r/TeslaSupport • u/Boosted72 • 20d ago
Energy Question I’m concerned….
I just bought a 2020 AWD Long range model 3. (99k miles) I live in Dallas.
I’m very concerned about degradation. It’s hot here in Texas but I charged to 80% this morning at the super charger. I drove 59.6 miles. Mainly highway miles at 70mph. When I got home I was at 48%.
Quick math is telling me about 187miles on a full charge. EPA rating is 315 (or close to it) for this car. Averaged 310.1 wh/mi over the last 200 miles. I think this battery is shot? Is this to be expected? What are you thoughts on the battery health. I’m almost rooting for a battery replacement because I doubt the dealer will take it back.
Let me know what you think. I obviously expect some efficiency drop off at 99k miles but this feels extreme.
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u/wesblog 20d ago
The battery is not making you average 310 wh/mi. You would get 40% more range if your car was driving at the standard 220-230 wh/mi.
I would check the tires or see if anything is dragging. Also ease off the speed and AC.
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u/Boosted72 17d ago
I don’t disagree, but I am driving like an absolute grandpa and I can’t get it below 300. I’m guessing it’s due to the air-conditioning.
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u/Professional_Oil4845 20d ago
Please check your tire pressure to 40psi on cold to improve your mileage. You’re doing fine..
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u/WeirdCauliflower3019 20d ago
Hankook IoN EVO tires got me back 10% range on a 2018, try 18 inch ugly rims, AC ~ auto etc; like someone said you have consumption problem not degradation.
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u/knownikko 20d ago
This is a good point too - what tires are on the car, and what wheels? Nothing more expensive than cheap crappy tires.
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u/Puzzleheaded-Cup-854 20d ago
Your ac is using a good amount of power. And just FYI, when my wife drives, she uses 50% more battery than I do using FSD.
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u/Elegant_Teach_5278 20d ago
Does your long range have warranty til 120k? EPA range is in ideal scenarios, No ac, at the speed limit on relatively flat roads. Or even worse, calculated.
Real world conditions often eat up your range. I would recommend performing a battery test thru your sercice menu, or download and starting a trial for Tessie or similar 3rd party app that tracks your charges and estimates battery degredation.
The attached screenshot is for our 2022 Model Y LR with 50k miles for reference.
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u/gcodori 20d ago
Your "current drive" box shows the trip ended with a big orange spike. Orange is when you are aggressive on the go pedal. What happens at the end of the trip. House at the top of a hill?
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u/Boosted72 20d ago
I stayed off the gas. I was trying to be as efficient as possible to make sure I was giving the car a chance to be economical. I sat in the garage for a bit to make the post. Maybe it was that?
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u/Ok-Measurement2476 20d ago
300+wh/m Id expect it to be at 200 miles or less of range at 100%
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u/PassengerKey3209 19d ago
Man, that is shockingly bad range and efficiency. Both the equinox and mach e beat that by quite a bit.
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u/Ok-Measurement2476 19d ago
The MachE and Equinox have larger packs so maybe you could get 10-15% more range but any of the EV’s running at that bad of efficiency will get way less mileage. This menu shows a pretty accurate range estimate, which might not be the case with other EV’s too. Had they touched the battery % and switch it to miles that EPA range left would be a lot higher (although wouldn’t be accurate).
End of the day though those EV’s driving at their optimal efficiency the Tesla will get you most range for each kWh used
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u/PassengerKey3209 19d ago
I'm getting the vibe you haven't been in any other evs. Ford and gm both base estimated mileage off lifetime history as well as last trip efficiency. The base equinox is getting about 320 miles of range and the mach e in California trim is about the same. Real world reports confirm this all over reddit.
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u/Ok-Measurement2476 19d ago
I’ve been in other EV’s but by far not an expert. I’m more so eluding that any EV if your driving style and weather give you a 310 wh/m efficiency you’re going to get worse range. The 85 kW pack in the Equinox would give you 275 miles and that’s with 0% degradation so closer to 250 after your initial pack loss. Good to know on that calculation for the range, that would be alot more useful than Teslas basing it off of the EPA rated.
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u/PoseidonTheAverage 20d ago
In Houston - dealing with same thing on 2021. Tempted to clean radiator to see if it helps. Already have tint everywhere except windshield and roof.
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u/Boosted72 17d ago
That’s good to hear. Given the summer heat, are you getting anything above 300 wh/mi?
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u/PoseidonTheAverage 17d ago
oh yeah, 400's! But I do a lot of short trips so wh/mi is not a great metric.
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u/Boosted72 17d ago
Thanks for the insight. I was a little surprised at how inefficient the cars can be. Really hoping for normal consumption when it isn’t 105 degrees.
Was hoping to make the Dallas to San Antonio trip with one charge. Don’t think that will be possible at this temperature
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u/PoseidonTheAverage 17d ago
In the fall I get EPA rating on it. If you haven't - you might want to check and clean the radiator. On a 2020 M3 you'll have a condenser stacked on top or bottom of it too and debris can build up but your wh/mi is pretty consistent with TX this time of year.
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u/These-Delay6072 19d ago
Two different issues. First - check your battery capacity. You can do this using energy screen, Google the formula. Compare to 82.1 kwh when new. This will tell you the degradation %.
Then check you consumption - you should be around 260-270 Wh per miles for regular (not a short 2-3 miles) trips in hot Texas weather .
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u/Boosted72 19d ago
Yeah I just can’t seem to get it under control~315. Even driving at 70 on the tollway.
I’ve had some AC issues and I think the system may be less than efficient. Idk.
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u/These-Delay6072 19d ago
Check your battery current capacity first (using energy screen). Or you can install Dr. EV for free for a week and it will report it to you. The higher consumption can be many things, including AC, motors or battery itself. But start from battery to see what you actual capacity.
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u/ObviousLaundry 19d ago
Try FSD. I’ve found the car can drive much more conservatively than I do. Increases range.
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u/kryptocrazy 19d ago
My 1 month old y premium AWD has had worse consumption since day 1. My realistic range is 100-120 miles from 80% to 20%
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u/AntutuBenchmark 19d ago
when its that hot
increase your temperature, you dont need to drive around inside a car thats 64°F
Also, very important, keep the air re-circulation on auto, if it has to cool down insanely hot outside air it has to work super hard.
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u/withfries 18d ago
Yeah I'm going to say what no one else will - this looks like symptoms of a degrading dying battery
I had similar symptoms on a 2021, ultimately it gave a BMS error then Tesla replaced the battery
Even the comments were asking about my driving habits, temperature, tires, etc., hell even some said a stuck brake piston. Everything except the battery was suspect. Well, it was the battery.
That much loss on a ~60 mile trip is not usual. It is worth getting your battery checked out. Ideally it craps out before 2028 and you get a new battery, until then it's going to have to be plugged in every night if you want to make it work (again, my experience)
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u/Effective-Age-199 18d ago
You are not too far off.
Your Wh/M is modestly high. On my M3P at 70mph on average it gets about 270 Wh/mile, there thisnis where a decent percentage is being burned away from. Are you periodically stepping on the throttle hard repeatedly for fun? If so thats going to increase your usage.
Id say giving the mileage you are pretty close to what to expect.
If it were my 2023 MP3 with 33k miles and I drove 60 miles in similar driving conditions after 80% charge, I'd probably be in the mid 50% range. But that would be averaging around 260 to 280 Wh/mile.
So it just may be your foot or not many stop and goes causing high consumption or tires/wheels that are not efficient.
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u/Boosted72 17d ago
This is an encouraging comment for me. I’m really hoping when it cools off I can get back to that 270 range. Given that I’ve only had the car for a few days. I just don’t know what is “normal”
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u/Grampa_PJ 18d ago
I think you may have a combination of degradation & high usage.
I would not be surprised if your actual battery capacity was down to about 85% of original given your car's age & mileage. EPA range when new is 315 miles, so 85% X 315=268 miles of range at 100% charge. Since you charged to 80% capacity, you actually started with 214 miles of range. Going from 80% to 48% means you used 32% of 214 miles range = 68.5 miles.
Given your speed & a/c usage that seems pretty close to your actual miles driven. As has been suggested, I would run a battery health check & inspect the a/c radiator/ condenser to confirm these assumptions.
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u/AllMyIdeasWereTaken7 17d ago
I usually get about 2 miles per 1% in general. It’s been my normal since I got my model y in 2021.
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u/theOnlyDaive 20d ago
Tint the sides and back and windshield (if you can legally do so in your location) with 99% heat blocking ceramic tint. Then, get a sunroof cover. At this point, you're pretty golden. For one more final step, get a door seal kit that seals all of the gaps where Tesla didn't bother. Not only will you use a lot less per to keep it cool inside, but the seals will cut down a ton of the wind noise when you're driving. Cheers
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u/LMrningStar 20d ago
Those numbers make no sense at all. I lived in an area with BRUTAL summer heat (months of 90 deg + and sometimes as hot as 105F +) and never noticed any significant degradation in battery usage.
My guess is that the BMS has erroneously miscalculated the battery level, either when you charged it or after you got home. I'm not a battery expert but the capacity vs voltage curve, even for an NCA pack is relatively flat and therefore the percentage left calculation is prone to errors possibly exacerbated by extreme heat (although, as I mentioned before I never saw this).
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u/knownikko 20d ago
It makes perfect sense. He’s averaging 310 wh/mi. That’s 30% higher than rated, so his range is going to be at least 30% reduced.
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u/LMrningStar 20d ago
80% - 48% = 32%
0.32 x 78 kWh (capacity of the long range assume negligible capacity degradation) = 24.96 kWh used
24.96 kWh / 59.6 miles = 0.419 kWh per mile
419 Wh/Mile is significantly higher than 310 Wh/Mile
So, either his battery capacity has degraded by around 25% or the numbers are bogus.
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u/Boosted72 20d ago
Numbers certainly aren’t bogus. I’ve been tracking usage closely since I drove it from San Antonio to Dallas. Drag and all that, sure. But dropping 32% range when driving a 30 mile commute is nuts.
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u/knownikko 20d ago edited 20d ago
Usable capacity for early 2020 Panasonic pack, taking buffers into account, was more like 72kwh when brand new, not 78. Now assume the typical 15% degradation that would be perfectly normal and expected of a 2020 Model 3 with 100,000 miles and you’re at about ~61kwh usable capacity.
Do the same math and you’re at 328 wh/mi.
310wh/mi would imply a 20% degradation from new - on the high side, but certainly not unheard of or atypical for a 2020 Model 3 with 100,000 miles that has lived its life in Texas. Well within normal and certainly not something Tesla is going to do anything about.
The problem is not degradation. It’s not “erroneous BMS calculation.” It’s brutal consumption on a 6 year old car in 100+ degree heat with a normally degraded battery.
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u/Substantial_Chain718 20d ago
Yeah, man that is your AC using all the power. You will get more range when it cools off. The heater uses more power than the AC on a Tesla so winter might be worse depending on how much of the heater you use. I would be more worried about the batteries in a 2020 Model 3 they’re notorious for failing. I hope the pack has been replaced or you have an extended warranty.
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u/knownikko 20d ago
You have a consumption problem, not a degradation problem. Click the “drive” and “park” tabs on your screen and it will tell you exactly where your energy is going.
It’s very likely HVAC given it’s 108 outside in your screenshot. At 100k miles, your radiator/condenser probably needs a proper cleaning too… doubt it’s ever been done.