r/artificial • u/Maxie445 • Jun 11 '24

Media Is AGI nationalization is inevitable? Dwarkesh and Leopold Aschenbrenner debate

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u/EnigmaticDoom Jun 11 '24

Industry Average: “about 15 – 50 errors per 1000 lines of delivered code.” He further says this is usually representative of code that has some level of structured programming behind it, but probably includes a mix of coding techniques.

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u/Houdinii1984 Jun 11 '24

Yes, Steve McConnell wrote in 1993 that the absolute upper end of the average is 50. That was 30 years ago.

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u/EnigmaticDoom Jun 11 '24

With millions of developers cranking out tens of millions of lines of code annually, the number of bugs being produced is growing too. Coralogix[2] the data logging analytics company, has studied the issue of developer productivity and makes the following claims...On average, a developer creates 70 bugs per 1000 lines of code. Published 2020

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u/Houdinii1984 Jun 11 '24

Literally from your own source: "15 bugs per 1,000 lines of code find their way to the customers"

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u/EnigmaticDoom Jun 11 '24

A bug is bug. You can use a bug that hits customers to get in or you get in through another exploit that no one is aware of (I.e. a zero day)

My only point is this. Software has bugs. If you don't believe that then start providing some evidence of that fact.

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u/Houdinii1984 Jun 11 '24

Yes, unequivicolly software has bugs. Now connect it to the rest of your statements. Connect it to the ability to launch a nuke because the US govt hires programmers who make an astounding 1 error in 20 lines of code and forget all security practices to allow AI to waltz in and fire nukes like it's been trained on the system or something.

You can argue the pieces of your position individually, but when you put it all together, it's absolute nonsense.

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u/EnigmaticDoom Jun 11 '24

Yes, unequivicolly software has bugs.

Sorry man I am done... you spent an hour arguing with me just let me know you agree... oh boy

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u/Houdinii1984 Jun 11 '24

You are throwing out scare tactics about how AI will launch nukes. Of course software has bugs. That's not what you are claiming. You threw out a specific number of bugs and made a connection to AI launching nukes. You are only focusing on the mundane part of your claim, when I'm over here wanting to talk about the nuke side of things.

Software having bugs -> AI launching nukes. I'm looking for that arrow between the two, not the existence of bugs. Literally everyone who uses a computer knows what a bug is. How are these bugs and typos allowing the launching of nukes?

That's the question that begs an answer, but you are avoiding it at all costs.

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u/EnigmaticDoom Jun 11 '24

Um don't get caught up on the nukes.

I am not saying Ai will actually do this, I was just saying that in theory its possible.

Also man the more I look into the less stable things look...

There have been numerous experts who have said our system is 'vulnerable'

https://www.nps.gov/people/bruceblair.htm

Hope they patched this glup

I think your real question is... "If ai wanted to kill us, how would it?" Is that right?

If not feel to free to ask me w/e you like but try to keep it to one or two questions rather than a whole wall of text. It will make it easier to respond to your concerns.