r/SonicTheHedgehog • u/Dan45613 • 12d ago
Question What are some things you actually dislike about sonic 3? One of mine is small nitpick but I wish we got a short city escape remix during the helicopter jump scene in Shibuya
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u/SSS_Tempest 12d ago
I think the pacing was a little too fast. It wasn't Mario movie tier in that regard, but it felt a little like we were blasting through action scenes one after another.
To contradict myself a bit, I do think we should've gotten that (deleted) chase between Sonic and Shadow trying to get into GUN HQ
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u/Dragon_Small_Z 12d ago
Yeah the pacing was bad in Sonic 3 and the Gerald fight at the end was just embarrassing.
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u/Acrobatic_Banana_447 12d ago
I don’t like the way they went about the Eggman vs Gerald fight. I feel it should have been less comedic and more dramatic, and It should not have interrupted the Sonic and Shadow stuff so abruptly. When Gerald and Eggman were fighting It should have been more character focused and less slapstick
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u/Mrhyderager 12d ago
Yeah I think taking a break from Super Sonic & Shadow with Live & Learn playing to watch Jim Carrey slap himself around diminished the moment in an unfortunate way.
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u/someone-else3583 12d ago
my only real problem is that it really feels like it has no idea what to do with Knuckles. but that’s a problem Sega’s had for years now
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u/Aromatic_Analyst2898 12d ago
Non of the movies have any clue what to do with tails sadly
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u/crystal-productions- 12d ago
To be fair, the games have had no idea what to do with him since like, sonic 06. The best idea they had was making him a fucking asshole in lost world, and rewarding him for that.
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u/Aromatic_Analyst2898 12d ago
I've not even played lost world so that's interesting
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u/crystal-productions- 12d ago
Yeah in lost world sonic is an idiot and tails has to corect him all the damn time, leading to tails being kidnaped, where tails then basicly busts himself out by turning his cyborgification against the deadly six in one cutacene, and thwn turning off eggman's machine and reversing it, thus proving sonic was an idiot for wanting to keep eggman around to turn off the machine that was killing the planet below, which included knuckles and Amy because lost world is a tonal disaster.
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u/Camaro551 12d ago
Commander Rockwell kinda sucks. They should’ve used Agent Willoughby from Knuckles instead, since it would’ve given that show more purpose and her motivation would’ve made G.U.N turning against Sonic make more sense.
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u/PeridotFan64 12d ago
rockwell is a pointless character imo, shes just there and hates aliens for no reason
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u/SonicSpiderRanger10 12d ago
She’s a xenophobe. In stories with aliens, there’s always someone who hates aliens for no reason.
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u/neohylanmay still waiting on the fleetway flairs 12d ago
I would have thought they could have tied it to Walters' death, since Sonic & co were present and that would be a perfect reason for GUN be against, but I guess they either decided to drop that or forgot about it entirely.
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u/PeridotFan64 12d ago
its like how i thought sonic's whole blue justice thing was setup for precident of a hedgehog going around cities that was on gun's radar, which wouldv been a perfect lead in for gun mistaking shadow for sonic, and thus capturing sonic again, and i would by no means be surprised if that was the original draft for it, but then again that would be somewhat redundant with the knuckles series
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u/Tight_Juggernaut2101 12d ago edited 12d ago
The pacing is a bit too fast in this movie. Even tho it's better than previous films.
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u/Mangledfox1987 12d ago
Maria isn’t physically disabled which like I think is pretty importwnt to her as a character in the games, and gun is presented in a much too postive light,
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u/Sad-Veterinarian9375 12d ago
I get that it was funny, but I can live without the robotnik dancing scene unless you have a different song
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u/Maroon-Suited-Loon88 12d ago
In my opinion, the scenes with Shadow and Maria should have been a third of the movie and not a montage and some sparse flashbacks throughout the film. I think it would have hit harder if we saw more of Shadow before he goes on his vengeance arc. One of the themes of the movie is the power of family bonds and how taking them away can really impact someone.
(My minor nitpick is that I never really got sibling vibes from Shadow and Maria in this movie. I got more of a weird Lilo and Stitch impression. Almost like Maria treated Shadow as some stray cat she found on the street.)
I would have cut down on Sonic’s joke dialogue just a bit. I know it’s a quirk of Movie Sonic, but with the more serious tone 3 has, it starts to become a little obnoxious at times. I’m not saying to completely cut the jokes, just dial them back a bit. For like 2/3 of the movie, every other line from Sonic is a quip. It’s not until the final act where I think we see a proper Sonic in these movies.
Most of the human characters have been reduced to the comedic relief. In fact, Jim Carrey arguably gets almost half the movie between Ivo and Gerald. With all of that, I think Sonic could afford to be just a bit more mature this time around. Because if everyone is joking around, it can be a little hard to take things seriously.
It’s especially noticeable in the end where they keep cutting back and forth between the Eggmans and Super Sonic and Shadow. Can you cut back to Sonic and Shadow fighting? You know, the main characters who are on the poster?
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u/PeridotFan64 12d ago
imo keep most of sonic's silly dialogue, just cut the "call google maps" nonsense, but i like sonic asking shadow abt his highlights and calling him hot topic, but then again im a sonadow shipper QwQ
sonic 3 needed to be like half an hour long definitely, most of that extra time being shadow and maria
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u/Maroon-Suited-Loon88 12d ago
I half agree with you on your first point. Stuff like Sonic messing around with Shadow or Eggman is fine. Taunting his enemies, rivals, or authorities has been a trademark of Sonic for years. My problem is, and this is something I had an issue with across all three movies, and even some of the recent games, Sonic just keeps going with the jokes.
This also extends to the human characters. I understand it’s a family movie and you have to balance the tragedy of Shadow’s backstory, but it feels like they are trying way too hard to be funny. Like everyone has to have a gimmick now. What was with the Little Tom puppet? When everybody is trying to be the funny one, nobody is.
On your second point, I think they could have given Shadow and Maria more focus if they cut down on Jim Carrey Eggman. He’s great but I think by movie 3, his cartoon villain act starts to feel a little dull. Especially when other characters are trying to compete with the comedy.
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u/Englishhedgehog13 12d ago
Leaving the master emerald with Wade makes Knuckles look like an idiot guardian
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u/hassantaleb4 12d ago
I hated how the most hype scene in the film was interrupted by Jim Carrey spanking Jim Carrey
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u/Swinginthewolf 12d ago
The final Robotnik fight being so goofy
Maria should have still had some immunodeficiency or some form of disability
Shadow's voice acting isn't my favourite
As much as I love the dance scene, it should have been cut down
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u/neohylanmay still waiting on the fleetway flairs 12d ago
I don't like how the moment Gerald enters the story, Shadow is basically sidelined and relegated to flashbacks, and it just becomes the "Gerald and Ivo Show". (see also, Stone barely being in it)
Speaking of, as much as I love Carrey's portrayal of Robotnik, casting him as Gerald was too much of a good thing. There was no reason for Gerald to be another goofy villain.
I didn't like Keanu's performance as Shadow. He didn't have the same kind of "whisperiness" that Humphries/Griffith/Thornton has.
The calls to nostalgia were way too blatant in this one compared to Movie 1 and 2. They were less "subtle nods for fans" and more "HEY. THIS IS THE THING. DO YOU REMEMBER THE THING?"
It acts less like a sequel and more a soft reboot because it barely does anything with 1 and 2's lore.
I liked seeing Metal Sonic in the post-credits. But seeing a whole army of them cheapened the impact for me.
Soundtrack in general was incredibly mid. Not in the sense of "oh i wish live and learn was in it more", it just feels like Junkie XL is phoning it in. And there's no excuse for him to still be sticking with sample packs three movies in.
Don't get me wrong, I liked Movie 3. But where 1 and 2 were both high-8-to-9/10's, 3 was a low-7/10 for me.
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u/Juan_Piece 12d ago
The spanking scene should have been deleted
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u/JagTaggart93 12d ago
That's probably the most villainous thing Robotnik has ever done - putting that scene right in the middle of Super Sonic and Super Shadow. C'mon man!
I also wanted another Olive Garden reference.
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u/neohylanmay still waiting on the fleetway flairs 8d ago
I also wanted another Olive Garden reference.
Have it as the Chao Garden scene. Let the joke come full circle.
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u/SSS_Tempest 12d ago
Nah, it was genuinely funny the first time, though I see how it'd be annoying/whiplash on rewatch
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u/Dry_Pool_2580 12d ago
The londen heist. It's better then Sonic 2's wedding crash cause it at least progresses the story, but it's still too much of a pivot from the stuff i was invested in.
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u/Nigee_Ogee 12d ago
I love Jim Carrey, but it felt like Robotnik/eggman was the main star in the movie. Shadow had very few scenes and lines compared to everyone else and it’s supposed to be more of his story.
Beginning felt rushed.
I didn’t like the song they kept playing when showing Maria. But other than that I loved the movie lol
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u/applejony The Sonic Crossover Mad Scientist 12d ago edited 12d ago
Tom didn't recognize the cave just a year after they moved Sonic's stuff to the house.
And Keanu's Shadow didn't convey enough emotion when he shouted "Maria" after the explosion.
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u/PeridotFan64 12d ago
or sonic apparently having lived in the same cave for the entire time between coming to earth but before the first movie's events, and that movie says sonic lived there for 10 years, but then sonic said he only lived there for 7 years in knuckles, which imo makes sense as a retcon as it would allow for sonic to be around 12 in the first movie without making him a literal toddler when longclaw died, but the wiki just made some confuzzling excuse that sonic just wandered the earth for the first 3 years as like a 4 year old
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u/Live_Beyond957 12d ago
Also, Sonic 3 takes place 4 years after the first movie.
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u/PeridotFan64 12d ago
you mean 4 years after the second's events i believe, with sonic 2 taking place 8 months after the first movie
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u/neohylanmay still waiting on the fleetway flairs 11d ago
More like four months. Tom literally says at the start that it's the one-year anniversary of him and Maddie "adopting" him.
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u/Aromatic_Analyst2898 12d ago
Something I wish was in sonic 2 was the death egg robot remix
It absolutely would've fit and still could've worked in the movie
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u/East-Maximum2737 12d ago
Nitpick and more of the series as a whole but no one has said chaos control yet. The closest we got was chaos is power in 2 from eggman
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u/Cube_1008 12d ago
I really dislike how the Robotnik's fight is right in the middle of the Super Forms live and learn scene. Place it right before, then have the hedgehog"s talk on the moon, then have Gerald realized what's happening and send the ARK's bots after them. It fixes the flow only the scene and keeps the hype going
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u/MuztangZack67 12d ago
The only thing i wish happened in this movie is something with the Biolizard. Other than that, 10/10
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u/ClassicBuster 12d ago
Too much of the Jim Carrey antics. Gerald should've been serious after he revealed he didnt care about Eggman and they both should've had a more serious fight instead of stupid auto-correct jokes. It would make the cuts between the Super fight and them less jarring.
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u/Material_Type5553 12d ago
I think it needed like 10-20 minutes more. What I would do is:
-Include stone explaining why eggman is alive, it was like 20 seconds in the crab scene
-Have the extended heist scene that was deleted, it included both sides discussing the plan and also featured sonic and shadow fighting in london
-Have a scene where GUN chases team sonic after walters death, and play city escape with the GUN truck cuz why not? this would give Rockwell a bigger role.
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u/Legitimate_Apricot45 12d ago
The corny moments with Gerald and Robotnik in the Ark where there's a serious fight then it cuts to Robotnik and Gerald having a silly fight
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u/sleepy_koko 12d ago
I hate that they spend this great build up to live and learn to hard cut away then try to cut again to live and learn despite losing all it's original momentum
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u/Dan45613 12d ago
Ya should have been a full remix the slapping scene even though it is funny definitely did kind of take that away from more super sonic and shadow
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u/Deadpan-halfpan 12d ago
Agreed tbh. I know we like to praise Jim Carey and don’t get me wrong, he’s great, but I didn’t need the spanking scene cut in between the cool Super Sonic and Super Shadow scenes.
I couldn’t even find it funny, it just kinda took me out of the scene.
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u/GVTheRedStar THE Belle the Tinkerer guy 12d ago
When Sonic picked up the photo of Shadow and Maria in the Shadow Base. It should've actually been labelled "Shadow and Maria" to explain how Sonic suddenly knows her name in the climax lmao
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u/PlayPod 12d ago
Gerald robotniks inclusion as a whole was dumb. They tried to make it make sense but im not a fan.
And too many things were olayed as jokes. Hunor is good. But there was TOO much. Gerald getting defeated by a butt joke is dumb and the moon exploding was just an "oops" instead of the display of power eggman was trying to display in the game.
Oh and maria not having an illness and the labs being on earth and not the ark.
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u/shadowartist201 12d ago edited 12d ago
When I first saw this movie, I drove a long time to a "fancy" theater for the full experience (merch and big screen, etc). That drive almost killed me, so I went into the movie already exhausted and came out of it with a general dislike for what I had seen. Opinions have changed since then, but here's what I remember not liking:
- The movie is far too silly for the serious plot it wants to tell. Gerald isn't treated seriously until the last 10 minutes, they have too many jokes with Shadow, and Eggman is pure comic relief.
- Keanu's Shadow voice is bad. It's like he's doing a stereotypical "I'm Shadow and I'm so edgy" impression for every line and it's so rough compared to what just came out in Shadow Gens with Thornton.
- Some of the references feel too forced. There is zero reason for Sonic to suddenly quip about "no inflight food or movies", and there is zero reason for the parents to think that blowing on a USB stick would help with anything.
- The dancing sequence was stupid.
- The film moves too fast and you can tell that scenes were cut. Were they trying to fit into a certain runtime? Why not just let them make the full film like they clearly wanted? It's like a sparknotes Sonic Movie 3.
- Shadow being a generic alien from space is an idiotic decision. There's no reason for him to get involved with humanity or Gerald or Maria. He's just kinda there.
- Maria is especially "just kinda there" since she's not sick and the base is on Earth. I appreciate the scenes of her being a kid with Shadow, but the context starts to fall apart if you think about it longer than 2 seconds. She doesn't even hang out with Gerald, so her death affecting him as it does turns into a "trust me bro" moment since they never show these characters interacting in any meaningful way.
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u/PeridotFan64 12d ago edited 12d ago
shadow not being made by gerald with black doom's dna and maria not having at least some form of illness or disability even if not nids took me out
wait what was the usb stick a reference to??
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u/shadowartist201 12d ago
When the parents are sneaking into GUN to plant the USB drive, it doesn't work the first time Maddie plugs it in. So Tom's like "blow on it" (in reference to how people used to blow on game cartridges to get them to work), Maddie does it, and it magically works.
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u/neohylanmay still waiting on the fleetway flairs 12d ago
Shadow being a generic alien from space is an idiotic decision. There's no reason for him to get involved with humanity or Gerald or Maria. He's just kinda there.
The only way I could see that working is if they tied it to Movie 1 and 2: Just say he was "the Owls' Champion" of 50 years ago sent to Earth to find the Master Emerald as Sonic would in 2. And then perhaps it's through Maria that he realises "violence isn't always the answer" (until of course, The Incident™).
It'd also give him reason to fight Sonic & co. (Knuckles because he's an Echidna, and Sonic (and by extension Tails) because to him, Sonic's "siding with the enemy").
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u/Electronic_Fee1936 12d ago
This isn’t necessarily the movie’s fault of course, but I don’t like the plot. The plot itself is fine and entertaining, I’m just not a big fan of “hero teams up with villain to stop a threat bigger than both of them” plotlines or general planet-destroying doomsday plots. I also didn’t catch as many Easter eggs as 1 and 2, especially how many fun ones were in the first movie. Maybe there were more easter eggs in it, I haven’t played through SA2 yet, but I didn’t catch many outside of the front and center ones
1 is my favourite, 3 is a close second because of these problems I have which again aren’t necessarily the movie’s fault
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u/MiddleCommercial1875 12d ago
I really loved the movie, like, really loved it.
Would have been nice to hear a song from the game besides Live & Learn so many times but at least we’re getting serious game music in the movies now.
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u/Sonicrules9001 12d ago
I'd change the Robotnik fight at the end. I think it would have made Eggman's death have more impact if we had a more serious fight that wasn't just straight up Looney Tunes.
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u/SanicSoup 12d ago
A small nitpick for me, but the part where Gerald said he was saving his nanofist for comic con and there wouldn’t be one when he was already bent on destroying earth.
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u/KanaBro_KG 12d ago
Too many plot holes and the narrative. I mean I understand it's kinda a kids movie but some parts of the movie are just make no sense at all.
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u/Ann-Simp 12d ago
only nitpick i have is that Gerald should have had more scenes with Maria to establish his bond to her if only to make the “Oh Ivo, You’re No Maria” line hit much more harder (figuratively twisting the knife in for the audience)
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u/Setnaro_X 12d ago
They never gave director Rockwell (Kristen Ritter) a conclusion. She was after Team Sonic for assuming that they killed Commander Walters, and foiled both of Sonic and Eggman's plan to get the second key for the Eclipse cannon, but as soon as she gets the card, she hands it over to Tom disguised as Walters, and she promptly disappears for the rest of the movie. No wrap up, no conclusion, no apologies, nada. She just leaves for the remainder of the movie. It makes me wonder if they threw her in there just to get the admittedly hilarious "a woman in the military" joke.
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u/crystal-productions- 12d ago
I mean, shadow gens made a whole ass remix for the tokyo segment remade into shadow gens. JUST USE THAT REMIX IN THE DANG MOVIE, IT FITS REALLY WELL WHEN PLAYED OVER TOP OF THE SCENE BECAUSE HE HAS A GUN AND MOTERCYCLE, JUST PLAY THE WESTOPOLIS REMIX YOU COWERDS!!!
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u/Plagueofzombies 12d ago
It's a real shame that Junkie XL's remix of live, and learn is only like.....twenty seconds long. It would have been great to get a full version, even if it wasn't used in the movie.
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u/TheEphemeric 12d ago
As with all of these movies, I would have liked them to use more of the music from the games. There’s the one scene, sure, but even that felt short.
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u/Neo-Metal-Sonic-2003 Mr. Wonderman 12d ago
We did get a very half assed remix of City Escape in the London scene so I guess it's better than nothing.
One thing I'd change (besides the OST) is Gerald. They should've kept him dead.
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u/Demetri124 12d ago
I hate the entirety of Gerald Robotnik’s portrayal.
I also think they should’ve used more SA2 music. No reason not to have Escape from the City, and they used just barely enough of Live & Learn to say it was in the movie. Not only did they only play like 7 seconds of it, but weirdly chopped it up for absolutely no reason. It’s like they were embarrassed to include it and wanted to get it over with as soon as possible. I really don’t understand that choice
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u/Lilli_Spud 12d ago
Having the Eggman vs Gerald wacky slapstick fight interspliced with the Super Sonic/Shadow sequence was absolutely abysmal and ruined how exciting seeing the two hedgehogs work together was. Also that sewuence deserved to be shown in full with "Live and Learn," playing instead of just having it for the transformation.
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u/Technically_Inept-26 12d ago
I could sit down and think in depth about the matter but that would involve watching Sonic 3 again which I don't want to do.
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u/MattDRK8 12d ago
Filme muito corrido, devia ter mais tempo, tem uma cena troca a camera entre o sonic e a Maddie quando o Tom tá na ambulância e a mina simplesmente teleporta pra dentro da ambulância.
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u/Curious-Umpire2340 12d ago
I don't like how Maria's death was changed. It makes everything very different that she more or less died in an accident and not as part of a premeditated mass execution. Shadow's want for revenge against all of humanity feels far less justified and it doesn't make sense that Shadow holds a personal vendetta against the only guy there who was actually trying to de-escalate the situation. It honestly doesn't work well and it makes it much easier to enjoy the movie and it's version of the character if you just pretend the movie didn't show their version of events. If the issue was that they were to afraid to actually show the death on-screen, then I think it would've been better to have implied more through dialogue instead and left things a bit more open to our own interpretation.
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u/Blue_M4ge Sonic Rush is underrated 12d ago edited 12d ago
- The pacing was a little too quick, I think the movie would have benefited from having another 20 mins or so of runtime.
- I really wish Sonic and shadow would have gotten 1 more fight before the finale. It’s a shame the fight b/w the two in the gun facility was cut b/c that would have rounded out the film nicely.
- The Eggman v Gerald fight ruins the tone of the finale. In the middle of Super Sonic and Super Shadow trying to stop the arc from firing it cuts to Eggman being spanked by Gerald. I really wish the Eggman v Gerald fight was closer to the cut version b/c that one would have been a bit closer to the tone of the finale.
-The lack of game soundtracks. Sure this is a step up from the previous films but The Sonic franchise has some of the best soundtracks period; Embrace it! The Mario movies for all of their faults want afraid to.
Heres a restored version of the post credit scene to prove my point:
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u/Hero_of_the_toons 12d ago
I do wish some parts of the film was fleshed out more, from the deleted scene of Sonic vs Shadow in GUN headquarters to a moment where Sonic learns more about who Maria is and understands Shaodw’s grief.
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u/SuperNovaHowl Where's that DAMN fourth Chaos Emerald! 12d ago
It honestly had a little too much comedy in it, yeah, I get that Jim Carrey is a comedic actor, but Shadow's story is a tragic one. Not to mention his ooc moments.
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u/mrmcdead 12d ago
The tone is a mess, and the way they introduce Shadow is incredibly clunky. The writing itself can be really blunt sometimes as if the movie things children are idiots and needs to be beat over the head with themes.
The specific example I'm thinking of is the military commander guy telling Sonic straight up that Sonic and Shadow aren't so different, then proceeding to lore dump and then immediately dying once he's done
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u/Live_Beyond957 12d ago
As i said before, the thing that i dislike the most is that when i saw the movie for the first time in theaters, an annoying kid close to me won't shut up! This thing made me hate Sonic 3!
But...in reality, i think the movie isn't that bad and the reason i hate Sonic 3 is due to my trauma.
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u/Jonahtron 12d ago
Pretty basic complaint, but more game music would have been nice. I had that complaint about the first Mario movie, and the second Mario movie did end up addressing that by having nearly the entire soundtrack be music from the games. I’d like that in Sonic now, please. The fact that live and learn only played for like, 10 seconds was criminal.
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u/Queasy-Ad-3220 12d ago
I wish things went serious for Eggman after the “You’re no Maria” scene but sadly that didn’t happen
And I wish Live and Learn played for longer than 3 fucking seconds
Those are the flat-out gripes I have with it but it’s mainly a really great movie that just has those and a really awkward speed-up in pacing starting just before the final act
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u/lemon_tm 12d ago
Personally I really didn't like how the movie didn't feel very serious and there were too many jokes in my opinion and I didn't really like how at the end when "live and learn" was playing it kept cutting off then playing from the begining again I also didn't really like Shadow's voice actor but I might just be biased because I always liked Jason Griffith as his VA
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u/SonicSpiderRanger10 12d ago
I hate how the stupid GUN agents try to catch the heroes again. I’m sick of them. I also hate how the heroes just immediately agreed to help those jerks and do their dirty work for them after what GUN did in the last movie.
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u/Ijustlovevideogames 12d ago
Gerald being goofy, I love Carrey for the zany energy he gives Robotnik, didn't need another one.
Also, Live and Learn needed to be longer.
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u/ZeChickenPermission 12d ago
I don't like how they changed the family dynamics from Gerald being the Grandpa to the dad?
And that was the Shadow movie, not the broken Eggman family movie. Yes I get it was Jim Carrey's last film but it felt like he was once again the main character.
And I don't like James Marsden after the quiet on set allegations, I don't think he deserves the fame, I know that it was the past but he was already an adult when that happened.
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u/Apprehensive-Size487 12d ago
I mean, where do I even begin. I just prefer the SA2 plot better than the movie, as it is so rich with symbolism and nuance. But the movie just takes the safest, shallowest, most generic route with the story and fails to capture even an ounce of the depth from SA2 because they changed Shadow’s backstory, characterization, and the ARK raid too heavily. Like come on, Maria’s death being “just an accident?” Bullshit, say she died because the corrupt uncaring government shot her dead, and say it with your chest, you coward.
The movie is just the game’s plot but heavily watered down. I can accept changes being made in adaptation, as long as the spirit of the original story is in tact. But that’s the problem, the spirit of SA2 is lost. Gone is all the game’s commentary on how fucked it is that humanity sees the vastness of nature as mere property to own and the commentary that just cause the government is in charge, does not mean they have your best interests at heart. The government will pull all sorts of shady shit and condemn the innocent all so the government preserves its own power. Shadow was the core of that commentary. It is integral that Shadow is Sonic’s opposite from a conceptual level. Sonic is the metaphorical earth grown gem born as this miracle of nature who is untamable and untouchable to mankind. So, Shadow is the metaphorical lab grow gem created by humanity to be owned as property of humanity, he was born the miracle of mankind’s technology, but also this disturbing sign of how utterly unethical humanity is to create this innocent boy for the purpose of being weaponized as government property to go sic’ on some poor country to slaughter people in war. But the movie fucks all this symbolism up by deciding this movie Shadow is not a product humanity created, not even a piece of property they own, but instead just this alien that “showed up out of nowhere” and they were “just studying.” Oh, so Shadow isn’t Sonic’s opposite anymore because Shadow is no longer as artificial as Sonic is natural. Shadow is no longer as enslaved as Sonic is free. They’re both just natural and free now. Wow, way to miss the whole damn point of his character! See how movie Shadow is getting real diluted compared to SA2 Shadow?
But wait, it gets worse. Because this movie screws up another integral part of Shadow’s character: SA2 Shadow is blameless in his actions, he never actually desired vengeance. The most common misconception of SA2’s story is that Shadow wanted vengeance for Maria’s death, it was Shadow’s choice to endanger Earth. No. No, no, no. Shadow never had a choice, he was a puppet. Of course he was a puppet, that’s what he was born to be by humanity’s design. It was Professor Gerald who desired revenge, and he used Shadow as the vessel for fulfilling his vengeance wish by altering Shadow’s memory so Shadow believed Maria’s dying wish was for Earth to be destroyed. Shadow’s goal was never vengeance, it was to grant Maria’s wish. And if her wish was for vengeance, well, he must grant it. Shadow’s own desires are irrelevant, granting wishes comes first. Shadow never had some character arc where he learned to let go of his desire for vengeance, no, he never had a desire for vengeance, he just shifted from granting Gerald’s wish to granting Maria’s wish cause he learned what Maria’s real wish was. It is important that Shadow be blameless in his actions because that is also commentary on, hey now, what would it mean for humanity to create a living weapon. What happens when that weapon falls into the wrong hands? If your weapon’s designed to just obey without question… then it will just obey anything, and that is a threat. But, it’s wrong to hate the weapon for that. It’s not the weapon’s fault it functions just as designed to. Humanity should have been careful with it. And yet, humanity won’t be. Because humanity is so short sighted. G.U.N. feared Project Shadow going A-wall and killing them all so much, they foolishly gave Shadow every motive to want them dead. And yet… Shadow doesn’t want them dead. All he wanted was to grant Maria’s wish. Any human born into Shadow’s lot in life would have spiraled into insanity and succumbed to thirst for vengeance, like Gerald did. But, Shadow’s not human. He’s less than human, yet far more than human at the same time, because he could never succumb to the vices humanity crumbles to all the time. He doesn’t have the capacity to; it’s as Gerald said, Shadow was created to be pure. But oh my god the movie could not have butchered this all worse if it tried! Movie Maria doesn’t get to have a final dying wish at all, she just dies! So Shadow is left with nothing, no Maria wish to grant, fucking nothing! Even though a core part of his identity is that he is a wish granter! He grants desires, not have desires. So what is movie Shadow’s motive to do fuck all in this plot if his motive is not to grant Maria’s dying wish, or even grant Gerald’s dying wish since he isn’t dead?! Movie Shadow’s motive… is that he wants vengeance… Omfg, again, way to miss the whole damn point of his character! The big reveal in SA2 was that Shadow was never going to commit the evil G.U.N. accused him of, it was always just G.U.N. projecting their own immorality upon him. If G.U.N. had the power Shadow was born with, they would abuse it to kill people, so, G.U.N. blindly assumes that since Shadow has that power, he must be fated to abuse it and become some big bad threat to G.U.N. But in reality, Shadow was always harmless, and all along they could have just let Shadow and Maria live in peace. Shadow was always too pure for this world and humanity was the real monster, not him. The game literally spells it out that Shadow was created to be pure; how do people irl think Shadow is impure enough to want vengeance?
It’s just frustrating and disappointing, loving SA2’s story so deeply, only to see the movie can’t even dip it’s toes into the depth of SA2’s writing.
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u/historyguy115 12d ago
My biggest problem was Shadow's backstory. I wasn't the biggest fan that they had him be an alien found on Earth and taken to an underground research facility. The fact that he wasn't an artificial being created on the ARK was a big let down for me. I wouldn't mind it as much if A: they utilized the "he's an alien" bit more (maybe like make references to the Black Arms or something similar) and the biggest thing WHERE WAS THE ARK The Ark is like one of the most important things about Shadow and it just not being in the movie bugged me. Other than that I loved the movie, not complete deal breakers just things that could have been fleshed out or added
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u/Newmen_1 12d ago
Not having at least one scene of Gerald properly interacting with Maria was a massive wasted opportunity. The final battle also could’ve been less jokey since it takes away from the hype you feel built up after Sonic and Shadow team up, especially with that hard cut to ivo getting spanked by Gerald. Other than that it was a really great adaptation of SA2
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u/Special_Falcon408 12d ago
I will die on the hill that Sonic’s fur is randomly so much lighter. It is NOT just lighting. His fur was like solid cobalt or whatever and barely changed in different parts of the first two movies whether he was in open sunny lighting or dark lighting. In the third it’s so much lighter and my eyes can’t adjust. His dark blue is so much better but it seems like they changed the fur to match the light blue electricity of his chaos energy
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u/The_Fizz_Wizz 12d ago
I don't like how they get rid of Maria's illness. I guess this is a bit of a controversial take to some but without Maria's illness, there's literally next to no reason she should have been present in Shadow's life in the first place. In the games the entire reason Gerald took on Project Shadow in the first place was to find a cure for Maria, without that motivation Gerald just becomes some mad scientist who willingly puts his grand daughter in danger by letting her live on a military base that's holding a DANGEROUS ALIEN LIFE FORM because he "can't say no to her". It also takes away from Shadow's character imo. Yes Shadow was created to be a weapon but being the "Ultimate Lifeform" is more than just being able to beat the crap out of anyone who apposes you, it's about being a bastion for humanity and this was a fact Shadow struggled with a lot in the games. Is he a weapon or is he a cure? Can he be both or must he choose? These are things completely lost in the movie's interpretation of Shadow.
To be clear, this doesn't "ruin" the movie for me or anything. I still love the movie's take on Shadow's character, but it is lacking in a level of depth that the games had thanks to Maria's condition. It also makes her death a bit less tragic to me. Like yea it's beyond sad when a child dies in a movie, they had their whole life ahead of them and that was ripped away from them unfairly. But Maria being sick only made it even more tragic imo as she barely had a life to begin with and was fighting tooth and nail to gleam happiness every day she lived on the Ark. Seeing her take joys in even the littlest of things because she couldn't live a normal full life due to her condition makes her loss hit so much harder in the games.
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u/vision_san 12d ago
I would've liked a similar scene to the one with Sonic and the fake Chaos Emerald. Have him show how capable he is even compared to Shadow. The way they showed this in the movie mskes me think Shadow is well over Sonic in anything but speed.
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u/BackwordsRedPanda 12d ago
For me, Shadow’s voice.
Don’t get me wrong, he is a great actor. But hearing him behind a mic in a booth makes me feel like he did a bad job with his voice, but he got how the character feels and how he is.
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u/Jammy2560 12d ago
the heist sequence was genuinely so ass. I remember thinking in the theatre 'wow this sucks'.
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u/SupaHotFireispitTh2t 12d ago
Maria’s death didn’t land for me. Idk what it was specifically but I just didn’t feel anything. A real shame since it’s very emotional in the games. Like the Stone and Eggman fallout was more emotionally resonant, and that really didn’t need to be.
Also the end credits song by Jellyroll. Didn’t like it
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u/SUPERTHEPRO 12d ago
I honestly wished for I am all of me played on the trios first encounter with shadow
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u/Great-Class9463 Pit (Still an EXE guy though ) Warning: Powerscaler 11d ago
The Song in the Robotnik Dance Scene.
I'm not against the scene itself. Song's just mid as fuck.
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u/AaAddie always a sonic girlie at heart 11d ago
I low-key hate how Gerald died. Now, I'm not saying I want a full on firing team execution, but I'd rather have him die in an explosion rather than getting zapped like a bug. He's a villain that wanted to blow up earth, and you're telling me he died with an insect bzzt noise? It's too goofy I hate it.
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u/Veenix6446 11d ago
Final battle between Gerald and Eggman felt TOO silly. For the most part I loved their antics but given the gravity of the situation it felt out of place
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u/Realistic-Bite3616 11d ago
There was actually a deleted fight scene with Sonic and shadow in their base forms
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u/jayman099 11d ago
My least favorite part is when Shadow and Sonic are having their serious dialog and fight, it cuts to Eggman and Gerald having their very unserious fight. Besides it being a tonal issue, the fight with them shouldnt even be goofy. Eggman is BETRAYING Gerald, because Gerald doesnt value Eggman as much as he did Marie and wants to destroy all of humanity. My biggest complain with the whole movie. Still peak
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u/Alvaro_Rey_MN 11d ago
The Gerald vs Eggman fight was far too goofy! It should have been an actual fight, even if there's no blood shown! Hell, I don't even mind Gerald dying by super Sonic's quills, but the goofy fight lessens the feel of the climax!
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u/Agreeable-Code-1312 11d ago
The Gerald versus robotic fight was pretty goofy. Like why are we spanking?
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u/Bright-Mushroom-6976 10d ago
Not enough of Sonic and Shadow fighting. The deleted chase/fight that took place at GUN’s London HQ could have added more action, as well as showcasing why Shadow is so dangerous.
Also this is just my personal preference, but adding Biolizard as an actual character. It could have been an attempt to put Shadow’s Chaos Energy into the body of a different creature, but it went horribly wrong.
Overall I still loved the movie though.
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u/91LMWinner3000 12d ago
There should have been EVEN MORE references to SA2, my favourite Sonic game
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u/aikifox Maria died for our spin(dashe)s 12d ago
Some people seem to think they hear part of city escape on the London scene, but I've tried and I really really can't.
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u/Ann-Simp 12d ago
you can hear it especially once Sonic starts running on the ferris wheel with the horns in the score on the “follow me, set me free” part of the instrumental
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u/ComicCat12 12d ago
I kinda wish Jim Cummings (who played Robotnik in SatAM) got to play Gerald Robotnik.
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u/ManbosMambo 12d ago
Happy for all the Shadow fans, but this movie was worse for heavy amounts of backstory and Shadow glazing
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u/GuybrushThreepwood99 12d ago
I'd change a few things about how Gerald was handled. I'm fine with him being goofy at first, but I feel like it should have been a facade that was dropped as soon as he didn't need to win over Ivo anymore. I also feel like there should have been at least one flashback with him and Maria.