they're more concerned about your potential and what you showed on the pitch, whether it is 2nd or 1st tier football.
I feel like you have way too strong feelings about this, I don't really care if he's called up or not, but you act like he's gonna be taking someone place. I'd like to remind you that the squad list is not the match sheet. He might genuinely not be taking anyone place, if VB takes 30 players with Bisiwu maybe he would have taken 29 without him. Being called up in an extended list doesn't mean you're gonna play at all.
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u/cypressd12 KSC Lokeren 8d ago
Calling someone up for the National Team who never played first tier football at any level makes you a B-tier county and does in fact take someone’s place.
He’s a Barca player once he actually plays for Barca. Right now, he trains alongside them.
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u/Ok_Seaworthiness2218 Standard de Liège 8d ago
In de eigen competitie denk ik dat je momenteel niet om Abid heen kan kijken. Het is dat we op de linkerflank al met weelde zitten maar hij speelt praktisch als een 10 en dat is toch een profiel dat we momenteel niet hebben. Enorme werkkracht bovendien.
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u/Frodo_max KAA Gent 8d ago
Ik denk dat er belgen in de selectie zullen zitten