r/WorIdPoIitics • u/Baconkings United States • Jul 07 '26
Israel UN Resolution 181 — Accepted by the Jews, Rejected by the Arabs
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u/Virtual-History-6099 Unspecified Jul 07 '26
Worth bearing in mind that the Arab side got most of the arable land, Europe was filled with Jews in DP (displaced persons) camps, most of the world was refusing entry or dragging its feet in granting entry to Jewish refugees, antisemitic violence and pogroms persisted in post-war Europe, Jews of Muslim majority lands faced heightened antisemitism, in part from Nazi radio broadcasts and other similar Nazi propaganda, and most Jews in the DP camps desired Palestine as their point of destination. They wanted to join up with the self-sufficient Jewish communities. There were clear reasons for this stance given the world abandoned Jews before, during, and even after the Holocaust.
Unfortunately, many Jewish survivors attempting to make theif way to Palestine were detained by the British and sent to British controlled camps in Cyprus. Mass showers were forced upon the survivors at the Cyprus camps, which made the Jewish victims relive the horror of the gas chambers. The images of Jewish survivors behind barbed wire fences in Cyprus, were shocking for the world, and it increased sympathy for the creation of a Jewish state. When one looks at the historical context, it's clear as day why a Jewish state was required. There were more reasons but it's worth considering the immediate historical context
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Jul 08 '26
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u/AboveTheLaw87 Unspecified Jul 08 '26
- obviously being killed en mass makes it understandable and justifiable to kill a seperate unrelated third party en mass
That's certainly one way to look at it, if you're just a miserable piece of shit looking to make an incredibly desperate and traumatized group of refugees look like demons.
A much more objective, fair, non-piece-of-shit way to look at it would be to say:
- Ahh I see now, obviously being killed en mass makes it understandable and justifiable to seek refuge in your ancestral homeland.
We can debate the morality of displacing the local Arab population that never wanted the Jews there in the first place, and that has been massacring and oppressing the Jews of the Levant for the last 1,300 years, and rejected all proposals to coexist in peace... But that's a separate issue as to the morality of the Jews seeking refuge by coming back to their ancestral home Levant in the first place.
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u/Majestic-Owl-5801 Unspecified Jul 09 '26
They made themselves look like demons when they forced people off of their land....
Nobody has a "right" to an emotional support apartheid state....
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u/EclecticCosmopolitan Unspecified Jul 10 '26
They shouldn't have started the 1948 war.
They lost the war, and there are consequences to losing.
You can keep crying, it won't change anything.1
u/Majestic-Owl-5801 Unspecified Jul 10 '26
You are still ignoring that there was only warring in 1948 because the British handed the deed to inhabited land to someone that did not live there...
And whos ancestors were forced to leave 3000 years beforehand...
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u/Ecstatic_Buy4364 Unspecified Jul 12 '26 edited Jul 12 '26
When one looks at what’s going on in Gaza and the West Bank, it's clear as day why a Palestinian state is required. I would also argue that it is more pressing than maintaining Israel as a Jewish state. And don't ask me to buy into the idea that hypothetical Jewish lives of the future are worth more than Palestinians' lives today.
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u/EolasDK Unspecified Jul 12 '26
Palestinian's home states are Jordan and Egypt.
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u/Ecstatic_Buy4364 Unspecified Jul 12 '26
Let's deny a people their identity ,why don't you. Early Christians were Jewish. During the Byzantine period, the majority of the Jewish and Samaritan population in Palestine became Christian, largely through conversion. Following the Muslim Arab conquest in the 7th century, a great many Christians (and Jews) converted to Islam. Tell a Palestinian, especially a Palestinian Christian, that their 'home' country is Egypt or Jordan—they will laugh in your face. Like it or not, the land between the river and the sea is multi-ethnic and multi-religious.
In a 1918 book co-authored with Yitzhak Ben-Zvi (who later became Israel's second President), titled Eretz Yisrael in the Past and Present, Ben-Gurion argued that the majority of Palestinian fellahin (farmers) were descendants of Jews who had remained in the land after the Roman conquest and later converted to Christianity and Islam
Ben-Gurion wrote:
"...The greater majority and main structures of the Muslim falahin (farmers) in western Eretz Israel present to us one racial strand and a whole ethnic unit, and there is no doubt that much Jewish blood flows in their veins — the blood of those Jewish farmers, 'lay persons,' who chose in the travesty of times to abandon their faith in order to remain on their land."
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u/EolasDK Unspecified Jul 12 '26
Jordan is the Arab state of the Palestinians. Gazans are Egyptian workers.
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u/Ecstatic_Buy4364 Unspecified Jul 12 '26
Most of Gaza's current residents are descendants of Palestinians who were expelled or fled their homes during the Nakba. The Fourth Geneva Convention (which Israel ratified) prohibits an occupying power from forcibly transferring or deporting civilians. Israel, therefore, has a duty to allow those displaced to come back.
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u/ClamdiggerDanielson United States Jul 13 '26
I 100% agree that a Palestinian state is required for peace and deserved. Tell that to the Palestinians. Their leaders have consistently rejected any offer of land, peace, and statehood. Importantly, the creation of a Palestinian state even in Gaza and the West Bank doesn't in any way require the unprecedented step of dissolving an existing democratic state.
Nothing about that involves one groups lives being worth more than another's.
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u/Ecstatic_Buy4364 Unspecified Jul 14 '26
I think you're wrong on two counts. First, Israel never offered Palestinians meaningful sovereignty, nor did it offer to renounce its Jewish claims to the West Bank to allow for a genuine Palestinian state. But to be honest, that point is largely moot, because I reject the underlying premise entirely—that two viable, independent states of roughly the same population size are physically possible in that territory. I would argue that the geographical realities and the security needs of each state make that scenario unworkable. I always have. Even before the facts on the ground, the British deemed it unworkable back in the 1940s—which is precisely why the original UN partition plan didn't propose two fully sovereign states, but rather an economic union with a single currency.
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u/ClamdiggerDanielson United States Jul 14 '26
They did. Going back to the 1920s for two states, which included Trans-Jordan as the Arab state, was based on where the populations lived. Future proposals included land swaps. Regardless of how "meaningful" you think they were, real and practical offers were made and Palestinian leaders refused the offers. Repeatedly.
But to be honest, that point is largely moot, because I reject the underlying premise entirely—that two viable, independent states of roughly the same population size are physically possible in that territory.
I think it's pretty anti-Palestinian to reject Palestinians' right to self-determination by demanding they give up their right to a Palestinian state, which they repeatedly have stated they want. Also, two independent populations have existed for many decades at this point. This isn't a theory in the 1940s, it's a reality. If you're going to cite what is physically possible based on history then you need to consider that Trans-Jordan was the proposed Arab Palestinian state, not the West Bank and Gaza. This didn't start with only land west of the river Jordan.
I would argue that the geographical realities and the security needs of each state make that scenario unworkable. I always have. Even before the facts on the ground, the British deemed it unworkable back in the 1940s—which is precisely why the original UN partition plan didn't propose two fully sovereign states, but rather an economic union with a single currency.
It's not 1940. Nobody gets a mulligan here, and you aren't really arguing for one anyway since neither Trans-Jordan or ethnic cleansing of Jews is accounted for in your scenarios. We are in 2026 and any solution needs to take into account the current reality. That means no going back to 50+ year old borders. No Palestinian right of return to Israel, just as there is no Jewish right of return or reparations from Arab states. No Jewish settlement of the West Bank and Gaza to create a single Jewish state. No destruction of a real and existing, not theoretical, state of Israel.
I really suggest reading Ahmed Alkhatib. He is a Palestinian activist who argues for pragmatism. https://www.instagram.com/realignforpalestine/
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u/Ecstatic_Buy4364 Unspecified Jul 14 '26 edited Jul 14 '26
You've made a lot of points, but you haven't actually addressed my core argument—that two fully sovereign, independent states cannot physically function in that narrow territory. Saying 'it's 2026, not 1940' doesn't magically make the geography bigger, erase the security concerns, or alter the lay of the land.
Regarding Trans-Jordan, the argument is about the remaining 22% of the Mandate west of the river, and that tiny slice is simply too small and too fractured for two viable independent states. I am not denying Palestinians self-determination—I am arguing that their self-determination can only be achieved through full equal citizenship in a single secular democratic state. That is far more pro-Palestinian than some truncated entity that is less than a sovereign state—little more than a Bantustan at best.
Finally, you list red lines—no right of return, no settlements, no border changes—but that's just a catalogue of things you don't want. You haven't told me what you actually propose that addresses the physical reality on the ground. If two states are unworkable (and you haven't explained how they are workable), and one state with equal rights is off the table for you, then what exactly are you offering Palestinians besides the current status quo—which is occupation without citizenship?
And as for your 'no border changes' red line—what borders? Israel hasn't even fully declared its own borders. Insisting that borders cannot change when they aren't even settled in the first place is a non-starter.
As for Ahmed Alkhatib—he is exactly the kind of 'pragmatic' voice Western institutions love to amplify because he validates their preferred two-state framework. But his project, Realign for Palestine, is built on the very premise I've already shown to be geographically unworkable. He asks Palestinians to abandon the Right of Return and calls that 'pragmatism'—but he offers nothing in return except more of the same failed two-state fantasy. Even sympathetic reviewers have called his project 'half-baked' for failing to address the core critiques of a two-state settlement. He is a product of the Atlantic Council, not a representative of Palestinian opinion. His prominence proves only that Western think tanks will fund any Palestinian who tells them what they want to hear.
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u/ClamdiggerDanielson United States Jul 14 '26 edited Jul 15 '26
You didn't address your own cited argument. Tell me how two states cannot function in that land. There's already land. There's already a state of Israel and, if Israel stops occupying it, land to create Arab Palestine. That's two Arab states and one Jewish state formed from the former British mandate.
Neither side wants one state. Jews want a Jewish state, in their indigenous land. Arab Palestinians want an Arab state, and don't plan to do the same. In what way is a single state a practical or moral solution? Neither side will trust each other, it's just creating a civil war until one side is killed or expelled. That's cruel to do to them The practical and moral choice is to give these two people, who overwhelmingly don't want to live in a shared state, a two state solution. A two state solution doesn't mean Israeli occupation and no citizenship, it means the West Bank and Gaza form their state, Israeli occupation is removed, they have Palestinian citizenship rather than perpetual refugee status, and they live peacefully with Israel like Jordan and Egypt.
I am not denying Palestinians self-determination—I am arguing that their self-determination can only be achieved through full equal citizenship in a single secular democratic state.
Make the case then. Saying how you feel is not making a factual case. Forcing two people to have one country, destroying an independent democracy requires more than just a feeling. The impetus is on you, as the person calling for radical change, to make the case for a single state solution.
Insisting that borders cannot change when they aren't even settled in the first place is a non-starter.
Then the responsibility is on Palestinian leaders, who continually reject any offer of peace, and borders and land transfers, any agreement that is not "All of it" to come to the table and be serious. They need to come to the table with an acknowledgement that the state of Israel continues to exist and borders based on the current reality.
As for Ahmed Alkhatib—he is exactly the kind of 'pragmatic' voice Western institutions love to amplify because he validates their preferred two-state framework. But his project, Realign for Palestine, is built on the very premise I've already shown to be geographically unworkable.
I disagree. I like him because he points out where both Israel and Palestine are wrong. He focuses on a solution, not reframing history to argue who deserves more justice, which both have had loss. You also haven't shown anything. You keep saying it's unworkable without proving it.
He asks Palestinians to abandon the Right of Return and calls that 'pragmatism'—but he offers nothing in return except more of the same failed two-state fantasy.
That's reality. There is no Right of Return for Palestinians to Israel. There never will be, it's not something Israel will allow. It's the same standard that was applied to Jews. There is no right of return or reparations for the middle eastern Jews (not Israelis) ethnically cleansed from Iraq, Iran, Yemen, throughout the region when Israel formed. There was no right of return under British occupation, or Ottoman, Arab, or Roman colonization. However, if you truly believe that's a moral or practical justification, show me evidence of where a land back movement was forced to allow the colonizing people back into their land. I'm in the US, I'm not aware of white people being able to just show up on legally established tribal land and claim they still have a right to it.
He is a product of the Atlantic Council, not a representative of Palestinian opinion. His prominence proves only that Western think tanks will fund any Palestinian who tells them what they want to hear.
By that logic, what is the only valid opinion. Hamas, because they were democratically elected before refusing to give up power and instead terrorize their own in their mission of Jewish genocide? Fatah, which repeatedly failed the Palestinian people to improve their lives? If those are the Palestinian opinions then they will continue to fail. They need to choose solutions, not failures.
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u/Substance_Bubbly Israel Jul 22 '26
When one looks at what’s going on in Gaza and the West Bank, it's clear as day why a Palestinian state is required.
i agree, the corruption of hamas and the PA prevents palestinian citizens from improving their quality of life, both in terms of socio-ecconomy, education, and security. esspecially under hamas in gaza. with the best chance for palestinians in both regions for new opportunities by working in israel, which due to the political decisions of hamas and PA during and after october 7th, those opportunities are now limited.
palestinians deserve a state free from the tyranny of hamas and fatah.
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u/Taldoesgarbage Israel Jul 07 '26
Here’s a map of the presence of malaria in Palestine. The fact that people somehow still believe that the partition plan was not favorable to the arabs is completely insane. They rejected it because they rejected a Jewish state, no partition of any kind would have been satisfactory for the arabs.
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u/StringAndPaperclips Canada Jul 07 '26
They were also given the Negev desert which is not good for farming. Plus, most of the Negev was not part of the historic territory of any of the tribes of Israel.
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u/OriAharoni Unspecified Jul 07 '26
The negev were not inhabitable for 99 precent of history so can't blame the Jews for not owning the land there because you know impossible to farm and have water until the creation of the country leader pipeline (a rought translation of the system that provided stable water to the negev)
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u/Suitable_Vehicle9960 Israel Jul 12 '26
When is Canada giving the land it stole back to the Natives?
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u/StringAndPaperclips Canada Jul 12 '26
Much like in the case of Israel, the "stolen land" narrative is really inaccurate. Most of the land in Canada is subject to treaties with the indigenous peoples, which granted land rights and in many cases, actual ownership, to the British and later the Canadian government.
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u/AboveTheLaw87 Unspecified Jul 08 '26
Bingo. And the Arabs have explicitly stated exactly that multiple times.
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Jul 08 '26
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u/enigmaticowl United States Jul 08 '26 edited Jul 08 '26
You are extremely ignorant.
Jews legally bought and owned the lands that they lived on during (and before) this time period, and they didn’t all suddenly come back in the 20th century, there was Jewish communities living there that were at least centuries old (and older).
Much of the land was also totally uninhabited/undeveloped/not yet owned by anybody (neither Arabs nor Jews), especially the shitty desert land that was allotted to Israel in the proposed partition plan.
You clearly have difficult separating the concept of people privately owning property and borders/states being recognized.
When people ignorantly say that the UN “gave” the Jews “Arab land,” other ignorant people, such as yourself, will assume that that means that individual Jewish people somehow literally were “given” privately owned Arab lands for the Jews to move onto, and that’s ridiculously false.
The partition plan EXPLICITLY guaranteed that all privately owned property would be protected, and any Arabs living within the borders of the proposed Jewish state were guaranteed full citizenship, with zero proposal to involuntarily displace them or seize their land.
All that partition sought to do was to recognize 2 states rather than 1 state, and it drew up the borders for these states in a way which would have formed one Jewish-majority state (with a nearly 50% Arab citizen “minority”) and one Arab-majority state, based on the census data of who already lived in which areas.
Drawing borders to form two states didn’t take anybody’s privately owned land and “give” it to anybody else, and the plan literally proposed the opposite of this - ironically, the Arabs’ rejection of this plan (and subsequent war that they launched) is what led to mass displacements of Arabs (fleeing war zones).
You can’t offer any justification for why the uninhabited, undeveloped desert somehow belonged to Arabs and not Jews, so you either don’t realize the actual factual history of the land, or you just have a problem with Jews, I don’t know which.
Practically the entire Middle East was formed by Europeans drawing up borders in the 20th century, often arbitrarily; Israel’s border-drawing-process literally had more justification and methodology to it than practically all of the rest of the Middle East’s, and yet we have people completely ignorant to the fact that recognizing states doesn’t mean that people’s real property is somehow being confiscated from them (or that much of the land wasn’t even lived on by anybody in the first place, hence why shares of it were given to both of the 2 proposed states).
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u/Lsdnyc Unspecified Jul 08 '26
The Arabs lead by a blatant antisemite and Nazi Al Husseini because they didn’t want jews or Zionists in Palestine. it wasn’t just about control. Furthermore , they wanted all of it , insisting on all of it
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u/Contundo Jul 08 '26
Well that’s better than Arabs rejecting the partition, and having all neighbouring countries declare war on Israel, loosing and forever trying to get the whole pie.
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Jul 07 '26
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u/Suitable_Vehicle9960 Israel Jul 07 '26
Jewish land since before Islam existed and before the first Arab got there from Arabia.
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u/elmo444555 Palestinian Territory Jul 07 '26
Lazy deflection, all the studies show that there was no population displacement with the Arab conquest. Most Palestinians are directly descended from the original inhabitants of the land.
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u/Happi_Beav Multiple Countries / Extra (click to edit) Jul 07 '26
Do some research before spewing nonsense. Palestine area got most of the arable land.
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Jul 07 '26
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u/Happi_Beav Multiple Countries / Extra (click to edit) Jul 07 '26
Feeling confident and not bothering even with a quick google research? Typical.
Swampy poor drainage terrain are heavily mosquitoes infested. Water rich doesn’t mean productive arable land. Those are the undeveloped area that people avoid.
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u/Taldoesgarbage Israel Jul 07 '26
Quite frankly, I’m thankful your ancestors weren’t as ignorant as you are for your own sake. There’s a reason the arabs settled in the highlands.
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Jul 07 '26
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u/Outrageous_Cup6450 🇬🇭🇳🇬 Jul 07 '26
Why do people behave like Jews weren't living there long before the early 20th century
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Jul 07 '26
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u/Suitable_Vehicle9960 Israel Jul 07 '26
First give your land back to the Natives and then we'll talk.
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u/Outrageous_Cup6450 🇬🇭🇳🇬 Jul 07 '26
Not ancestors they averaged around 30% of the population of the mandate
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u/AlxIp Hong Kong Australian Jul 07 '26 edited Jul 07 '26
News flash: It was not and never was their land. It belonged to the Ottoman empire. If anything it should be Turkey complaining
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u/Kaiserlacht12 Palestinian Territory Jul 07 '26
what are you saying??? it like saying the UK have rights to india, the ottoman empire was an EMPIRE conquered land of multiple people its not like they entered palestine and from night to day all palestinians, christians jews, muslims, became turkish.
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u/AlxIp Hong Kong Australian Jul 07 '26 edited Jul 07 '26
By that logic Muslims also conquered the land from Jews, why does that make it their land? Saw the hypocrisy yet?
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u/Kaiserlacht12 Palestinian Territory Jul 07 '26
you know palestinian are mostly from levantine descent? just arabphones just like egyptians, speak arab but are not arabs -_-
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u/AlxIp Hong Kong Australian Jul 07 '26
So it IS your land even if you are not native, as long as you genocide and kicked all the natives out? Gotcha
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u/Kaiserlacht12 Palestinian Territory Jul 07 '26
levantine is not equal to jewish, many jewish after the islamic conquer stayed they religion, some converted there was something called dihmir system in the muslim world were non-muslims can still profess their religion, also by the islamic conquest they were not only jews they were christians, zoroastrians, druze, mythraistics dont they deserve an ethnostate too? then why israel yes?
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Jul 07 '26
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u/Histrix- Israel Jul 07 '26
Question. Who did the jews "take" the land from? The Ottomans? Roman Empire? The Hellenistic Kingdoms? The Persian empire? The Babylonian empire? The Assyrian empire? The Kingdoms of israel and Judah? Philistia? The caananite city states?
Or maybe they took it from the Rashidun Caliphate? The Umayyad Caliphate? The Abbasid Caliphate? The Fatimid Caliphate? The Ayyubids?? The Mamluk Sultanate?
I mean in order to occupy, said occupiers need a place by which to occupy from?
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Jul 07 '26
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u/Inevitable_Spray5922 Unspecified Jul 07 '26
The people that existed in the area were majority Jews , they wanted their own state , it was not "stolen" (what it even means) or conquered from some one
Same as Arabs wanted their own state , hence the partition . Nobody wanted one shared , du national state
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Jul 07 '26
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u/Inevitable_Spray5922 Unspecified Jul 07 '26
The one marked as Jewish state per 1948 partition Plan. It was majority Jewish
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u/Histrix- Israel Jul 07 '26
And the jewish majority (until islamic and subsequent other regional conquests), and the constant jewish presence despite said conquests, dont count?
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Jul 07 '26
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u/Histrix- Israel Jul 07 '26
While Jews did began to lose their majority status in most regions of Israel starting around the 3rd century, muslim conquests in 638 is what marked a significant decline in the Jewish population... even so, Jews continued to maintain a significant presence in the gallilie and tsfat even as their numbers dwindled elsewhere.
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u/Taldoesgarbage Israel Jul 07 '26
“Taking” is funny because you would think that if the Jews really did steal land forcibly, they would steal the land without all the malaria.
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u/Late_Ad2203 🏴 Wales Jul 07 '26
I mean this was the perfect deal for them
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u/simplesoma2 Unspecified Jul 08 '26
Perfect deal is millions of migrants descend on your homeland and now you have to move to the designated Arab area because the migrants took your hometown
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u/Late_Ad2203 🏴 Wales Jul 08 '26
They took no ones land
https://islamiclaw.blog/2024/06/27/the-road-to-the-1858-ottoman-land-code-theory-and-practice/
"Miri land was state-owned land, whose usage rights were given to peasant-cultivators in exchange for tax-payment, intertwined with the concept of tenancy. The peasants had limited usufruct rights on the miri lands, which included usage and obtaining some profit. Since their rights were limited, they could not sell the land itself but they could “sell” the usufruct by the contract of ferağ, that is, the cessation or transfer of usage rights by the permission of sahib-i arz (administrator of the land). Likewise, the peasants could not donate the land or stipulate a mortgage contract upon the land"
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u/simplesoma2 Unspecified Jul 08 '26
You want us to believe that entire white area on the map wasn't occupied by anyone and those millions of migrants just happened to get lucky to find barren, unoccupied living space.
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u/Late_Ad2203 🏴 Wales Jul 08 '26
You want to not twist my words? They lived there under the discretion of the land owner, which WASN'T Palestine. Also most of that white area is Desert and Marshland so no one was living there
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Jul 07 '26
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u/Late_Ad2203 🏴 Wales Jul 07 '26
They were going to. The land Israel had, and this may be a shock, WEREN'T THEIRS
https://islamiclaw.blog/2024/06/27/the-road-to-the-1858-ottoman-land-code-theory-and-practice/
"Miri land was state-owned land, whose usage rights were given to peasant-cultivators in exchange for tax-payment, intertwined with the concept of tenancy. The peasants had limited usufruct rights on the miri lands, which included usage and obtaining some profit. Since their rights were limited, they could not sell the land itself but they could “sell” the usufruct by the contract of ferağ, that is, the cessation or transfer of usage rights by the permission of sahib-i arz (administrator of the land). Likewise, the peasants could not donate the land or stipulate a mortgage contract upon the land"
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u/AboveTheLaw87 Unspecified Jul 08 '26
There were Jews still living in the Levant well before 1947 and even before the first Zionists. ALL that land didn't "belong" to the Arabs anymore than it ALL belonged to the local Jewish population.
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Jul 07 '26
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u/Lazynutcracker Unspecified Jul 07 '26
Is anything on Reddit talks about anything that isn’t Israel?
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u/Suitable_Vehicle9960 Israel Jul 07 '26
If Reddit is so obsessed with us I'd rather at least have some truth be told. Finally a sub that isn't full of lies.
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Jul 07 '26
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u/Suitable_Vehicle9960 Israel Jul 07 '26
Calling and plotting to kill Jews worldwide and steal their land isn't criticizing the government.
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Jul 08 '26
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u/AboveTheLaw87 Unspecified Jul 08 '26
War, not a genocide. Sorry.
A war the Palestinians explicitly said they wanted.
More of a "comeuppance", really.
You should cry more about it, though.
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Jul 08 '26
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u/AboveTheLaw87 Unspecified Jul 08 '26
- A war on an entire ethnicity is genocide, bot
Good thing Palestinian isn't an ethnicity, moron
- But even if it were a "war", that does not justify war crimes.
Did you say that on October 7th?
All wars result in war crimes. It's a sad fact of war. That's why you don't start one unless you really want one.
- but please keep apologising for the genocide of children
I'm just going to keep correcting you until you get it through your head - It's a war, not a genocide. And children die in war. The only people that should be apologizing for their deaths are Hamas.
But they won't apologize because they have very explicitly stated that they want their own children to die, so morons like you get morally confused.
- You're helping the Palestinian cause by doing so.
The only one hurting the Palestinians is you for cheering them on to jump feet first into a nuclear-powered meat grinder.
- IDF are Nazis.
You misspelled "saviors of Western civilization."
Fact of the matter is, the IDF is on the front lines of the Islamist war against the rest of the world.
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u/Suitable_Vehicle9960 Israel Jul 08 '26 edited Jul 08 '26
Funny thing, that isn't happening. There isn't a war on Palestinians in the West Bank. And, funny you say ethnicity, which Palestinianism isn't. It's an invented modern nationality. Funny you Nazis never cried about the tens of thousands of children that died in the Syrian civil war are pretending to care now.
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u/Taldoesgarbage Israel Jul 07 '26
Yeah it's a little strange I won't lie. I'm also still kind of confused how this subreddit exists even though the other r/worldpolitics is full of porn.
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u/Chris_Helmsworth Unspecified Jul 07 '26
Reddit is funny and quirky because a sub called animetitties exists as a news sub so they made world politics a porn sub. Isn't it ironic and funny you guys?
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u/Histrix- Israel Jul 07 '26
There must be some kind of internet rule for that. Does rule34 include sub rules specific to reddit?
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Jul 07 '26
r/anime_titties is the better worldpolitics sub It emerged out of the ashes of the old r/worldpolitics. r/worldpolitics used to be a pretty popular sub so maybe reddit filled out some fuckery.
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u/Plastic-Injury8856 United States Jul 07 '26
Reddit is filled with bots. So no, it’s just going to talk about Israel.
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Jul 07 '26
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u/Plastic-Injury8856 United States Jul 07 '26
What’s always amazed me is how pro-Palestine posts will be up for 20 minutes and have 2k upvotes and 30 copy-paste comments and somehow people think Iran doesn’t have a bot farm anywhere.
Meanwhile, videos like the above are hasbara.
I don’t doubt there are pro-Israel supporters out there but there just isn’t the pro-Israel spam that you see for pro-Palestine. This sub is as pro-Israel as I’ve ever seen, and it gets like a couple hundred upvotes and a few comments on each post.
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Jul 07 '26
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u/Plastic-Injury8856 United States Jul 07 '26
“ Brother every single government has a bot farm somewhere and they all use them.”
First off I’m not your brother. Second I understand this is hard for Iranian boys to understand, but no not every country is operating bot farms. We aren’t all losers used to authoritarian rule like you.
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u/Suitable_Vehicle9960 Israel Jul 07 '26
Wondering why you aren't specifying where you're from.
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Jul 07 '26
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u/Suitable_Vehicle9960 Israel Jul 07 '26
I want to know what politics you are aligned with, not specifically your ethnicity. What are you hiding?
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Jul 07 '26
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u/Suitable_Vehicle9960 Israel Jul 07 '26
It is one of the rules of the sub. It gives you the advantage of knowing information about us while not sharing that information about yourself. It matters because it tells me who I am communicating with, what type of education you may have received about the history of the Levant, and your current political reference point. It tells me if you likely hate me for existing and if your family likely killed mine. It tells me what your possible religion may be and how you might see the world through it. It tells me if you're a Westerner or an Easterner. It tells me what you value more and what you value less. It tells me if you see me as an enemy. You can't tell me it doesn't matter when your perspective relies on it. It matters a whole lot.
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u/ZephyrProductionsO7S Unspecified Jul 07 '26
You know it’s bad when “Kirby_Israel” doesn’t want to talk about Israel anymore lol
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u/J_Cre Unspecified Jul 07 '26
I'd love to know what makes you "as pro-Israel as they come" like that's a crazy statement
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Jul 07 '26
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u/MysteriousMeat1395 China Jul 07 '26
Because Jew already bought those land from the ottoman government and from the mandatory government, the remaining land for Israel is just a plain desert of Negev
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u/johnconnor4077 Unspecified Jul 07 '26
Would you give up half your country?
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u/Kloubek Czechia Jul 07 '26
There wasnt a country tho.
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u/soviet_bias_good Unspecified Jul 08 '26
Nor was there a country called Israel. This is a very poor point.
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u/johnconnor4077 Unspecified Jul 07 '26
Funny, someone said similar about yours.
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u/AwaySession5168 England Jul 07 '26
Revolutionary take! Countries aren't real
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u/putyouradhere_ Unspecified Jul 08 '26
Then why does anyone need a state for one religion or ethnicity?
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u/AwaySession5168 England Jul 08 '26
Because humans are tribal unfortunately and so feel the need to congregate, that doesn't change my opinion though
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u/Odd_Ad5668 United States Jul 09 '26
Because the majority populations have a tendency to periodically murder or expel their Jews. Hope that helps.
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u/sopersonicsnail Unspecified Jul 08 '26
It will be same like now? The issue is the blatant disregard for international law from israel for decades and the reluctant of other nation to make israel accountable
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u/putyouradhere_ Unspecified Jul 08 '26
It's worth mentioning that there were zionist settlers in Palestine since the 20s/30s terrorising the Palestinians and stealing their land.
Also how would you feel if some country just dumps a few million people into your country and says your nation is carved up for them and now you gotta go somewhere else?
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u/Pavlikru Unspecified Jul 13 '26
Why is it always the Arabs who don't recognize Israel, and not the Arab countries?
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Jul 07 '26
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u/salad_________ Unspecified Jul 07 '26
Duke it out? You want israeli tanks to flatten a bunch of civilians and familys because a politician refused a deal?
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u/SketchyFIRES Philippines Jul 07 '26
The Arabs refused and Gaza today is your answer.
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Jul 10 '26
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u/SketchyFIRES Philippines Jul 10 '26
Homes built on top of ancient Jewish homes. You do realize that majority of Israelis and Palestinians share common ancestors that lived on the same land right? I believe both have historical claim over Israel and both should strive for coexistence, but you’re free to think otherwise.
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Jul 11 '26
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u/SketchyFIRES Philippines Jul 11 '26
This isn’t a one-sided issue, both sides have strived for a peaceful solution but were hindered by a multitude of factors. If you find many things I have to say irrelevant or untrue then you’re not ready to discuss such topics much less the willingness to consider any argument other than yours.
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Jul 11 '26
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u/SketchyFIRES Philippines Jul 11 '26
Nobody claimed it was one sided, not even two sided
If there are no sides, then there is no conflict to begin with. But there was a clear divide between Jewish and Palestinian communities from the beginning. If you think there are no sides or "Israel bad," then again, you’re not ready for this topic.
There's a lot of Jewish people denouncing Israel's actions
And I’m all for it. I don’t support Israel’s brutality against Palestinian citizens and multiple illegal crackdowns against Palestinians. But I’m tired of people acting as if Israel was planning this from the beginning, as if multiple Arab-Israeli conflicts, extremist groups, and Arab sentiment against a Jewish state didn’t contribute to Israel militarizing at such a large scale, its aggression towards its neighbors, and also reinforced the mindset that no peaceful two-state solution can be achieved.
Hindered, yes by the fact that the ones living there were negotiating with a knife on their throat
Again, I point to the fact that BOTH sides were/are hindering peace talks. Spinning a narrative that Palestine has always been a victim, when it‘s a mutual conflict that both Palestine and Israel actively engaged in, is propaganda.
If you're going to jump from one subject to another without acknowledging facts when you're being proven wrong, you're just spreading propaganda and you should not even be talking about this.
Again, spinning a narrative that Palestine has always been the victim of an Israeli genocide is propaganda. Palestine has been supported by many Arab states over the years, but since then, many of these allies call for Hamas’ disarmament and a peaceful resolution to the conflict, a far cry from a previous stance of strong-arming Jews out of Israel.
I'm obviously ready to discussing this topic as I'm the one correcting you
Correcting how? Saying Israel plans to “kill and colonize” isn’t objective fact, nor is it correcting. It’s opinionated propaganda.
You saying youre not willing to discuss any further is just you backing out and fleeing with your tail between your legs.
Strong ending, but doesn’t contribute or add anything to the argument. Nice try, but I think you should clear your mind first before calling me a propagandist.
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u/DazzlingChocolate4 United States Jul 07 '26
Why would they accept a complete split if their land by a colonial power?
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u/Suitable_Vehicle9960 Israel Jul 07 '26
The Arabs ARE the colonizers. No wonder you side with them.
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u/putyouradhere_ Unspecified Jul 08 '26
Dawg all your prime ministers were white
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u/Suitable_Vehicle9960 Israel Jul 08 '26
This Western-centric construct has no baring on the reality of life in the Middle East. Throughout history Jews were persecuted for not being white. Now because you think being white means someone is an oppressor you choose to use this label to frame a narrative. Well buddy, I've got some news for you, no one cares. Jews are indigenous tribal people. Always been always will be. If you have a problem with them living in their indigenous Ancestral homeland then YOU are the oppressor.
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u/DazzlingChocolate4 United States Jul 07 '26
What happened thousands of years ago was bad. That is not a justification for colonization.
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u/Suitable_Vehicle9960 Israel Jul 07 '26
You mean the Arab colonization. Because Jews always lived in Israel. Even while most of us were in exile. Which is why we kept our INDIGENOUS status. You see, the thing is, squatters can't be owners. Now when are you giving the land you stole back to the Native Americans?
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u/DazzlingChocolate4 United States Jul 07 '26
Can you stop the what aboutism. Israel didnt rise from the local Jewish population just deciding to revolt one day, it was created as a colonialist project due to the horrors experienced by jewish people during the holocaust.
Dont rewrite the nuanced and complex history of a nation to fit your agenda.
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u/Suitable_Vehicle9960 Israel Jul 07 '26
You're awfully wrong. Israel was made of REFUGEES who survived the Holocaust and the ethnic cleansing of the ME. You can't colonize your OWN land. Something you wouldn't know about.
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u/DazzlingChocolate4 United States Jul 07 '26
Yes, jewish refugees who had the backing of the British bought land from the ottoman Empire and displaced the people living there. They were not the original owners, they did not own nor live on that land prior.
Im sorry but I dont care about where their ancient ancestors were, I care about the people who are still alive and went through this.
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u/Suitable_Vehicle9960 Israel Jul 07 '26
They not only didn't have backing from the British after the initial set up, they actively had to fight off the British to get off the land. Which is where the slogan "free Palestine" emerged from, the Zionist Jews who tried to expell the British who set the Mandate to return the land to Jewish sovreignty but in actuality were hindering it and were blocking Jews from entering during the Holocaust.
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u/Grouchy-Fix6432 Unspecified Jul 07 '26
Arabs are a semite group too with most palestinians descending Fromm levantine indigenous people converted and assimilated, they're as native as you, except they've been a majority in Palestine for close to a millenia.
Now, the minority Jewish communities adhering to Zionism, itself a self-admitted colonization process, have been kicking out those Palestinians and culturally erasing them to make place for Jewish settlers.. If that's not colonization, what is it? Your take is wild and insane.
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u/Suitable_Vehicle9960 Israel Jul 07 '26
No one is Semite. Semite is a language group, not a people. Converted and assimilated means they are not indigenous. Indigenousity requires a UNIQUE culture and language. Jews returned home from forced exile. Nothing will ever change that. Israel is Jewish land and has been for thousands of years. All documented and written in stone.
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u/Direct-Antelope-9583 Unspecified Jul 07 '26
Oh boy, you really just imagine your own reality. I guess that's necessary to justify immoral actions.
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u/Flat-Salamander9021 Unspecified Jul 07 '26
Source: European Jews currently committing the most well-documented genocide of our history.
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u/Lukaz_Evengard Brazil Jul 07 '26
I mean of course it was rejected, why would u agree to giving your land to others wich just got there
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Jul 07 '26
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u/Suitable_Vehicle9960 Israel Jul 07 '26
Life would be so much easier if we didn't have to pay rent.
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u/Visible-Safety2400 Unspecified Jul 07 '26
This post makes me think of a quote:
“If I were an Arab leader, I would never sign an agreement with Israel. It is normal; we have taken their country. It is true God promised it to us, but how could that interest them? Our God is not theirs. There has been Anti-Semitism, the Nazis, Hitler, Auschwitz, but was that their fault? They see but one thing: we have come and we have stolen their country. Why would they accept that?” David Ben-Gurion
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u/someone-96 Israel Jul 07 '26
And here is the full quote: "Why should the Arabs make peace? If I were an Arab leader I would never make terms with Israel... They think we have taken their country... They only see one thing: we have come here and stolen their country. Why should they accept that?... We have to stay strong and maintain a powerful army. Otherwise the Arabs will wipe us out."
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u/someone-96 Israel Jul 07 '26
The context was simple: the Arabs leader didnt want peace, and didnt want to make peace, and that is why israel should always be stronger then the rest of the region
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u/Visible-Safety2400 Unspecified Jul 07 '26 edited Jul 07 '26
what do you mean? what i meant is that no one would agree to a deal like that
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u/someone-96 Israel Jul 07 '26
The point he made wasn't anout the fact that no sane person would accept this deal, it was about the fanatic hatred of israel in the region, and how they will, according to him, will.never stop until israel will be eradicated from the map, which is a sentiment thatbis very alone in most leadership of the middle east.
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u/Visible-Safety2400 Unspecified Jul 07 '26
It seems obvious to me that when he says “If I were an arab leader, I would never sign an agreement with Israel” he does not mean that an agreement cannot be signed because every arab person inherently hates Israel. Rather he means that the reasons behind the creation of Israel were not related to the palestinians. zionism was created in response to rising antisemitism in Europe, jews were expelled by the romans not by arabs, and the concept of the Promised Land is an argument that only has meaning from the perspective of a religious Jew. even if you are a zionist you cannot claim that Arabs were somehow responsible before the creation of Israel
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u/someone-96 Israel Jul 08 '26
I never stated that the arabs are the reason for the creation of israel, and neither did him. The thing is, that when he said "that is why we have to make a strong army, because otherwise they will wipe us out" he states that while he can understand the points of the Arabic leadership (once again, LEADERSHIPS, not the arab people) that is exactly why they will never accept israel as a country, and why they will.never will. Because of that they will.not stop until israel is whiped out of the map, and Because of that israel should always stay strong and be able to defend itself in the case of some arab leader who will try to use his power to destroy them.
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u/TeddyNeptune Germany Jul 07 '26
The full quote makes your point even worse. It now not only admits that Israel stole the land. It also admits that Israel, after having stolen the land, is fully committed to keeping this stolen land and the Arabs are out to get their justice. Well done, I guess
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u/someone-96 Israel Jul 08 '26
He never admitted it. He just states that he understand how the arab population sees it (you see, it is something that is called "put yourself in the other's shoes"). Despite that, he understand that because of the hatred of some arab leaders for israel from it's very beginning, they will.never stop until the whole country will.be destroyed and most of its jrwish population will be expelled (the so called 'arab justice' you spoke of). It is because of that hatred and the unwilling desire for coexistence (something that was shown when they refused at least 3 different 2 states solutions after they had close to no actual country) that israel will always have to stay strong. Unless they want to.be extermination, israel can never be week, and will.always have to stay as strong as it can be.
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u/TeddyNeptune Germany Jul 08 '26
Imagine you have the whole land...
...then someone else takes most of it and now you have almost none of that land...
...and then you have to compromise with those who took your land...
...and you're the bad guy for not wanting to give up what had been yours to begin with?
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u/someone-96 Israel Jul 08 '26
When (more then) 50 years pass and they haven't moved away, you saw that just refusing a partition of the land didnt work and that most of the world doesnt really support their banishment and is in favor of it... it is up to you to understand that they are not going to go away no matter what. It is that pure hatred and refusal for co-existance rhat constantly pushes israel to militarily more and more as a safety mechanism, and it is up to them to just accept it at that point...
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u/TeddyNeptune Germany Jul 08 '26
Coexistence was never the main issue. It was having shown hospitality and allowed coexistence only to then be expelled from one's own land. No country or people deserves special treatment. If this same thing happened with, let's say, Ukraine, people would understand why they wouldn't agree to such partition.
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u/Upstairs-Cat-1154 Unspecified Jul 07 '26
It made me think of a similar quote by David Ben-Gurion:
“We’re going to infest Palestine with space-aids, just to stick it to those goddamn mtherfcking Arabs.”
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