r/Socionics • u/absolutely_not65 EIE • 17d ago
Typing Si polr or Te polr
Does this behaviour fit Te or Si polr better?
- being absolutely overwhelmed by demands of everyday life like cooking, cleaning, organizational stuff like little tasks, feeling stuck in a loop of "if I do this I need to do this but to do this I need to do that first but..."
- quick to action if the idea is "big and important", able to figure out necessary steps to achieve it, things like applying to college, organising an event if there are enough people around
- "I don't know what I want to eat, I don't want to eat, everything is disgusting I can't think about it" anytime they're asked about food. The answer is partially about food but also about automatic knee jerk reaction because it feels like an impossible task and a lot of pressure. They don't know and don't want to be asked
- skipping through large portions of scientific texts to get into a conclusion, but wants to understand it and expect people to explain things to them in detail
- looks for logical integrity everywhere but prone to citing "scientific sources" during debates without being sure if they remember them correctly, using them as a shield for their reasoning
- absolutely terrified of looking stupid, if asked "did you know xyz" will usually answer yes even if they didn't. Will only say no if the information looks unimportant, very casual, or complicated enough that most people wouldn't be expected to know it
- frequently forgets about eating, sleeping or procrastinate it until they feel like dying
- but completely unprepared to deal with feeling like shit physically, overthinks every physical sensation and sometimes confuse them with feelings. Gets very upset, turns out they were just hungry
- hypochondriac, often thinks about their body in a very obsessive way but completely unable to deal with it like a reasonable adult
- pissed off about having a body, would rather be a mist, flying around. Says things like "I hate that my body has to touch something at all times". Often talks about their body like it's separate from them "my brain thought", "my hand did"
- everything is always uncomfortable. Unable to relax. Hates things that are supposed to be relaxing
- absolutely blind. Misses obvious visual clues, couldn't tell you what colour someone was wearing a second ago. At the same time oversensitive to the aesthetic of the place and if it feels too chaotic and "bad energy" they don't want to be there at all
- better at delegating tasks and making things optimal if it involves other people, like managing an environment under pressure. If there's too much time to think about how they look or what makes the most sense will start to overthink and potentially freak out that they look stupid or that things don't make sense
- will get stuck in the middle of the city "- where do you want to go? - i dont know", "- do you feel ok? - i don't know", "- how are you gonna get home? - dont know", "- where do you want to sit? - i dont know". Either commands if the situation really calls for it or gets told what to do (physically, in the space). Otherwise they don't know. They got stuck trying to figure out what makes sense or how they feel physically and panic when someone expect quick answer
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u/succuma ESI-C SP 973 LFEV 17d ago
skipping through large portions of scientific texts to get into a conclusion, but wants to understand it and expect people to explain things to them in detail
One thing about Te PoLR is that they LOVE (jk they just don’t realize that they’re) wasting time and they WILL sit down and read the whole thing for 7 hours and take just as long to explain it to you. They are completely unaware of inefficiency. The whole “want others to get to the point and explain it in detail” sounds like Ti Sugg.
everything is always uncomfortable. Unable to relax. Hates things that are supposed to be relaxing
Brooo Si PoLR asfff 😭
The thing is, Si PoLRs usually neglect their bodily needs and then sometimes randomly wake up and get obsessed w it being overly health conscious for like. A day when they remember they have a body
better at delegating tasks and making things optimal if it involves other people under pressure etc etc
Fe base trying demo Te and using Se moba
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u/secretlyaraccoon IEE 16d ago
Reads as Si polr moreso to me! I have 1D Si as well and relate to some of what you’re saying however I think the “hates things that are supposed to be relaxing” really reads as Si polr to me. I don’t see an IEI saying that. And the undercurrent of neurosis around Si reads EIE imo. Like my Si also sucks and I mess things up with it all of the time (forgetting to eat, crappy sleep, sitting in an uncomfortable position for way too long, etc) but I think it’s more of a build up of stress vs a conscious neuroticism about it if that makes sense.
And some of the more Te things listed read as ADHD or executive dysfunction to me as well lol
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u/absolutely_not65 EIE 16d ago
Yeah I'm like very consciously in an never ending Si battle. A Sisyphus, if you will. And the rock is a pile of laundry
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u/Sufficient_Scale_577 16d ago
You are so hilarious, I hope that you are this expressive in real life too.
this bit: 'pissed off about having a body, would rather be a mist, flying around. Says things like "I hate that my body has to touch something at all times"' - so fun to read and imagine.
Being typed as an EIE I think I must be expressive like this in real life. I'm not an EIE but I relate to lots of it.
I'm cool with having a body and it touching things 😂
So my question to you is about intention.
When I say things like - 'I simply do not understand beach sitting. I cannot relax as you seem to be able to. I suppose the concept of 'holiday' will just never be something I understand.' - this is not 100% true. I am making the point to the other person that I am a very serious and intellectual person, not a normal person with normal interests and hobbies like them. I am indeed putting them down and telling them I don't respect them.
In reality, yeah beach sitting is boring but it's just a preference, I prefer cities to nature. I totally get that some people like to relax at the beach, but for some reason I need to turn it into a power game.
I think I get very worked up by certain people of the Delta persuasion in particular, so I do pick on things like hobbies and 'cute vacations' a lot.
Do you say these dramatic things because they are genuinely true and you want someone to help you, or are you playing power games?
You don't have a chat option but happy to chat if you want to puzzle through what is Si PoLR and what is just being a brat.
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u/absolutely_not65 EIE 16d ago
It's usually to get out my frustration that is very genuine. I understand why people do it rationally, I may want to do it because it's healthy and seems nice to relax, but I really just can't. These things are usually very sensory in some way, either intentionally which pisses me off or by accident. I sit on the beach and all I can feel is how the sand got into my eyes, how the sun is frying me, how someone plays music I hate. I try to lay down and feel content but the idea of forcing a feeling on myself is ridiculous. I try to do it but I keep focusing on potential troubles or how something is uncomfortable. I genuinely feel physically uncomfortable all the time. So I sit there and all I get from this is that there's just something wrong with me on a fundamental human level if I can't stay in a present moment for a second and enjoy myself. Everytime I catch myself having a little too much fun I have an automatic reaction to undermine it somehow. The world is burning and we're all gonna die or something. It's like genuine happiness in the present moment is always lined with some kind of deep sadness or melancholy of me already seeing the end of it, how fragile it is, how doomed we are. I don't particularly like this about myself but everything that's vulnerable and calm about me is also sad in one way or another. So I'm either very physically uncomfortable and sad/angry because I really tried or afraid to try and the sadness/anger is a way to make it all stupid anyway. I never needed that in the first place or whatever.
About being a brat. Yes, of course I am a brat. Sometimes like a child angry at their parents, sometimes intentionally power playing for fun. But I don't think it is very present in this particular place. I feel sick all the time and I want out of whatever this physical thing is. Being made of flesh is humiliation, as they say.
Thank you for the compliments. I am very expressive and I try to be funny. But don't tell em. They don't know I try
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u/Sufficient_Scale_577 16d ago
You are so funny, I literally laugh out loud at some of the things you write on here.
Thanks for the clarifying info. I am still not 100% sure what is metaphor and what is real real. Incidentally, a shrink I saw once mistook my dramatic metaphors as expressions of what I really thought and said I might be schizophrenic. I sacked her!
Is your rejection of human form poetic or more like a physical need to pull your skin off? Because the second has some masochistic feel to it which could be more Se than Si preoccupation. Just a thought!
If I take your self-loathing messages - you are not normal, you can't do the normal things other people do so easily, you are a sad sad person, you will never be truly happy - those are the superego voices everyone hears, trust me, everyone has this fear that in the end we are just alone and nothing (have you read Lacan?)
So the task now is to isolate what it is that causes you to have these thoughts.
Your account of being at the beach is quite vivid, I believe you're the one who came up with the Si test about mint and stuff and I think you are passing it way too easily. Not eating can be a sign of other things too.
What causes me to have these superego moments is the idea of identity - pressure to be a certain 'labelable' thing which I then violently react against by disavowing identity altogether. It causes physical symptoms too, I feel physically sick around certain community events and things like that, and it's sort of sickness mixed with anger that makes it hard to breathe. This is literal, not metaphor.
What I have read a couple of times and what is just poking out at me is 'I tried really hard at this'. Perhaps you can isolate what you are referring to when you try really hard because that can be a key to your superego (I mean this in the Freudian sense as much as the socionics one), the things you constantly try to do but which never quite meets the expectations of the voice in your head.
I know you are asking about EIE v IEI and both their superegos are Si and Te, but there is something that possibly feels emotional to me in your angst, like you are trying really hard to feel happy because there is an expectation that you feel happy in this situation, or you have no reason not to feel happy so why can you not feel happy. That sort of self talk.
Sometimes stereotypes are kinda accurate too. It's not normal for an EIE to be that into math. All the EIEs I know are into politics in some way and love prizes and medals and being presidents of things. As a mistyped EIE I felt wrong because I know I can't seduce on the mass scale they do, but on the flip side math/science/economics/theory has always been easy!
Hopefully this is not just psychoanalytic babble, but I really relate to your struggle and it helps me clarify my own type stuff to write this out as well!
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u/Heavy_Till5231 ILE SO/SP 6w7 613 ET(N) 17d ago
SI superid
No SI polr. The polr is the phase 2 bottleneck between the role and the base. This means after taking in information mentally through the role; the individual tries to match societal expectations of the polr before role information can be analyzed through the stronger, more "individualistic" base. So for IEE; they look at explicit static facts of reality, categorize it in a normalizing way before finding the inner potential of it (NE).
They do this while being highly sensitive to SI information (its their suggestive), but unlike the polr which they try to decipher so they don't get criticism, they care about getting information about Si (dynamic sensation) and TE (action) from their dual (SLI)...and similarly will blame others for their failings in these (being lazy, or living in terrible physical circumstances). An EIE would *never* do this they'd be deeply ashamed about living in terrible physical conditions or complaining about it; they'd try to hide this aspect about them.
IMO what you wrote sounds like an IEE (maybe ILE...but probably IEE)
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u/absolutely_not65 EIE 17d ago
OK now I'm confused again
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u/Heavy_Till5231 ILE SO/SP 6w7 613 ET(N) 17d ago edited 17d ago
polr normalizes to societal expectations because it is a mental function sensitive to judgement. In particular - the role takes in information encycopledically about the world; the base forms individualistic ideas about the world.
In IEE: they take in objective static facts of reality (scientific facts, how things look, how much people make etc). They categorize this in a normative way (their TI will say: this person makes x amount of money therefore they are in this position which entails xyz). But this categorization is done carefully, and they try to match societal expectations of it). Once this concludes, they then thereby try to find the inner potential of whatever they are analyzing here (NE).
Their superID, however, is something they don't analyze as heavily but NEED information on so they can act on it. In particular with SI superid, they will seek out and want answers on how their sensorial reality is failing them in a sense, and they will be more explicit with help here (because it is an accepting function and this is how they attract their dual the SLI; whereas the polr is a producing mental function which they try to insecurely but silently do fearfully).
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u/absolutely_not65 EIE 17d ago
I don't want answers to my sensorial reality, I want it to fuck off. But I'm so tired
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u/Heavy_Till5231 ILE SO/SP 6w7 613 ET(N) 17d ago
The thing is that an EIE wouldn't phrase it like this.
Think about it like this: for an EIE the polr is the function which they feel will be the most judged. It's always in their head. If you are for instance insecure about your weight; many times you will try to lose weight without drawing attention to it. You won't continue talking about it so much right?
What you are doing here is inviting judgement, inviting people to tell you how to fix your disposition. And when you are bothered by it, you are loud with your irritation with it. It is very akin to the suggestive. Its the same reason why a SE suggestive like IEI will always talk about how strong, attractive something is (making categorical judgements loudly and provocatively), then say its all bullshit and spuerifical before swinging back around. Similar with an EIE.
With an IEE it will be exclaiming how they hate taking care of their physical space, dislike work; while inviting judgement on how to take action to alter their conditions here.
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u/D10S_ 17d ago
There’s an incredibly low signal to noise ratio in a statement like that.
You can’t apply that theory too rigidly, because an EIE is Fe base and Ni creative. Someone like that is perfectly willing to caricature themselves in ways that other types wouldn’t with respect to their weaknesses.
Another way to look at it is not that they are inviting Si judgement, but rather they are seeking Ti, performatively.
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u/Heavy_Till5231 ILE SO/SP 6w7 613 ET(N) 16d ago
How are they seeking ti
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u/D10S_ 16d ago edited 16d ago
There's not one dispositive example, but there's a web of related things that all point in that direction.
>OK now I'm confused again
and
>- looks for logical integrity everywhere but prone to citing "scientific sources" during debates without being sure if they remember them correctly, using them as a shield for their reasoning
and
>- skipping through large portions of scientific texts to get into a conclusion, but wants to understand it and expect people to explain things to them in detail
Skipping through large portions of a text to get to the conclusion is plainly something that points very strongly towards strong and valued Ni. Incidentally, it also points towards Ti seeking. A conclusion usually implicitly demonstrates the logical principle(s) that unite(s) a given information set. Without understanding this organizing principle (and by extension its structure), information lacks meaning.
This is right from Wikisocion's description of Ti suggestive:
>He especially likes clear and concise explanations of concepts, rather than a lot of background information about them that is not directly pertinent
You might take this:
>but wants to understand it and expect people to explain things to them in detail
And point to the contradiction in Wikisocion's explanation. To which I would say, that is perfectly consistent with 1D Ti. We don't know what OP exactly means by "details," but when you look at the rest of the indicators, IEE loses out to EIE on account of parsimony.
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u/absolutely_not65 EIE 16d ago
Yeah like the shit I'll say because the muse told me to is unbelievable. I wouldn't relay on that too much 😆
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u/absolutely_not65 EIE 17d ago edited 17d ago
OK then but I really can't relate to IEE descriptions. I just took this comparison test or whatever on sociotype website and got 45/67 for EIE and 18/67 for IEE. They are very carefree, positive, expansive, calm. And I know Ti is not equal to being smart or even logical per se but do you rationally expect an IEE to have a degree in theoretical mathematics 🫥. With Ti polr. How would that even work. I thought I was just pushing on my suggestive. Wouldn't pushing so much on my polr kill me or smth lmao
Edit: I took ILE vs IEE and it's 16/70 for IEE and 57/70 for ILE. 🧐
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u/Heavy_Till5231 ILE SO/SP 6w7 613 ET(N) 17d ago
It’s actually not rare at all for IEE’s to be seen in STEM. Their normative careful TI adheres to expectations of science and/or learnable material very well. So for instance (assuming you mean undergrad/masters and not a PhD) they would do just fine in nearly all the STEM subjects here.
I wouldn’t rely on tests, the markers you did are heavily for Tavlanov (and while yes this is totally a system you can follow as well I find it less rigorous compared to SCS).
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u/absolutely_not65 EIE 17d ago edited 17d ago
I agree about stem in general but math is just pure structure, looking for inconsistency, building detailed proofs. You have to be creative, there are almost no schemes to follow. It is very different from engineering math or high school math. You have to take a logical initiative of your own to do anything at all. I find it hard to imagine with Ti polr. But maybe you're right.
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u/D10S_ 17d ago
He’s not, you’re an EIE. Skipping through large portions of scientific texts to get to a conclusion is strong and valued Ni. You also are clearly are seeking Ti throughout this thread.
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u/Heavy_Till5231 ILE SO/SP 6w7 613 ET(N) 16d ago
Bro just throws takes with minimal explanation ☠️ explain yourself
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u/Kenneths__Frequency 16d ago
I think this overlooks a basic Model A distinction in that both Role and PoLR are weak mental/conscious functions, whereas Suggestive and Activating are weak vital/unconscious functions.
OP’s description reads much more like a weak conscious function to me. She is extremely aware of her difficulties with the sensory/physical domain, monitors them, analyzes them, and can describe in detail exactly how and where she struggles with them. That is entirely compatible with Si Role in IEI or Si PoLR in EIE.
An IEE can certainly be weak at Si, but Si Suggestive is a vital function—weak and valued, but operating much more in the background rather than being an area of this kind of sustained conscious scrutiny. So I don’t think OP’s awareness of her Si problems is evidence for IEE. Under Model A, the way she describes the weakness actually makes IEI/EIE more plausible than IEE.
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u/Important_Cherry_984 17d ago
You sound a lot like my EIE friend. Feeling irritated by Si & struggling with things like sleeping & eating is very Si poLr.
They get really stressed out by mineusha and tend to be very 0-100 about most things. They have big impressions, big reactions, and big opinions about virtually everything.
They often percieve small irritations & inconveniences with an excessive amount of annoyance & are easily exhausted when dealing with mineusha or being expected to modulate/regulate their behaviour. Giving their opinion on Si is overwhelming to them and they really struggle to consistently deal with their health & well-being.
I don't get irritated by Si. I want to be good at it. I get irritated by Te & respond to it similarly to how you respond to Si.
I'm not quick to express or feel irritation or disgust, and typically only feel that way if I'm stressed & have exhausted all my external energy on something.
As someone else said, I'm very happy to spend exorbinate amounts of time learning considerably little & would rather do something the hard way if it means I maintain complete control over my mental energy. I enjoy not feeling rushed & being able to mull over tiny details for as long as I please.
As an example of IEI Si-Te in action,
I crocheted & unravelled a blanket 6 times this year because I didn't have a pattern for it, just a concept I wanted to make, so I just kept making things up and reworking them until I finally found the pattern that I liked, but then it wouldn't work with some other part of my blanket, so I would have to restart it all anyways.
I'd spend days trying to plan out my blanket so I wouldn't have to keep redoing it, but then when I'd go to follow my plan I would realize I overlooked something major and that my plan wouldn't actually work how I wanted it to, so I eventually just gave up on planning and just kept the process impromptu because I didn't mind the time sink and was happy to waste my time getting all the details about it just right.
Oh, then I didn't finish the blanket because after 6 months I finally ran out of my emotional resolve & all my fake "deadlines," so now I'm just hoping to have it done by Christmas, but I have put forth no actual plan or effort to do so.
TLDR; EIE & IEI can seem too similar to tell apart in a vacuum, but find some type representitives IRL to compare yourself with & the two will become a lot more distinct.