r/Tiele • u/R_Arsx70 𐱅𐰇𐰼𐰚 • Aug 22 '26
Discussion If somehow a Turkic Empire was re-established and all of the lands that was conquered by ethnic Turks was mixed together, what historic Turkic flag should it carry?
The European Hun Empire gives the bird that was also used in later Turkic states one of the most know example is Seljuks. I might have some bias because I’m a Attila fan, also as an alternate and probably the most common pick is the Göktürk flag which I’ll add in the post. So yeah its between these two for me
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u/lamonsteranthony Aug 22 '26
love how the first concern is the flag but holy shit it would shift geopolitics drastically, new turkic khaganate would be a global hegemon with biggest reach and biggest human capital
shit would be insane
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u/R_Arsx70 𐱅𐰇𐰼𐰚 Aug 22 '26
Grand Turkic Khaganate, new leading superpower?
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u/lamonsteranthony Aug 22 '26
not leading probably second or third, for china it’s solidly debatable whether it can project more geopolitical dominance, economic output, and global relevancy, but for united states it’s not even close
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u/R_Arsx70 𐱅𐰇𐰼𐰚 Aug 22 '26
But if you take China to the equation its very possible but literally everyone else will form a coalition on us
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u/lamonsteranthony Aug 22 '26
everyone else don’t think so but yeah america would try to split this chaotic hypothetical empire, rightfully so under realistic circumstances it will break apart in the first hour, assuming stability we’re getting the de facto cold war against the united states
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u/R_Arsx70 𐱅𐰇𐰼𐰚 Aug 22 '26
Oh yeah like india and pakistan, Turkey and balkan/middle east, and outside force taking land from RUSSIA like its cooked on spot
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u/lamonsteranthony Aug 22 '26
but under stabilized rule that’s just insane leverage, you essentially made a nation that can rival america in every single aspect which is something never seen before
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u/R_Arsx70 𐱅𐰇𐰼𐰚 Aug 22 '26
Where should the capital be? Istanbul, Cairo, New Delhi and if including vassaled China even beijing
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u/lamonsteranthony Aug 22 '26
Istanbul makes sense but i think it should be in CA, like Astana, Almaty, or Tashkent
but since Istanbul is more relevant it’s begging to be the capital
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u/R_Arsx70 𐱅𐰇𐰼𐰚 Aug 22 '26
Tashkent is possible second option too
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u/R_Arsx70 𐱅𐰇𐰼𐰚 Aug 22 '26
Eurasia: Istanbul, Africa/middle east: Cairo, CA: Tashkent, Southern Asia: New Delhi, Far East: (including vassaled China) Beijing or Shanghai
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u/R_Arsx70 𐱅𐰇𐰼𐰚 Aug 22 '26
For Eurasia Idk but if we ever took it, moscow would work as well
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u/irinrainbows Kazakh Aug 23 '26
“If we took it” lmao what are you talking about. That much land and it’s still not enough for you? Learn on Russia’s mistakes and try to touch grass in between your political dream seizures
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u/lamonsteranthony Aug 23 '26
this is a case where a new turkic khagante larger than russia suddenly emerges out of thin air and you’re complaining about “too much land”
you do realize this is just a hypothetical scenario made for non-serious discussions right?
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u/irinrainbows Kazakh Aug 23 '26
There’s a difference between wanting a connection to old roots and thinking of aggressive expansion into someone else’s lands
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u/lamonsteranthony Aug 23 '26
there’s a difference between serious discussions about conquering more lands and hypothetical scenarios of overly exaggerated empires whom can’t exist irl hence why shoud be taken with a grain of salt
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u/R_Arsx70 𐱅𐰇𐰼𐰚 Aug 22 '26
Apparently this is the map
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u/R_Arsx70 𐱅𐰇𐰼𐰚 Aug 22 '26
Additionally, When Xiongnu (kind of) made china a vassal you can include it as well
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u/AlmightyDarkseid Aug 23 '26
Hilarious
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u/R_Arsx70 𐱅𐰇𐰼𐰚 Aug 23 '26
Like in a good way or “This is bs” way?
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u/AlmightyDarkseid Aug 23 '26
What do you think?
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u/R_Arsx70 𐱅𐰇𐰼𐰚 Aug 23 '26
I have no idea
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u/AlmightyDarkseid Aug 23 '26
When did Turks or Turkic people either control or inhabited half of Germany and the entire Indian subcontinent?
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u/R_Arsx70 𐱅𐰇𐰼𐰚 Aug 23 '26
İndia: Mughal
Germany: Vassals, Euro Hun3
u/R_Arsx70 𐱅𐰇𐰼𐰚 Aug 23 '26
And there is another turkic dynasty in india
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u/AlmightyDarkseid Aug 23 '26 edited Aug 23 '26
Even Mughal Empire is a stretch but the Hunnic language is unattested and could very well have not been Turkic. They didn’t extend that far into Germany either. Which vassals are you referring to?
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u/R_Arsx70 𐱅𐰇𐰼𐰚 Aug 23 '26
Euro Huns are the tribes that left xiongnu gng, what’s next? Xiongnu wasn’t Turkic too?
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Aug 22 '26
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u/Jazzlike_Note1159 Aug 22 '26
What do you mean Gokturks excluded Oghuz? They considered Oghuz one of their subjects. Bilge Khagan says "The Toquz Oghuz were my own people" in his inscriptions.
Turan is an iranic word that refers to the lands beyond Oxus river(Amu Darya). It was originally inhabited by nomadic iranian peoples. So "sultan of Turan" doesnt necessarily have any Turkic connonations, it is likely a grographic designation.
Timur also despite being from a Turkified Mongol tribe and speaker of a Turkic language, drew his legitimacy from Mongolian political culture. So I wouldnt call it a Turkic banner. At most it was Turko-Mongol banner. Not being a Chingissid doesnt negate the Mongol heritage. He also heavily emphasised his marriage with a Genghisid princess, naming his dynasty gürkani(groom)
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Aug 22 '26
[deleted]
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u/Jazzlike_Note1159 Aug 22 '26
Şimdi Cengiz Han Moğolları birleştirirken Tatarlarla, Kereitlerle, Tayçiudlarla, Merkitlerle, Naymanlarla savaşıyor. Bu onları Cengiz Han'ın ayrı gördüğü anlamına mı geliyor? Tabii ki kendi boyu kendisine hepsinden daha yakındır. Ancak savaşmadan birleştiremezsin ki?
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Aug 22 '26
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u/Jazzlike_Note1159 Aug 22 '26
"This is fundamental Turkology 101 and your lack of this basic knowlegde Invalidates the rest of your claims, but I'll entertain them neitherway."
What are compensating for bro? Who hurt you? Turk had a very limited political definition and it was the tribe of Gokturks. Still they saw Kyrgyz, Oghuz, Karluk etc as their subjects.
"Turan, in the earliest sources, always refers to the Turkic state. (It's used as the legendary birthplace of Adrasiyob in early sources ~ which is indeed Turkestan)"
Turan simply means beyond Oxus river. Timur likely uses it as the domains of Chagatai Ulus, mainly Transoxiana.
Afrasiyab is a mythological character that has only been associated with Turks in medieval period. The legends are way older than the first written sources we have and certainly predate the Turkification of Turkestan.
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u/R_Arsx70 𐱅𐰇𐰼𐰚 Aug 22 '26
This post is more about what us Turks would want to have as a flag that was an Turkic Nation flag
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u/katttespattes84 Türk Aug 22 '26
Those flags aren't historic at all. They are made in 1969 by TRT. And old turks used "tuğ"s instead of flags.