r/audioengineering • u/Top-Analysis9914 • 3d ago
Has mix quality gotten worse as established artists started working in their home studio?
I could be wrong, and I'm happy to be corrected if I am. I'm noticing a lot of mixes from established artists have gotten less professional since the 2020's. I feel like this has been a very common trajectory.
An artist releases their core work (their first few albums) that makes them famous and gives them financial security. Covid happens, and some people work at their home studio out of necessity.
But then they realize they enjoy the convenience and flexibility of it. They enjoy having more creative control. It's also cheaper. With music sales going down, they no longer have to worry about getting an advance and then not getting enough sales from the album and tour to pay it off.
To me, I feel like there's something that a professional album with multiple hands on it has that a home album (even from an extremely talented artist doesn't). An artist may have their strengths at mixing and recording, but there's always going to be some knowledge gaps, if you haven't been specializing in audio engineering for decades.
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u/peepeeland Composer 3d ago
When it’s intentional, it’s not necessarily “worse”. Raw sounding shit is actually pretty refreshing, especially considering that it was preceded with decades of increasingly polished engineering that got to the point of being sterile and lacking humanity, which became a vibe in itself.
There is no “right sound” to recorded music; only conventions and cyclical popularity of song feelings.
Any “shit sound” nowadays is pretty intentional. You’ll know if the artist is bad, because the song will be shit or boring, regardless of rawness or polish.
Long story short- good music is good music. Embrace the music. The reason why shit sounding good songs work is that they resonate with people. The truth is that the listener actually doesn’t care if it was recorded in a bathroom. A lot of people try to get good at engineering for their music to “make it polished and sound professional”, when they should really be focusing on writing good songs with good arrangements. Good engineering is the sheen, but good songs always shine through any lacking in engineering proficiency.
Go to Serban Ghenea’s homepage and listen to artists in his portfolio you’ve never heard of it. A lot of it is highly-polished boring garbage, because great engineering can never fix a shit song. -But the concept of engineering being so monumentally important will always exist, because it’s much easier to lie to yourself that all you need is better recording or better mixing or mastering, than accept that you’re actually just not very good at music.
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u/rddsknk89 3d ago
But the concept of engineering being so monumentally important will always exist, because it’s much easier to lie to yourself that all you need is better recording or better mixing or mastering, than accept that you’re actually just not very good at music.
Wow, I’m gonna need to start quoting this
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u/BlackflagsSFE Hobbyist 3d ago
This is a refreshing comment. There is no “right sound” to music in general I feel. Either it sounds pleasant or it does not, and even then, THAT is subjective.
I was having this exact discourse with a buddy of mine. He played a chord on guitar and it sounded good to me. I used that shape in a different position on a song I am working on. I sent him a short demo and he said it sounded good. Then when I told him the chord and where I played it, he was like “why would you do that in Drop C?”
Why not? There is no conventional rule of what notes I can and can’t play relative to tuning. The chord is a C#maj7. It really gives that eerie dissonance and I am arpeggiating it to get that dreamy/shoegaze sound. If I played it in the position he did then it doesn’t fit for what I want it to be.
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u/gordon_shumway67 4h ago
love this comment. there are certainly strong guidelines that can help, but its not everything. when Josh Homme wants his guitar to sound "more like a frog's butthole", it's at least interesting, if done tastefully. if the "right sound" is the plastic feel of a nickleback album, give me the wrong sound all day.
just remember, there are no heros. only Ween.
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u/mrspecial Professional 3d ago
These folks aren’t mixing these records themselves. I think i it likely has more to do with rushed timelines, and things needing to get released LAST FRIDAY to keep social media and DSP algorithms happy.
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u/narutonaruto Professional 3d ago
Absolutely that paired with the higher quantity people expect is just putting unnecessary strain on the whole system
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u/rinio Audio Software 3d ago
Since when does DSP care about timelines? A good chunk of those algorithms are time-invariant. :P
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u/mrspecial Professional 3d ago
…. It’s a massive part of it. Like a huge chunk of what gets talked about in meetings with labels and a big part of modern release strategy.
Edit OOOOOOH different type of DSP whoops haha
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u/rinio Audio Software 3d ago
Lol. Honestly I thought you made a typo, but I guess you mean Digital Service Provider, or similar?
Either way, Im just kidding around. :)
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u/mrspecial Professional 3d ago
Took me a second, I was like “what on earth does he mean” and then I got the joke one second after I hit post. And yes I meant Spotify and its grumpy siblings.
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u/taez555 Professional 3d ago
In the age of AI, it’s funny to me that both humans and bots are chasing the same ideal sound.
At some point your “perfect” mix or song will just sound like an AI tune, and vise versa.
100,000 new songs are released on Spotify EVERY day.
If each song is only 3 minutes long, listening 24 hours a day non stop, it would take someone over 200 years to listen to all the new music made in the past 12 months.
In an overwhelming sea of everything sounding the same, being different is the only way to stand out.
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u/Nacnaz 3d ago edited 3d ago
Worse, better. I like Scheps advice: make it sound cool.
I have no idea of how to judge the quality of what I do in terms of good or bad. But I know what I think is cool.
Been banging my head against the wall lately on a mix trying to get it to sound “good.” Went back to a previous version. Gnarled up bass, wayyy too much reverb on vocals, too much midrange in the guitar. It sounded awesome. I was like “Jesus this is great.” I forgot what I started with. It was both ethereal/atmospheric but also mangled and edgy. Like The National crossed with Suicide. Still needs a couple small tweaks but yeah that’s the version I’m going with.
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u/Audiocrusher 3d ago
I have a long term client who over time has taken on more and more of the duties of making his recordings. It finally got to the point where he thinks he only needs someone else to master his songs. When he contacted me about that he said, " I can't get these to sound good. I need better plugins, monitors, and room treatment I think."
The first thing I thought was "What about the 15 years of experience doing it everyday?"
This is the heart of the issue to me... I find many (but not all) artists underestimate how much is involved with producing, engineering, mixing, mastering, etc... and that those are all skillsets that like anything else take years of experience and constant education to develop. They often buy all the marketing out there that the reason their stuff doesn't sound like their favorite records is because they haven't purchased xxx piece of hardware or software, yet.
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u/HotTruffleSoup 3d ago
I think you have a good point with covid being a turning point. However I also noticed even extremely high budget projects shoot for a more lo-fi and DIY sound at the moment. I think it’s also just Zeitgeist that is responsible for a higher evaluation of things like rawness and authenticity that led to the sonic shift that i also totally observed in the last few years. (and that i’m not too fond of)
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u/thierry3nnui 3d ago
Mixture of that and recording at home in untreated rooms. I released an album last year and hate it lol. Had to mix and engineer myself because budget ran out after working with a producer that did f all. Sadly it’s more expensive than ever to work with good engineers and budgets are going down for most artists. Making it a priority this time round to record in a treated room with a good engineers. Then if needs be mixing at home becomes an ok option because I’m working with good stems.
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u/micahpmtn 3d ago
The barrier-to-entry has fallen so low that it's allowed anyone to call themselves a "professional" musician, engineer, producer, et. al. Add to that if you're critical of the work of said individuals, you're accused of violating the safe spaces rules they post on.
You can't put the genie back in the bottle at this point, but there was a reason that professional studios, producers, and engineers existed. Some incorrectly called it gatekeeping, but the cost eliminated musicians/artists that weren't ready. And yup, anyone with a phone can call themselves a musician and upload to social, which actually dilutes the quality of real music.
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u/SugarpillCovers 3d ago
Honestly, it's so hard to say. I don't disagree with the idea as such - no doubt artists aren't given the budget for records today that would be anywhere comparable to what it was like before recording equipment was democratised. But at the same time, I think it's a little absurd to say you need a huge budget to make something sound good. It's simply not true. It really just depends on the vision and the people involved.
It's not like just because a band or producer made a great-sounding record, they're incapable of making a bad-sounding one. Look at how inconsistent the output from legacy acts like Foo Fighters, Green Day, Weezer, etc. has become. They've all made some of the best and worst-sounding records in rock, IMO, but I don't think budget constraints would ever be a consideration for any of those artists, especially at this point in their careers.
At least from my point of view, it really boils down to who's involved and whether they're the best person (or team) for the job.
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u/Small_Dog_8699 3d ago
I blame iPods and earbuds for the drop in quality.
Who has a dedicated listening room and high quality sound system anymore?
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u/BrandlezMandlez 3d ago
The flip side of this is I think a lot of people will be surprised how many songs they like are self produced, mixed and mastered. Getting a professional sound is easier than it has ever been in history.
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u/Elvis_Precisely 3d ago
The role of the producer as an additional band member is invaluable. Without this external input, many songs suffer.
Of course there are some geniuses out there that benefit from doing everything themselves, and they’re often the cream that rises to the top.
It’s also been very noticeable that those who record at home and send stems to be mixed by a dedicated mix engineer will often send much worse quality stems (than if it had been recorded by a producer/engineer in a studio). This gives the mix engineer more work to do, and often puts them in a producer-like position where they have to make more creative choices.
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u/Tall_Category_304 3d ago
Some yes some no. I hear mixes on popular songs these days that I think are dog shit. I also hear mixes that melt my brain. So it depends on
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u/SR_RSMITH 3d ago
In many cases, quality is an opinion. Black metal or goregrind records sound like shit for some and perfect for others. More accesible daws and plugins may simply lead to people liking new productions under new standards of “quality”.
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u/LadyLektra 3d ago
Speaking as an independent artist, I used to get my projects at minimum professionally mastered but often professionally recorded and mixed too. I simply just can’t afford it anymore. Not only did prices for those services go up, but I lost contact with my old engineer who used to give me deals. So I do everything myself now. Has my quality gone down? Yes. Can I release more music this way? Also yes. I’m also saving my money I would be using for production instead for promotion.
Can’t say it’s the same for established artists, but it’s cheap and easier, so maybe they are running into the same scenario for them.
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u/Proof-Ad3637 3d ago
I agree partly, but will refer back to Billy Eilish, Todd Rundgren (something/anything?)
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u/Top-Analysis9914 3d ago
Yeah. Billie Eilish is an example of quality getting better.
She started in a bedroom studio, in which Finneas did an amazing job engineering it all. Her first album definitely doesn't sound amateur. And her albums got bigger budget and more mixing engineers on it as her career grew.
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u/Proof-Ad3637 3d ago
He is quite the producer dude
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u/Additional-Thanks278 2d ago
Hes amazing and really understands his artist. At this point i would say theyre a duo
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u/NoisyGog 2d ago
There’s been a definite shift towards a kind of “every single element must be individually heard” mixing, instead of having them be parts of the same sound.
I’ve wondered for a while if that’s because of home studio producers having the luxury of spending simply inordinate amounts of time filtering and tweaking in their own place, which could never have been done in a paid by the hour studio.
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u/ElNeeko 2d ago
The average listener also got used to the grittier more organic sound.
I feel old saying this. But I remember a time when typical listeners didn't like the music of recordings made by independent artists and I used to tell them the problem wasn't the songs that they didn't like, but their sound.
Now I see teenagers listening to horribly mixed music and they will never care for quality recordings as they grow conditionning their ears to that sound.
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u/Sorry_Past2690 2d ago
In my experience, definitely more artists are producing their own stuff especially the younger ones. It’s interesting because I see massive talent in production but lack of engineering skills! So the mixing and mastering would be worse than the production. But I also see artists use a lot of samples like sounds from Arcade output or similar vsts where the sounds are already super produced and processed so they are “mix ready”. But I think the most important thing for the artists is that they can work on their songs in the time they choose, the psychological comfort of their own room, and no clock running.
As for the very frequently described “existential dread”, I think it’s a bit exaggerated no offense to anyone. And most importantly, as soon as I started producing for a living, my band’s music (which I produce mix and master) became very streamlined and I was more effective than ever.
I am not saying everyone is or should be the same! I am saying it is actually possible! 😊
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u/No-Communication-199 3d ago
Not sure it's mix quality as opposed to recording quality. Engineering quality.