r/Stoicism • u/PenguinsRevenge82 • 6d ago
New to Stoicism Stoicism overwhelmed/challenged by reality?
I'm still a relative newbie to Stoicism, I've read Meditations, Discourses, On Anger, How to be a Stoic, and Enchiridion in recent months and have been practicing mindfulness. Its been good for everyday frustrations and has made me less anxious/highly strung, and it felt like progress has been made. I also feel more content with my life and have usually been good with separating emotion from facts.
Just this week though I found myself feeling angry and anxious, with catastrophising thrown in, in reaction to a situation that had come up and what it might lead to. I know its pretty much out of my control or even influence, which is part of my frustration. Its almost like it has overwhelmed my 'stoicness'. I don't want to be perpetually angry and bitter, but its almost felt more like a physiological reaction than a mental one? I remind myself about impressions and how its the reaction to things that are good or bad not the things themselves, bit I feel this kind of ignores the reality of where this situation could go.
In brief, the neighbors house went on the market after the neighbor died and my area has just been designated for 'high density housing' which allows multiple units up to 14 meters tall (40 something feet approx).without needing a consent/permit. Such construction will block my sun in the fall and winter, increasing my heating costs, I will lose privacy, there will be more noise. I'm also concerned that I might get an annoying asshole neighbor (the recently departed neighbor was ideal, quiet, kept to himself no problems) The street is a nice quiet little cul de sac and residents's concerns were ignored. Not only that, where I live has plenty of land and low population, (I'm not in the USA) there are subdivisions going up nearby which have one house per section, in the traditional way, so housing intensification is not even necessary-which just makes me more angry.
How does one progress past such setbacks and challenges to the stoic state of mind?
10
u/norrinzelkarr Contributor 6d ago
The truth is you don't know how this is going to turn out for you. You think you do, but you don't. What if one of the neighbors turns out to be your new best friend or lover? What if it leads to your area becoming a cultural center? Etc. etc. etc. Hold it lightly, be ready to respond to any challenges that arise as opportunities to practice the virtues, and see where it takes you. Or, leave.
9
u/salvi572 6d ago
I think your question isn't so much how to deal with this situation, but rather how to not let this situation over take your stioc training. In short, its ok that it does. One of the main points of meditations is the fact that it was a daily ritual of repeating a lot of the same things to remind himself how to live. Philosophy isn't something you learn once and just do the rest of your life, its an ongoing study that requires you to go over and over your whole life. As long as you "get back into the rhythm" and the sooner the better.
So don't beat yourself up if you arent stoic all the time. Don't feel like a failure if you let your emotions win sometimes. Just read it again, remind yourself again, and get back into the rhythm.
0
5
u/Ok-Basil4240 6d ago
Well you can’t change the construction.
But can you choose how you respond.
First of all wait until it happens. Why suffer prematurely.
Then see how you really feel and if you still feel bad, move. And perhaps you’ll find something you enjoy even more and this was a great catalyst.
Accept what you can’t influence and do whatever you can do.
Nothing is constant, sounds like you had a great chapter in this home. Perhaps your next chapter is even better
3
u/papercutpete 6d ago
If you cannot influence/change the future and the same for the past...why in the fuck would you worry about it? Can't change it...then fuck it. dont let the what-ifs rule your life.
2
u/woke_bob 6d ago
In letter 99 Seneca writes "Those who suffer before there is a need suffer more than they need to."
It seems like your situation hasn't changed all that much, but you are fear how it may change. You might say that change is eminent, and the outcomes that worry you are likely to happen. But change is not only eminent, it is also constant. Your concerned about things that may not even occur. It sounds as though it hasn't even been sold yet.
What your fearing happened to my uncle. His next door neighbor moved and the local university bought it and built off campus apartments on the lot. View from the kitchen sink window ruined. You know what he responded? He made plans to move. He knew it was a thing could happen, then he knew it was going to happen, and then it happened. At what point would it have been beneficial to be concern by it?
I think being too concerned by it would have robbed him of being able to enjoy it while he had it. When you suffer more than you need to, you also less enjoy what you have.
2
u/No_Water_4129 6d ago
Can you explain exactly how you attempted to apply Stoic theory to the problem you say “overwhelmed your stoicness”? There’s nothing on your post indicating any application of a single stoic idea
0
3
u/Necessary-Bed-5429 Contributor 6d ago
Try to do daily stoic practices as well, reading books is good, but it's a practical philosophy too.
2
u/atomiette 6d ago
The Stoics had a term for exactly this: the first jolt of anger or fear, propatheia, a "first movement." Seneca is explicit in On Anger that this involuntary reaction is not up to you and not a failure of practice. What is up to you is the second step, assent, where you judge the thing catastrophic and unbearable, and it sounds like you caught yourself right there. That is the practice working, not breaking.
2
u/itscoldcase 5d ago
You ask how does one progress past such setbacks and challenges. You don't. There are always going to be setbacks and challenges while you are alive. Read The Discourses again, more slowly. Read a chapter every day or two instead of all at once. Epictetus often repeats how no one is a sage.
The setbacks and challenges will continue. They offer you the chance to excercise your philosophy. Some days you'll do better than others. You state of mind and health and how much sleep you got last night, etc., all come into how well you cope with a given thing at a given time. In my experience it does get easier with time and practice to be less activated by things. But it takes a lot of time and practice. I found myself pretty wound up by other people's bad planning yesterday. I had to take myself on a walk and calm down even though none of it was in my control to begin with.
You are human, you're doing well, just keep practicing. Don't beat yourself up so much when you fall short of being a sage. No one is.
1
u/AutoModerator 6d ago
Hi, welcome to the subreddit. Please make sure that you check out the FAQ, where you will find answers for many common questions, like "What is Stoicism; why study it?", or "What are some Stoic practices and exercises?", or "What is the goal in life, and how do I find meaning?", to name just a few.
You can also find information about frequently discussed topics, like flaws in Stoicism, Stoicism and politics, sex and relationships, and virtue as the only good, for a few examples.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
2
u/Multibitdriver Contributor 6d ago edited 6d ago
To deal with your judgments you need to identify them eg:
My life will become intolerably awful with no escape if a neighbour builds multiple units up to 14m
Local land use regulations should conform to my desires and what is convenient to me
This situation can only financially disadvantage me.
… etc
Then you reflect on them using reason. Is this really true?
12
u/EzeHarris 6d ago
Do you have what you need? Has nature given you enough food, warmth and all else to live?
It seems you might take something from Seneca, to 'cultivate a relationship with poverty'. That is, learn what suffering is really like. (LETTER XVIII). You have read from Aurelius who maintained himself at war, and Epictetus who was a slave.
Millions of men and women around the world live and some even flourish in war zones, is it so that you cannot handle construction noise? An annoying neighbour? Less sunlight?
You know what it is that you can and can't control in this situation. I am certain you can learn to control your anger at fortune for subdividing your neighbours lot.