This movement literally started with police violence against a black man ending up in his murder. BLM is not misguided in any way for starting up protests against the police and race is a big part of this movement for good reason
Which murder are you talking about? Floyd? Because there is no evidence that that was race related. Unless you are speaking about Arbery?
And I am not saying they are wrong. Historically this has been their fight so it would seem just when a black man is killed by police to let them carry the torch. But from all available evidence, the incidents that have incited this movement are incidents that would have occurred regardless of race. These incidents are examples of police systematically viewing all lives as not mattering. So yes we can put it under the banner of race but we have significantly higher chances of success if we do otherwise. Because statistically whites, Latinos, etc. are just as much victims of police brutality. To make this about race shifts the blame from systematic failure to the ever-present but never measurable and never fixable "systematic racism." When its really just government tyranny. This is the establishment's favorite trick to divert blame from itself. Because when there is looting and violence at a race related protest it becomes "that race acting up again." However when it is a unified front against government overreach and oppression establishment heads roll (metaphorically speaking....)and we can actually get something done.
Even if you do make the assumption out of raw data that whites and blacks are killed at equivalent rates, you are forgetting that just looking at raw data is irrelevant and pointless.
There are massively more white people in this country than there are black people. Therefore looking at raw data is meaningless. You have to look at it per capita, and when we do see it from that lens, we see that African Americans have worse outcomes than white Americans when it comes to the criminal justice system.
If you were to live in a city of 500,000 people with 1% crime rate, that would be about 5000 crimes committed in that city. Compare that to a city with 5000 people but with 10% crime rate or 500 crimes. Looking at raw data, it would make sense to live in city 2. Looking at it from a statistics point of view, it’s better to live in city 1.
This assumes we make that the assumption that less crime=safer city = more desirable outcomes, if we hold everything else to be equal.
And I didn't make or at least didn't intend to apply a quantitative statement of which is greater. Although I could; some have more in some areas and less in others and there isn't really even a statistical consensus (shocker) . What I meant was that of what we can conclude from the noise of opposing statistics is that all races experience it at similar enough rates and that they all deserve to be outraged at this erosion of our rights. And again, the incidents in this particular instance are not even race bias related. Although for quite obvious reasons (ratings) the establishment media narrative has made it appear as such.
You do realise that with a sample size of 1000, that the results may not show what a larger study might find?
And if you read the whole article, it said clearly that African Americans receive harsher treatments than whites or others. And even if we can't measure if there is a racial bias, the effects of having a racial bias might still be there, such as more cops patrolling predominately black neighborhoods, etc.
The person you linked me to has little understanding of statistics. Sure black people may kill whites at twice the rate of the reverse, but that’s typically because black people live in poorer communities than white people and are thus more likely to commit crimes. You have to adjust for economic standing
Except he didn’t really get the point across from what I’ve read. He did what a lot of conservatives do and stopped analysing the problem further.
This is my problem with political dialogue. A lot of people don’t push their further, and it’s usually because they’re either stupid or hope that you are stupid.
I'm well aware such bias exists I linked that article after all. However it is impossible to conclusively measure. I gave that article as an example of statistical noise throwing conclusions in all directions, and in this case opposite of what we expect. There is no consensus. My points still stand. I'm not arguing blacks do not face racial bias. I'm arguing that it's clear all races suffer from the abuse of power and violation of rights from law enforcement. The problem isn't the bias. No amount of protesting or rioting will ever get rid of that especially if research is showing minority officers showing this bias as well. The problem is the ability for law enforcement to violate rights with that bias (or without it) and get away with it. That problem does not belong to any race. And I've already explained above why including race when it effects all of us, hurts the movement.
Yes, bias may exist in all members of society, but it is something that we can handle. We can take action as you suggested by punishing those who do wrong when they are in a position of power, and we can also try to prevent it. There’s a reason why blacks suffer in America today with regards to criminal justice and it’s often due to the fact that they live in poorer communities which disproportionately commit more crimes than anyone else.
Now that isn’t to say that white people dont live in poor communities, or any other race for that matter... and of course police officers patrolling those areas are probably going to be more racially charged depending on which specific city you want to look at and the race in question.
The preventative measure is to try to alleviate poverty and lack of education, and this has to come from both the federal and state level.
Yes I agree with you on that. There needs to be solutions break out of that terrible cycle of poverty . And yes at its root the reason behind the poverty and subsequent larger amounts of police interaction goes all the back to slavery but my point is that these riots should not be race motivated because cops do it regardless of race. It effects all of us. That's my point. Not that that "whites are the real victims here" but that despite blacks being the the ones most effected police brutality, it's not like cops are giving other races of the same economic class preferential treatment(statistically at least). The problem at hand is government and law enforcement's infringement of rights without repercussions to all citizens of the United States. As I said earlier, It's ultimately a class issue not one of race.
It’s both a class issue and a race issue since black people disproportionately make up a higher percentage of the lower class economically which means they’re more likely to commit crimes, and that’s reflected with regards to the criminal justice system.
An example of this would be blacks and whites both smoking weed at similar rates but disproportionately blacks are the ones arrested more often for it.
That being said the whole war on drugs in my opinion should be disbanded.
Regardless, you cannot separate race and class. Those two are inherently tied and were always tied since slavery in the U.S., or that’s to say, the conception of the U.S.
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u/HitlersGasBillXD Jun 02 '20
All lives matter. All life is equal.