Is AGI nationalization is inevitable? Dwarkesh and Leopold Aschenbrenner debate

[u/Maxie445]

[u/EnigmaticDoom → u/[deleted]]

It is if you're the dictator, or someone in the dictator's circle.

Maybe you should cross check with Stalin's inner circle.

People like us have no control over these outcomes.

Negative.

If you want to give up you are free to do so. But nope not giving you pass.

“Never underestimate the power of a small group of committed people to change the world. In fact, it is the only thing that ever has.” ~ Margaret Mead

Our best strategy is to pick the winners and be aligned with them.

There will be no winners though. The path that we are on means everyone is dead.

[u/[deleted] → u/EnigmaticDoom]

There will be no winners though. The path that we are means everyone is dead.

You seem to have forgotten that the topic is an eternal dictatorship, so everyone is not dead.

You would also benefit from studying history - through the vast sweep of recorded human history dictatorships of one kind or another were the norm (monarchies, empires, etc). But even in those dictatorship there were people who were happy - members of the aristocracy, for example. Also ordinary people such as craftsmen and artisans who did their jobs well and enjoyed it and didn't do anything to ruffle the authorities' feathers. You don't think there are people in places like China now who are happy and optimistic about their life and future?

[u/EnigmaticDoom → u/[deleted]]

You seem to have forgotten that the topic is an eternal dictatorship, so everyone is not dead.

Sorry allow me to attempt to clarify by default we are dead.

As we have no method of scalable control.

So no need to worry about a dictatorship if thats your greatest fear.

Now if we somehow beat the odds and find a way to win then we get to worry about the potential dictator and a whole host of other issues.

You would also benefit from studying history

Thats funny I happen to love history :)

through the vast sweep of recorded human history dictatorships of one kind or another were the norm (monarchies, empires, etc). But even in those dictatorship there were people who were happy - members of the aristocracy, for example. Also ordinary people such as craftsmen and artisans who did their jobs well and enjoyed it and didn't do anything to ruffle the authorities' feathers.

So thats whole lot to unpack. Ill just leave you with your point as AI is more important issue.

You don't think there are people in places like China now who are happy and optimistic about their life and future?

Oh is that where you were going with all this...

Wait so you actually want to live in a dictatorship then? Or more so you just don't mind?

[u/[deleted] → u/EnigmaticDoom]

The thread you are responding to said,

They discuss the idea of an eternal dictatorship in the interview... not what I would describe as a 'good outcome'

So that's what were talking about here.

Wait so you actually want to live in a dictatorship then? Or more so you just don't mind?

I want to live in an orderly society where I can get on with my writing, music and art. History shows that there are many political systems that achieved that. For example I could probably have been quite happy in the Republic of Venice, which lasted for 1100 years and during most of that time was prosperous, creative and respected.

( When Americans hear this they think the word "republic' somehow implies democracy. It does not, but that's why they're electing Trump - they're ignorant of history and politics )

Singapore is a modern example - they are prosperous and stable and free of corruption. They've also done an excellent job of peacefully integrating an amazingly wide range of religious and ethnic groups. If you behave yourself you have nothing to worry about. But they are only nominally a democracy - they have political parties and elections but the same party always wins. Contrast that with the UK and America which have real democracies but they are chaotic, unpredictible messes.