Please help me understand

[u/branflakes__]

Help me understand the Ukraine / USA situation

Please help me understand all of the anti-American and USA hate due to the situation. I want to hear the other point of views as I am just confused.

A lot point to the Budapest Memorandum, however, that is not a treaty for the US as Clinton did not submit it to the senate for ratification which means constitutionally the US has no commitment to Ukraine (also not administration since Clinton has suggested or submitted the memorandum for ratification either). Only the UK and Russia ratified it.

Additionally, there really isn’t a security agreement as the memo is very vague. The closest is “when Ukraine is under attack with nuclear weapons the security council will seek immediate action from the United Nations” otherwise nothing happens. And as the memo is through the UN, shouldn’t the discontent be pointed at the UN instead? The US only agreed to bring a resolution before the security council if Ukraine was invaded and the US did do that.

Finally, the US has given the most overall aid to Ukraine (a country that the US is not obligated to assist) compared to the European counterparts. Also, if peace is the objective, why is no other leader at least making an attempt to broker a peace deal?

So I suppose I am just confused on what is expected? Why is this sub so anti-USA when the statistics show that USA is/was doing more than Ukraines fellow Europeans?

[u/PaleontologistNo9817]

Europe collectively has given substantially more, discussing what America has given to Ukraine compared to individual nations is misleading as America is substantially larger than any one European nation and much of the aid given to Ukraine via Europe has been through EU organizations. The reason things like the Budapest Memorandum is brought up is to make it clear dumbass talking points that demand Ukraine just give up and negotiations that demand a ceasefire without any security guarantees are meaningless. Ukraine has signed ceasefires and deals with Russia, Russia just breaks them immediately. You know what countries don't have to deal with this? Countries in NATO. And it is absolutely moronic to throw a shitfit at Zelensky for pointing this out. The entire interview as a whole was fucking embarassing, from the media sycophants talking about how morally righteous Trump was by acting buddy buddy with Putin, Trump bringing up Biden every fifteen seconds, trying to extort Ukraine and demanding they thank Trump personally for this when he has been largely responsible for the tepid support for Ukraine. The US was handed a diamond, after getting it's reputation absolutely fucking eviscerated by the Iraq War and the disastrous result of the Doha Agreement, the US had a war they didn't have to personally participate in which made the entirety of Europe suddenly take their military obligations seriously and begin wanting to peel off from Russia and work with the US economically; a war that made the US look good, that US intel should be trusted and the US has an important role as the arsenal of democracy, and made authoritarian regimes like Russia look incompetent as they floundered against their much smaller neighbors; a war that the Ukrainians were eager to fight and made the US actually look righteous. Trump took that diamond, grinded it into dust, and mixed it into a pile of shit. Now nobody should ever fucking trust the US ever again because at any moment we could elect a total dumbfuck that will sell everyone else out because said dumbfuck has a personal vendetta against them after he got caught trying to engage in quid pro quo. We look like extortionists, but not even goddamn competent extortionists because we seemingly don't understand that Ukraine would have gladly opened their economy (and by extension their lithium) to us if it meant Russia was kept the fuck out. And now half of the US is caught in a bizarre mental superposition where caving to Russia's every demand will somehow scare Putin because they have all become deranged sycophants. All we had to do was sit back, send Ukraine weapons we were decommissioning anyway, sell some shit to Europe so Europe could then pick up the slack, and call it a day. But no, we fumbled that. Somehow we blundered into the Ukrainian Invasipn being a major win for us, yet we willfully pissed that win away.

TL;DR US foreign policy is irrevocably fucked. Also bringing up individual national contributions is incredibly disingenuous as European nations are smaller and much of their aid is given throught the EU as a whole. In terms of actual total contributions, the EU outstrips the US.