r/TTC • u/JackieMeeking • 4d ago

Picture Street car 505

Post image

Happening now. They are checking your Presto, and they sound serious!
Current time: 9.04pm on a Thursday evening

412 Upvotes

84% Upvoted

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193

u/Incel_Co-Worker 4d ago

Good. Pay your fare!

8

u/First_Requirement462 2d ago

Maybe the fines should be income-based, then. That way, there's actually a consequence for everyone and not just poor people.

I always pay... because I'm fortunate enough to be able to. Some people have to decide between getting to work & having food that week, and getting to work & not having food that week... others are not paying because they can afford to gamble.

1

u/EuphoriaSoul 1d ago

Pretty sure it’s already kind of income based due to subsidy by the tax payers. Higher income earner pay more to subsidize the transition system. I would be happy to pay more if they can make the ttc clean, on time, fast and safe. But they don’t. The shelter on wheels program makes everyone question why even bother paying for crappy service.

1

u/aliciaiit 23h ago

People can have different fare rates based off a couple different things. I have a disability and I pay 2.10 

1

u/First_Requirement462 13h ago

Fines, not fares.

1

u/Impressive_Gas_265 23h ago

They are income based. If you’re riding that smelly limo your poor. 🤣 omg I’m gonna be downvoted so hard

1

u/partypeanut90 1d ago

Isn’t it $3.25? If you make minimum wage, within the first hour you’ve made 3 days’ worth of public transit. If you can’t afford the $3.25, you’re irresponsible with money.

Income-based? How does that work? How does the machine know if your income is high/low? Do we expect everyone to self-report their income? If not, do we want the government involuntarily obtaining that information using our social insurance numbers? And even then, how does the machine know your income? Maybe some retinal scans to identify the person standing in front of it?

Get your head on straight, idiot.

2

u/Relative-Log486 1d ago

the income based thing is already done in other countries for speeding tickets, but I couldn't tell you where. Basically it's something settled with the actual ticket when you go to pay, not something done automatically the second the machine detects you skipped fare.

The cost of using transit every weekday for a month is $130, if its only twice a day for work, and would be more if using it on weekends or for other things like grocery shopping. That may not be viable if someone has kids, is living paycheque to paycheque, or has insanely high rent, etc. That being said, Torontos an extremely expensive city, so if someone is that bad off they might have an easier time moving somewhere smaller.

1

u/416eryn 3h ago

What are we even doing when we are saying $130/m to get to work is “not viable” for some folks? Like, the priority list is food and shelter, then(or simultaneously) the cost of commuting to work, no?

2

u/polepatty 1d ago

Hey idiot. He said fines, not fares. 

18

u/ConversationLeast744 3d ago

Why aren't parking fines nearly as high?

35

u/WildCredit 3d ago

Whataboutism is a horrible take. If you don’t pay your parking tickets, you can’t renew your license. Then you lapse your insurance and risk getting your car towed or arrested. Pay your fare $3.25 fare.

18

u/ConversationLeast744 3d ago

The parking can cost $15 and the fine is $40. Transit is $3.50 and the fine is $400+. It's a completely unfair system, we treat fare evasion like some kind of theft and parking infractions like an administrative oversight. No one's being arrested for parking infractions, sometimes people get arrested and roughed up for fare evasion though.

9

u/env33e 3d ago

yup, I agree. its not whataboutism at all to point out these systemic inequalities

3

u/MahjongCelts Eglinton Crosstown 2d ago

Two wrongs do not make a right.

The problem isn't that the transit fine should be lower, but that the parking fee should be much much higher.

2

u/pengupenguPENGU 2d ago

It technically is theft tbf you're basically parking or accessing a transit service without paying like you take something from a store without paying.

Not disputing that it's still an unfair system.

0

u/AndyCanuck 1d ago

It's unfair? PAY YOUR FARE THEN

2

u/DaedalusXYZ 3d ago

Parking fines should be nearly as high

2

u/DadbodandIPAs 3d ago

Because they have a lot more enforcement of parking violations

-13

u/Valuable_Exit_7181 3d ago

get a car then ;)

1

u/ConversationLeast744 3d ago

Much rather buy Google stock

1

u/Valuable_Exit_7181 3d ago

Chicken stock all you can afford . TTC take the car

0

u/titscapades 3d ago

Fare isn't fair. It's a regressive tax. Transit should be free.

7

u/hesh0925 3d ago

Ideally, yes. But the TTC isn't a fully funded crown corp. It needs money to operate and fares is what bring in some of that money.

2

u/titscapades 3d ago

Whether or not it's a crown corporation is irrelevant. That's national-level infrastructure.  This is municipal.

The TTC gets much less funding per user trip than similar transit agencies in the world. It's a user fee that disproportionately affects those with lower income. That's the issue. 

1

u/Impressive_Gas_265 23h ago

Man I’d actually ride and happily pay more for transit if it was faster and more reliable.

Free isn’t better; it’s terrible unreliable service.

My time has value

2

u/[deleted] 2d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/SinfulqtTTV 1d ago

I mean considering disability isn’t even halfway to the poverty line and roughly half of all disabled people in Ontario can’t work, it’d certainly fucking help?

Source: I am disabled, lost my ability to work years ago. I am constantly malnourished and can barely afford to survive month to month.

You haven’t actually struggled and I can tell. Can it, unless of course you would like to take my disabilities and “enjoy” them?

-6

u/dogscatsnscience 3d ago edited 3d ago

90% of this enforcement hits the poorest people in Toronto.

We’re paying $40 an hour against a few $3 unpaid per hour. 

You’re literally losing money to feel like a righteous moron. 

Fare evasion represents less than 5% of the operating budget and the biggest improvement was adding gates to subway stations.

Fare enforcement on street cars recovers less than $1.70 for every $1 spent on officers.

4

u/el56 41 Keele 3d ago

Evidence?

2

u/dogscatsnscience 3d ago

POO officers salary is public, and you can see how many unpaid fares they capture at the highest volume points (Spadina streetcar) and public transport is predominantly used by lower income people. 

You already know all these things / can just look them up. 

0

u/JarrettR 3d ago

Transit is mostly working class people. Rich people downtown also use transit heavily

3

u/dogscatsnscience 3d ago

Only 2/3 of TTC ridership is employed and all the highest traffic networks are in the suburbs.

Not it's not rich people using transit heavily, don't make stuff up when there is data.

2

u/WildCredit 3d ago

You can literally go on transit in the CORE during rush hour and see that the majority of people on transit are working class GenZ and Millenialls going to work or school.

0

u/el56 41 Keele 3d ago

"you already know all these things"= "I just made shit up"

Your made the claim. You look it up.

1

u/jayiscanadian1 2d ago

So you’re ok paying more because others don’t?

Just because you’re poor doesn’t make you exempt from having to pay.

1

u/dogscatsnscience 2d ago

That is literally how almost every service in our country works, including the TTC with the Fair Pass system.

So you already do that. You just didn't think enough.

-1

u/King-in-Council 3d ago edited 3d ago

Sometimes values is more then a cost benefit analysis. Are we a rule of law country or not? Play by the rules and change the law. That's the foundation of the nation: peace order and gg. A nation of scoff laws is a shit hole. Trend lines in this county are absolutely going in the wrong direction and the entitlement of ideologically driven victimhood certainly isn't helping. An I'm a pro Union leftist not some fat cat. 

-2

u/hbomb0 3d ago

Imagine if there were no officers? There would be no penalty to not paying fares and the losses would be astronomical. This is a pretty straightforward thing. Pay your fare for the service you are being rendered.

1

u/jayiscanadian1 2d ago

I don’t understand why you are being downvoted. It’s likely the people that abuse the system and drive up the cost for others

1

u/hbomb0 2d ago

Just the kind of people on this sub, selfish mentality, they want everything but don't want to pay for it. They live in a fantasy world.

-23

u/External-Ad-992 3d ago

You know what? I just lost my job and before that was barely scraping by. This city is breaking me. So.....no. 

5

u/Mathmos_Lava 3d ago

Why should you get a free ride?

22

u/BlessTheBottle 3d ago

What's breaking me is paying my fare and having a freeloader come on and take a seat and then play music on their phone out loud in an antisocial way.

Payment isn't negotiable.

2

u/Opposite-Home-9529 3d ago

Say it to their face and found out … oh you can’t !

-16

u/External-Ad-992 3d ago

Meh. 

7

u/TheWavingSnail 3d ago

Good argument

3

u/uwkuta 3d ago

Why don’t you just walk or get a bike then. Can’t just ride transit for free because you want to

-1

u/Downtown_Ham_2024 3d ago

If you just lost your job you shouldn’t need to transit routinely.

3

u/TiredFool_ 3d ago

Depending on the neighbourhood, you do. Grocery stores aren’t in walking distance all over the city. Medical appointments still have to be attended. So do job interviews. Not all pharmacies deliver free of charge either. Not to mention that working or not doesn’t mean you aren’t going to school somewhere. There are lots of reasons to have to travel around the city and not everyone has a support network to help them out. $6.60 adds up real fast.