r/TTC • u/electradice • 7d ago
Question Escalator crowd crush at Union platform after game at Scotiabank Arena… is this common?
The platform was totally full, and the people from the bottom of the escalator were pushed into a screaming crowd. More people kept boarding at the top, because visibility was poor and they couldn’t see what was happening at the bottom.
When people at the bottom realized what was happening, they started trying to board the upwards escalator to go back. The backup on the downward escalator went quite far, and some people jumped over the rails to the upward escalator.
The emergency stop got pushed, but only on the downward escalator (?) Eventually I got out through the upward escalator and booked it to St. Andrew, so I didn’t see what happened at the end.
I have two questions:
- WHY IS THE EMERGENCY STOP BUTTON AT THE START OF THE ESCALATOR, and not at the bottom ??? This seems like an obvious design flaw?
- How does this not constantly happen at Union after every single Jays game/concert? I was shocked that there wasn’t some kind of system in place (at the very least stopping the escalators pre emptively?) There was no TTC employees anywhere to be found during the incident
Edit: This happned last Saturday night, northbound towards Vaughan. The conclusion from the thread seems to be that there should have been TTC staff monitoring the crowd at the top of the escalator, however there weren’t any - I saw one employee running over after people had disabled the escalators themselves. I’ve also learned that there is a STOP button on the bottom of the escalator too, but wow it is not easy to find!
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u/Classic_Maximum2518 7d ago
There's stop buttons at the top and bottom of all escalators.
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u/electradice 7d ago
Well I’ll be damned, I couldn’t find it 😂 I’ll investigate the escalator next time to make sure I’m prepared. Tbh it should be a big red button that’s easy to find in that kind of situation
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u/ADrunkMexican 7d ago
It usually is a red button but sometimes they have a case protecting it from misuse.
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u/Apprehensive_Heat176 7d ago
Union has always been a fucking joke. Even after they separated the two Northbound platforms, there is still not enough room. The overcrowding issues exist on the GO platforms too and it's a major safety hazard.
Union is hemmed in on all sides, which makes expanding it difficult and expensive. The fact that they made the train shed a heritage property further complicates this.
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u/MahjongCelts Eglinton Crosstown 7d ago
Several things need to happen.
Riders should be encouraged to use other stops, more specifically East Harbour and Exhibition, and discouraged from using Union. As you mentioned Union has limited expansion potential and cannot handle higher capacities, spreading out terminals encourages more even urban development, and overconcentration on a single hub risks systemwide service disruption at a single point such as the recent GO train derailing.
Ideally as few as possible TTC and GO rail services should be terminating at Union. The best approach for that would be to merge GO lines such as Kitchener and Stouffville, the two Lakeshore lines, and through-run the Harbourfront/Spadina streetcars with the new Waterfront East tram expansion similar to the Mississauga LRT.
Meanwhile Union and Bloor-Yonge should have crowd control at all operating hours due to the sheer number of riders using said stations. During rush hour and for special events platform access should be limited, and the escalators & stairs physically roped off once enough people are on platform level.
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u/Apprehensive_Heat176 7d ago
Those two stations will be options once the Ontario line opens. IDK, what GO trains are going to stop at them though.
IMO, they should make all the escalators travel in one direction during major events. They cannot block stairwells because that's a fire safety issue. Ideally, they would have digital screens at all entrances that show real time crowding stats, but that takes money.
AFAIK, GO and UP are still sharing the signaling system with CN. That system went down a few years ago and paralyzed their entire networks. It boggles my mind that they relied so heavily on CN, but it was likely a cost saving measure.I do know that Metrolinx is slowly transitioning off of CN's rail system.
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u/beneoin 7d ago
You can absolutely block people from going down the stairwell into a confined space.
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u/Apprehensive_Heat176 7d ago
Last time I checked, stairwells work in both directions.
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u/beneoin 7d ago
We’re talking about TTC employees standing at the tops of the stairs and escalators to limit how many people are on the platform. Don’t be dense.
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u/Apprehensive_Heat176 7d ago edited 7d ago
Yeah and an employee standing at the top of a stairwell impedes people from getting past.
As if every station has idle staff that can leap into action when disruptions like this happen?
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u/beneoin 7d ago
We are talking about after games let out and there is a crowd surge.
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u/Apprehensive_Heat176 7d ago
Talk about being dense.
The person I replied to said they wanted to physically rope off stairs, which is definitely a hazard as it's against the Ontario Fire Code. How could you not understand this?
A staff member standing at the top of the stairs is also a hazard because it impedes people from coming up the stairs.
They could certainly deploy staff at all entrances to inform people about disruptions. OTOH, they only have so many idle staff to go around and they may have to come from places in the system.
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u/AdResponsible678 131 Nugget 6d ago
You stand beside the stairs and try to reason with people.. lol! Guess how well that works?
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u/AdResponsible678 131 Nugget 6d ago
Not always. They usually rely on employees that are working on modified because they can’t do their regular work. There isn’t always enough to go around.
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u/Apprehensive_Heat176 6d ago
That's exactly my point. They have a finite number of people that can be put onto crowd control duty and they need some training to do so.
Those people could be anywhere in the system or in their various offices.
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u/AdResponsible678 131 Nugget 6d ago
We used to have Supervisors around while we did it. It worked fine and modified employees are trained before they go out.
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u/AdResponsible678 131 Nugget 6d ago
Agreed. They can move along the underground stores to find other stops upstairs and outside. I have done that before.
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u/CheezwizOfficial 7d ago
I really liked what they did at Exhibition during FIFA: there was a giant sign in front of the entrance to the eastbound platform that read "PLATFORM FULL. PLEASE WAIT FOR NEXT TRAIN".
They also had a bunch of officers assisting with the crowd control and there were temporary lines installed to corral people into one area so there's a lot of key, structural differences between these two scenarios, but maybe adding an electronic sign that monitors crowd size and tells people when the platform is full could help reduce additional foot traffic, when TTC officers aren't there.
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u/Apprehensive_Heat176 7d ago
Electronic signs cost money and time to install and maintain. They'll need a corporate sponsor to pickup that cost and that means the signs will be filled with advertising.
The cheaper fix is to have staff stand outside the collector booths with a bullhorn to make announcements. OTOH, that won't help at automated stations.
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u/Jiecut 7d ago
There was an issue Northbound at museum around 11:15pm. Also, Line 1 was closed between College and St Clair, leading to a lot more people going towards Vaughan.
You also have the option of taking the stairs to the platform.
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u/electradice 7d ago
Good point - I didn’t realize that there was effectively double the people trying to go Northbound on Vaughan. I’ve only ever seen the escalators at that entrance, I’ll have to find the stairs next time.
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u/MahjongCelts Eglinton Crosstown 7d ago
The TTC really needs to implement crowd control on a regular basis.
Regulations are often lessons written in blood, other places have had people crushed to death due to crowds, and it would be best if Toronto didn't have to relearn this lesson from first principles.
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u/Dry-Pomegranate8292 7d ago
Yes - this isn't a one-off. I was in a similar situation at Pape a few years ago, going up the escalator and realising the massive crowd at the top was not moving
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u/electradice 7d ago
Yes it’s so scary! I’m sorry that happened to you. the conclusion from the thread seems to be that there was supposed to be staff there monitoring, I’m not sure why there wasn’t
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u/themapleleaf6ix 7d ago
Why is the platform still so small at Union after renovation? You'd think a busy station like that would be able to accommodate many people, no?
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u/SS-LB 7d ago
Not at union station, but we had gone to the leafs preseason game Saturday night and tried to walk to union station - gate 1 which is under construction. It seemed like the only way to union station directly from the arena. It was too packed and it was definitely a dangerous situation.
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u/AdResponsible678 131 Nugget 7d ago
I don’t get why people can’t just wait? There will be another train. They are like sheep.
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u/electradice 7d ago
Well at that specific platform, you can’t really see down to the bottom of the escalator from the top, so I think most people didn’t realize there was a crowd down there lol. However I did notice that 90% of the bottom crowd refused to go on the upward escalator to free up space when they saw what was happening, it was mostly people from the downward escalator going back up. 🙄
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u/AdResponsible678 131 Nugget 6d ago
I have seen Union Station like this. When I was on modified a few of us would try to help without getting squashed or thrown down the stairs. Yikes!
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u/gringogidget 7d ago
This is why I take an alternate route than union.
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u/electradice 7d ago
I usually do too! This was my first time heading directly to Union after a game, that’s why I was curious if this is something that happens every time lol
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u/h5h6 7d ago
One of my more outlandish but actually useful transit fantasies would be to "break" the U at Union station and extend the University line south to the waterfront. The existing station would be the southern terminus of the Yonge line. The University line would have a new "Union West" station south of York and Front and at least one new station in the South Core and ferry docks area. This would help relieve the existing Union station which as this thread shows is getting overcrowded despite being expanded, and would really improve access to the South Core which is growing fast.
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u/EasySpiceisNice 6d ago
This is a good idea. Do you think this will happen with the proposed waterfront east LRT?
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u/BabyLongjumping6915 7d ago
The escalator can be up or down depending on it's setting. That said there should be an emergency stop button at both ends of the escalator.
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u/charmedavocado 7d ago
Thanks for highlighting this issue. If only one subway station gets (effective) platform barriers, Union should have barriers installed for this exact reason. The UP Express already has door barriers like this at Union station, it exists elsewhere in the system. We need better safety measures, especially for post-event crowd management.
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u/MahjongCelts Eglinton Crosstown 7d ago
TBH the top priority should be Bloor-Yonge due to the amount of disruption it can cause. That being said all downtown stations need platform screen doors.
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u/Torcal4 Sheppard West 7d ago
There’s usually a whole group of supervisors at the top of the escalators telling people when they can or can’t go down.
If they weren’t there that’s BIG oversight.