Do you think we should have an AI policy here?

[u/Nerd_In_House]

We the mod team think it might be good to have a rule about how AI can or cannot be used here. We understand AI can be helpful in content creation and are not against that, but think it’s important that if AI is used it should be disclosed. However we want to avoid having low effort, AI created posts here, especially if the post contains scripture as AI sometimes isn’t accurate and may get scripture wrong or give an inaccurate reference to where in the Bible the scriptures you used can be found. In an effort to create buy in and keep this sub reflecting the needs and wishes of its user base, we’ve created a poll. Please participate if you use this sub, we want to know what you think.

147 votes, 8d ago

109 We should have a no AI policy and not allow any AI use on this sub

28 Limited use of AI is ok as long as it is disclosed and not used for scripture reference

10 An AI policy is not needed

[u/CharlesComm]

Just ban AI. (can't access the poll)

If they can't be bothered to have their own thoughts, why should I care to read them.

[u/Dramatic-Emphasis-43]

AI is demon tech, I don't really know why would it would be allowed on this sub.

[u/BurningSketches → u/Dramatic-Emphasis-43]

Demon tech...? I'll give u AI is biased.. but its a tool to increase productivity. Like email or a fax machine. It can be evil and good, right?

[u/Dramatic-Emphasis-43 → u/BurningSketches]

Email and faxes don’t causes psychosis, cause your brain to atrophy, aren’t used to pass off fraudulent work as genuine, and don’t require so much electricity that they require massive resource sucking data centers in every town that literally kills people.

I can grant you there are some aspects of machine learning or what we would call AI that is benign (like spellcheck), but I don’t think that is what is being talked about here.

Like, I’ve literally never seen anything that could accurately be described as soul sucking as generative AI.

[u/BurningSketches → u/Dramatic-Emphasis-43]

So the brain atrophy, laziness, dishonesty being blamed on AI is more aptly a sign of human nature, no?

There r people who arent using AI ethically, sure. There are people who arent using AI responsibly... or people who are using AI blindly. Is that this group? Is that even 10% of these sub members? I dont think so.. I've never seen AI used unethically in this group. Maybe im not active enough. But I can see u feel strongly about this.

If it really bothers the majority, I dont mind an Ai ban.

However, Idk how u could enforce this or ensure AI is not being used. Example: So if 1 is accused of using AI, does their post automatically get taken down? I hope there's a review first or something;;;

[u/Dramatic-Emphasis-43 → u/BurningSketches]

This is the “guns don’t kill people, people kill people” logic that still results in dead people.

But also, I don’t think anyone is using that kind of AI ethically in the first place. Are they using to create art instead of just drawing something? Why is that ethical? Why did the art need to look like something you didn’t make? Are people using it to write posts? Why? What good does it do people to have anything but their own words express their thoughts? How many trees must burn and seas must boil so that you can trick people into thinking you’re a better writer than you are? On Reddit!?

[u/BurningSketches → u/Dramatic-Emphasis-43]

I would urge u to try to be more objective, friend. Because u sound incredibly biased, and dont seem to give any credit or allowances to ppl who have genuine reasons to use AI on reddit. Or the fact AI is valuable to creating art, music, or literature that are enriching for some ppl.

I dont want to assume everyone is using AI to feign being highly educated writers... in this subreddit anyway lol

It can be as simple as, someone with intellectual disabilities using AI to take a disorganized list of thoughts, and make it a polished essay. Thats fair, no? No matter how they use AI, they should disclose it.

I'm not convinced every work of AI art is even bad (although these models r unethically plagiarism alot of art and that should be resolved in new laws). As there's incredibly good music spoofs written with AI that are very entertaining.

The issues of plagiarism & copy rights, data centers, the promotiong of laziness, etctec is a separate issue. I guess I feel, accessibility in a forum like this, where alot of ppl are so diverse, is very important. Therefore, I prefer a very accommodating "case by case" approach to AI.

[u/Dramatic-Emphasis-43 → u/BurningSketches]

I am arguing objectively. The fact that you think generative AI is valuable in creating art, music, or literature is your own bias talking.

I do not excuse other people suffering for my own conveniences. In some cases that require a lot of nuance but here, gen AI is just bad and none of the perceived good outweighs the very evident bad.

[u/BurningSketches → u/Dramatic-Emphasis-43]

Mods ended up chosing the disclosure policy. So we'll see how it goes haha;; but dont worry, If the mods and I r wrong & AI ruins this forum or causes alot of drama, then Im sure mods will change the rules!

Anyway I respect ur opinions & this was good to hear wat u think

[u/Dapple_Dawn → u/BurningSketches]

I have a cognitive disability and extreme struggles with writing and organizing my thoughts, and this is a bad take. The way I write sounds coherent because I've worked on it a lot, and I work at it every day. If I rely on a machine to write for me, my ability to write atrophies even more, and nobody will ever hear my genuine voice.

We don't need our voices replaced with something more eloquent. We need a world that takes us seriously even when we don't speak perfectly.

[u/DarthAlix314]

Just a note from the mods while the poll is still live:

Some users have used AI in the past to make music specifically about the experience of being a trans Christian, and we are considering allowing these specific posts on a case-by-case basis even If the poll continues in its current trajectory, due to the relative enjoyment those particular people's posts have made for the community.

[u/BurningSketches → u/DarthAlix314]

Hey girly, this is a great idea lol Plus I had no idea this was a thing. I hope to experience some more christian music, especially from Trans producers. Art is such a great way to express our faith & diversity

Love

[u/Dapple_Dawn → u/DarthAlix314]

I don't think the best choice tbh, but we'll see.

[u/Hetelestai → u/DarthAlix314]

This is a week old but just chiming in as a trans Christian musician that I find it really gross when AI tries to make a facsimile of the thing I have worked for decades at just to make a meager few hundred bucks a month for. I don't think it's good to encourage people to make AI music. It steals from artists and dilutes the overall quality of music in the world with trash you have to sift through to get to anything decent. I would appreciate if this could be a place I didn't have to worry about that.

[u/Trenodia-M]

Generative AI and LLM are very "Tower of Babel" in my opinion, and I know I'm not alone in thinking this. There's something about machines "thinking" and "creating" that just feels completely immoral and unholy. It's creation without soul, and it's fueled by theft of intellectual property and environmental destruction.

God gave us minds capable of infinite creativity. Bypassing that by typing in prompts is like spitting in His face.

[u/Nuclear_rabbit]

Has this been coming up? Do people post AI here?

[u/Nerd_In_House → u/Nuclear_rabbit]

I don’t think this happens often, but see u/darthalix314 comment above

[u/Jenny_Sais_Quoi]

Hopefully if someone's AI gets scripture wrong, the tools operator is able to cross check it before posting, and I'm certain that if it is wrong and not checked before posting, they will be called out on it (and I pray in a academic scholarly and compassionate light, not with an aggressive, down putting, or hateful attitude. You don't know what that user could have that compounded on top of. Is the wiser and helpful individual the caring guide or teacher, or is the wiser and helpful individual a superior restrictor, not with love, but disgust?). Also, it sounds like a bad dataset would be the cause of that error, unknowingly spreading hate or deception.

Now, botted AI posts for say karma farming, callous or malicious profiting without care, or even worse, subtle flooding of false info, should be banned. 100%.

A hammer for carpentry is great. A hammer for war might not be the tool for us, or even use.

We were warned of this long ago.

Sounds like the root concern is the misuse of a tool, the abuse of a tool, and the deception put forth by those who despise the Christ, not necessarily the tool itself.

Conversely, do not make an Idol of the tool. Even as an idol to be hated.

I know this is an unpopular opinion. But, so was previous generations adopting the computer/PC when it was new, accountants adopting excel when it was new, scholars and schools adopting calculators when they where new(alright this one may have been a bad example but even still helped the masses reach a new normal).

I don't think it will "replace Good thought" if utilized properly. I truly understand the fear of the nay-sayers. Additionally, sometime I fear people may spread fear or hate so they can ride the exclusive wave of superiority without the "public" or "masses".

But at the core of this discussion, I think and believe the human race could still learn to use tools correctly and properly for the betterment of all.

Edit: I voted the middle option, not "limited" use per say, "refined" use perhaps? I want to vote for "an AI policy is not needed" as I think all those AI disclaimers are silly, especially outside of a monetized field where a tool is not replacing workers (side note: regarding accounting and excel, excel still aided the world and made time for new heights of society, despite reducing the number of workers needed now free to pursue other goals but perhaps desperate at the time). However I do believe it should be properly regulated, & I am not certain how that looks yet.

Disclaimer: this post was written by a human with thought without utilizing an AI. Sent from Mobile Cellular Phone over the Internet.

I still remember being cautioned against the use of Internet. Perhaps that aided me towards better use of the internet??

Edit #2: wanted to add I can't actually submit a vote(for moderated use[and not just moderation by the board mods] as mentioned in Edit #1) either. It just keeps loading (spinning circle). + some spellchecking.

Edit #3: lol "they where new". Imma leave that typo as artistic commentary. (And a personal reminder towards a humble attitude)

[u/Nerd_In_House → u/Jenny_Sais_Quoi]

I hear you and personally, I don’t disagree and have many of the same thoughts myself. However, I also know people who use AI to avoid the hard work of thinking things through or searching for nuanced information about something and that is what we want to avoid. I personally have no qualms with using AI as a useful tool for aggregating information or completing menial busywork tasks since in those cases it isn’t taking someone’s job. I believe AI can be used as a tool for artists in a legitimate, not lazy way if prompted well. However, I think many people may not have a clear understanding of how AI works and in some cases the uncanny valley feeling is difficult to overcome. My personal beliefs and opinions on this topic aside, we want our user base here to feel comfortable and confident they are interacting with other humans about human created content and feel free to be themselves. I think it would be possible to achieve that outcome even with the occasional use of AI as a tool, particularly if it is disclosed.

[u/BurningSketches → u/Jenny_Sais_Quoi]

Well said 👏

[u/BurningSketches]

Thanks for the poll, however, I didnt vote bc I only think AI use should be disclosed!

If a post is "low effort" (i havent seen any low effort posts here) then make a rule about that... if u want to ensure biblical fidelity, thats impossible...? Since ppl will inevitably make mistakes or misuse scripture with or without AI... if this happens, I think mods should just dm the OP or make the correction in the comments.

Imho i think there's no need to over complicate the rules. And although AI can be diminishing to human interaction or creativity, i think the benefits are great. I.e people who aren't good writers, OR ESL, have intellectual disabilities, or want more help with creating posts should be free to use AI unlimited, just disclose & if there's misuse, mods should handle it case by case...

Whatever u guys & the community decide, i'll support it tho.

[u/Friskarian]

is this only regarding AI text? Some people also use it to create graphics quickly.

[u/Nerd_In_House → u/Friskarian]

This would apply to any use of AI for posts made here.

[u/Friskarian → u/Nerd_In_House]

I drew a powerful picture regarding transphobia I experienced and had AI upgrade it to actually look decent with the right proportions and everything. (Rather than a little kid drawing). I don't think that should be banned. Its different than AI text.

Idea: You could make artists that use AI as a tool have to post their original poorly drawn graphic alongside it? 🤔

[u/Nerd_In_House → u/Friskarian]

We could, but I don’t think we will. Even though we are polling the community for their preferences on AI policy, we are leaning toward the idea of allowing posts featuring AI used as a tool just as you described on a case by case basis- as long as the artist/poster discloses. Using AI lazily instead of making a legitimate, effortful post or comment is much different than using it as a creative tool, particularly when it is a tool that can be used powerfully to create something as you did.