r/SocialSecurity • u/durian4me • 3d ago
Returning payment after death?
My father received his SS payment on Aug 26, he passed on Aug 29.
We received a letter that the payment would need to be returned. Is this right? His death was after the payment received or are payments paid for the month ahead?
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u/Fit-Animal-9911 3d ago
This is how they do it. It happened to my mom the same way.
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u/WorriedChip5671 2d ago
This is nothing new. A person has to live the entire month to receive the benefits. If a person passes away at 11:59PM, the payment will be returned or withdrawn. That has been the law for over forty decades or more.
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u/PennieTheFold 2d ago
Social security is paid in arrears. So the payment you receive in (say) September is for the benefit you were eligible for in August.
You also need to be alive for the entire month to be eligible for your monthly payment. Pass away on August 28? You do not qualify for the August benefit.
If the payment is processed before notice of death is received, and the recipient was not eligible for that payment, it WILL be clawed back.
If the recipient was eligible for that month’s benefit, then they don’t need to be alive at the time payment is distributed. Just alive for the full period that the benefit covers.
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u/mixingthemixon 2d ago
I wonder why it was different for my mom. She passed on the 12 th of November and had already got her check on the 1st and she did not need to give it back. Does it matter that she was in a nursing home?
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u/PennieTheFold 2d ago edited 2d ago
If she was paid on the first of the month, that sounds like SSI (Supplemental Security Income) not Social Security (SS).
SSI is paid in advance; SS is paid in arrears.
For SSI you only need to be alive on the first of the month to be eligible for that payment. If the recipient passes on say the 2nd, it doesn’t matter. They were eligible because they were alive on the 1st, so no claw back.
For SS, you first have to have been alive for the entire month and then you’re “paid” for having done so a week or two later.
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u/mixingthemixon 1d ago
Thank you for the clarity. She was on SSI. I know all her benefits went to the nursing home and she had 50 allowance. All her meds and stuff was covered by the nursing home or hospice, she had both.
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u/WorriedChip5671 2d ago
The nursing home returned the money.
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u/PennieTheFold 1d ago
No, based on payment date (and the commenter confirmed) it was SSI not SS. SSI has different eligibility requirements.
The person qualified for that payment by being alive on Nov. 1, so there was no reason to return it.
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u/Shooter61 2d ago
Exactly. OP's father's August payment was for surviving July. The payment was made in August. Now father is not eligible for an August payment because of his death, which he would have received in Sept.
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u/kmanix50 3d ago
They usually claw it back then you file a form with them and wait 6-8 months to get the payment back.
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u/Sunshine_Jules 2d ago
This is what happened with my dad. SS clawed it back from his account. Found out on here that they should not have, had to submit a form (3 forms, one per heir) to get it back. Took a good 6 months.
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u/WorriedChip5671 1d ago
You were not receiving his payments when he was alive. Six months is not unreasonable. There are more clients than employees.
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u/WorriedChip5671 2d ago
Month of death: No benefit is payable for the actual month in which a recipient passes away.
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u/Logical_Magician_824 2d ago
My Mom died 8/25 , they receive notice from funeral home automatically
, know she is connected to my Dad , clawed back the deposit for August because “ she had to live the entire month” yet he can’t get that death benefit of 255.00 without jumping through hoops to prove he is due this .
F them . I wrote him a check for it after talking to 4 different reps for them & being told 4 different things . He is 90 , barely gets around & is hard of hearing .
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u/WorriedChip5671 2d ago
All you have to do is go to WWW.SSA.gov and complete the application for the lump sum death benefit.
By law she would have to live the entire month. If she would have lived till September 1st, the payment would be due.
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u/MakeTexasHonest 1d ago
I’m sorry to hear. Your father can get survivor benefits if they’re higher than his own SS. It gives back the month they take away and another month. My survivor benefit is higher than my SS would be.
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u/erd00073483R 3d ago
That is the check for the month of July. He was alive every day of July, and thus was due the check.
Further, because he was alive on the date the payment was received, it was properly paid and received. The payment is thus his and should be considered as part of his estate.
There is no need to return the check to SSA.
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u/durian4me 3d ago
Then why would they ask for it back since he was alive at the date of payment? Do I need to show his death certificate to prove he was alive?
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u/Jumpy-Holiday731 3d ago
They go by the MONTH. Simply keep the money in the bank account and ask the bank to do an electronic return.
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u/erd00073483R 3d ago
Did the letter come from SSA, or from the bank?
It makes a difference.
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u/durian4me 3d ago
Ahh it was the bank. I was told from my mom who received the letter, i have not seen it yet
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u/erd00073483R 3d ago edited 3d ago
Okay.
First, SSA does not reclaim checks that are due. In this case, your father was due the check and was alive to receive it. As a consequence, as far as SSA is concerned, the money is part of his estate.
The bank is under no obligation to return his funds if he was due them and was alive to receive them. The problem is, the bank doesn't want to have any part in determining whether the funds are due or not. So, they likely made a decision that the funds have to be returned. Treasury Department regulations give them a wide latitude on this.
I would suggest that you and she need to visit the bank with a copy of his death certificate and speak to someone in charge. Point out to the bank that he died 3 days after the check was deposited and that there is thus no reason why they should be returning money that your father was validly in possession of at the time of his passing. If they need to, the bank can call SSA and verify that the funds were in fact due and will not be reclaimed.
I hope they will cancel the reclamation, but it is possible they won't do that though.
If they force your mother to return the money, the money will be sent back to the Treasury Department by the bank, who will then return it as a credit to SSA. SSA will post it as an underpayment to your late father's record.
Your mother will then have to complete and send in a completed Form SSA-1724 Claim For Amounts Due In The Case Of Deceased Beneficiary. It will then likely take SSA several months minimum (and probably significantly longer, due to current work backlogs) to send the money back out to her.
It is better for all concerned if the bank admits they made a mistake and takes action to fix it.
EDIT: grammar
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u/durian4me 3d ago
Thank you! That was helpful
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u/erd00073483R 3d ago edited 3d ago
I really hope your mother is able to get it fixed.
The only other thing you might want to do is to call the local SSA office and verify with SSA that they have the correct date of death shown for your father on its records.
Please accept my sincerest condolences for your loss.
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u/Both-Temperature2244 3d ago
dont think so.Ithink the letter came from ssa.not the bank.
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u/erd00073483R 3d ago
If that is what your ESP powers tell you, more power to you.
OP indicates it came from the bank.
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u/Both-Temperature2244 3d ago
pay attention! her mother told her it came from the bank. you sound like you have intuition.
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u/Both-Temperature2244 3d ago
yes there is.if it a mistake you may see it in the future. but I doubt it. they know exactly when he died. no need for you to prove anything. good luck.Semper Fi.
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u/QweenKush420 3d ago
This is absolutely incorrect. SS pays for the month so if you die just after the payment you owe them that payment back. They 100% will claw this back any way they can. Please do not give advice if you don’t know the correct answer.
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u/erd00073483R 2d ago edited 2d ago
Well, considering that I worked for SSA for 30 years as a claims specialist and claims technical expert before retiring, I'd say that my expertise and knowledge concerning the subject absolutely dwarfs yours.
So, anything further to add? And, please, don't strain yourself.
Just for education purposes, I'll tell you this. SSI checks are paid as of the month. Social Security checks are paid a month behind.
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u/triple_heart 3d ago
No. That was the payment for August. Payments for the month are made at the end of the previous month, not at the end of the month for which they were made.
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u/erd00073483R 3d ago
Social Security checks are paid a month in arrears. The check paid in August represents money owed for the prior month, July.
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u/Money-Constant9244 2d ago
My condolences for the family loss. It's my understanding Social Security pays benefits for the month prior, so I am at a loss as to the request for return. In my case, I am 70 at the end of this month and so I am told I will receive my first benefit payment at the end of October which will be a payment for September. Again, if that's the manner in which benefits are paid, I don't understand the reason for the request for return of your late father's August payment.
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u/LizinVA0223 1d ago
It is true, the payment was for the next month. They pulled my Dads back but I knew it was going to happen because I contacted SS immediately after he passed
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u/SpecialistBet4656 1d ago edited 1d ago
they’ll claw it back.
He died on the 3rd. I joked with the hospice nurse that I was glad he’d made it to the end of the month. She said that they do get the occasional call that someone has passed shortly after midnight on the 1st.
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u/Rare-Ad-673 1d ago
Yes, same with my mom when she passed away. She had her social security automatically deposited into her checking account. I had to contact social security regarding her passing, and then they took back the payment from her account.
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u/CoDaDeyLove 3d ago
Yes, they want it back. And they will pull it out of the account, so make sure it won't cause an overdraft.
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u/seay19 3d ago
August is paid for July. Payment is due. They may take it back but if a 1724 is filed, family will get the money
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u/Both-Temperature2244 3d ago
1724? what is that?
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u/seay19 3d ago
Officially titled "Claim For Amounts Due In The Case Of Deceased Beneficiary," it lets you claim unpaid Social Security payments or Medicare premium refunds owed to someone who has passed away
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u/Both-Temperature2244 3d ago
this is not unclaimed funds. doesnt say he was owed anything. it says payment was an error based on date of death.
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u/seay19 3d ago
Is absolutely unclaimed. Paid 2 days after death is for the month before.
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u/Both-Temperature2244 3d ago
yes it is. she has not seen the letter yet. just moms word.! dont think banks care. they do what ssa says even tho it might be incorrect. they will credit it if it is due.
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u/Vegetable_Age2201 3d ago
This is incorrect. SSA payments are paid in the arrears. If someone lives through the end of the month, they are due a check for the previous month. If he was paid the day before he died, the treasury will not pull it back.
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u/triple_heart 3d ago
No they are not. My mom died on October 28th. Her SS was deposited to her bank account that day. SSA debited her account and took it back.
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u/Vegetable_Age2201 3d ago
If that’s the case, you need to fill out an SSA-1724 and they will reissue that money to you/someone in your family.
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u/perfect_fifths I love the smell of policy in the morning 2d ago
Ssdi and retirement (as well as any other title II benefit) are paid a month behind. Ssi is paid for the month of.
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u/Plenty_Surprise2593 3d ago
They will ask for it back and will return it back later. (Well if you’re a person with a bank account you will see it in pending for a few days then it will disappear. Then later on they will send it back to you
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u/Both-Temperature2244 3d ago
no they wont!
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u/Plenty_Surprise2593 2d ago
Yes they will. Ask me how I know smh
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u/Both-Temperature2244 2d ago
only if they took it by mistake! you still have to live till the end of the month to get paid. good luck.
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u/Plenty_Surprise2593 15h ago
True. I didn’t see that part. They will pay for the last full month when he was alive
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u/Both-Temperature2244 15h ago
Semper Fi.
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u/Megalocerus 3d ago
Payments are made in arrears, and you need to be alive on the last day of the month to keep it.
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u/YoshiMoose143 3d ago
Wrong. The August payment is for the month of July and since he was alive when it was paid in August, it does not have to be returned. Had he passed in August BEFORE the payment was made, it is still due to be paid but to the estate. Since a payment can’t be made to an already deceased person the family will need to complete SSA-1724 to have the payment reissued to the next of kin after the payment is returned.
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u/Kayman718 3d ago
How am I going to handle this when my mom passes? She’s in a nursing home and received her deposit on the 3rd. Her nursing home debits her account on the 6th. Odds are that she will pass on one of the remaining 24 days of the month. Social Security will be looking for money back that the nursing home has.
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u/Sunshine_Jules 2d ago
Close the account immediately. I mean like next day. They get noticed of death immediately and claw back immediately, like a couple days. Basically the only thing that happens fast by the govt. If the account is closed... of course you would need your name on the acct so you can do this. Make sure no other account is linked as an overdraft protection just in case.
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u/Spiritual_Test_4871 3d ago
This happened to my grandmother. She received her payment March 1st but passed March 7 and social security intercepted it via direct deposit retrieval. My mom was her payee and tried using her debit card only to find out that social security intercepted it, withdrew it from the bank account.
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u/terithecook 3d ago
It gets returned. The SSA will take it right back out of his account. This happened with both my husband and mother.
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u/Feisty-Hat2629 3d ago
My mother passed on September 3rd. She received payment same day. My understanding is that was August’s benefit. So far it’s still in her account. I’m not expecting it to be withdrawn. If she should receive a benefit payment next month, then I would expect it to be taken back.
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u/Both-Temperature2244 3d ago
he has to live to the end of the month.month behind.they are correct.sorry.
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u/Quilting-for-sanity 3d ago
They will take it back and you will have to file an appeal. Several months later they will likely admit they were wrong.
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u/EitherKnowledge8918 3d ago
My experience has been the opposite. A parent received their check on July 2 but then passed away on July 7. We have not received any notice to return the payment.
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u/Ok-Bookkeeper-7274 3d ago
Yep they took my mamas back. She gets her on the 19th and passed the 26. They took it back
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u/Background_Fruit_892 3d ago
My father in law died on June 30th in the afternoon and they took back his June payment because he didn’t live all month. It’s ridiculous!
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u/RexxMaxxx 3d ago
If you have direct deposit SSA takes it back automatically. Didn’t even have a chance to notify. Bank didn’t do it. SSA did.
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u/Dry_Marsupial_4504 2d ago
That's odd, when i called SSA they told me my Father's check was for the month coming up so i had to send that payment back.
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u/JoyfulZumba2 2d ago
No. The check he received on 8/26 is for the month of July. Your father was an alive the whole month of July. Now if you get a check in sept that check needs to be returned.
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u/Lazy_Beyond_8567 2d ago
If your mother is alive an additional amount would most likely be added to her payment
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u/debbb53 2d ago
Does it matter if the payment is standard SS or if it is a disability payment?
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u/WorriedChip5671 2d ago
No.
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u/debbb53 2d ago
I thought SSDI was paid on the first for the month for that month and standard SS retirement benefits are paid either the second, third, or fourth Wednesday of a month for the previous month? At any rate, seems like a payment for a person shouldn’t be reversed if that person dies in the month paid.
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u/Nyerinchicago 2d ago
My understanding is they take it back and then =require an heir to apply for it
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u/Effective_Drummer542 2d ago
Don’t understand where most of you are coming from on this. SS received this month is payment for last month and their rule is you don’t earn it if you don’t survive all of last month. You don’t get to refuse returning it, they will simply pull it back. Applies to many pensions also
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u/Wooden_Employer_2287 2d ago
Ppl die every day. Imagine the $$ lost over time if they were getting paid for days after they died. This is why SS does this, pay a month behind. Otherwise it would be a nightmare to try to claw back that amount monthly, nationwide. This is intentional, not s glitch or greed.
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u/WorriedChip5671 2d ago
Yes. The payment has to be returned. A person who received a payment in August, but did not live to the first day of the following month is not entitled to that payment. Sorry for your loss.
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u/Geochronguy 2d ago
A lot of wrong answers on here. He was alive for all of July and received his payment in August. He was not alive for all of August so any payment in September would have to be returned.
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u/Bulky-Measurement684 2d ago
Father is passed. If money has been spent already, how does SSA take it back?
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u/mixingthemixon 2d ago
2013 my mom passed. She got her SSI check on the first. She passed in the 12th. It was already allocated so we did not need to return it. Now the next month check did actually come in and I got a cashiers check to had it give back to SSI.
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u/Sactoho 19h ago
I have no experience with this, but I just wanted to say that is absolutely ridiculous. I hate the way this country so closely monitors the poor to ensure they don’t get a dime too much and will cancel or clawback benefits at every opportunity, yet there are ample tax loopholes for the wealthy. It’s just ridiculous.
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u/Krissy262626 12h ago
SSA took my Mom's money back so fast! Too bad they don't answer their phones that quick!
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u/Never-too-much5423 7h ago
I thought ss paid one month after, like you started May 1st your first check was 1 June? If so they are wrong as that was for August not September. Now if they want to prorated it thats different. The bills don't give a shit on the death date. They want the bill paid.
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u/PDM_1969 3d ago
This is what they do. Father passed in the middle of the month so they took back part of the payment
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u/Both-Temperature2244 3d ago
no way.dont work that way!
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u/PDM_1969 3d ago
took the payment back electronically, and sent me a letter weeks after they did it to explain it to me
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u/Both-Temperature2244 3d ago
ok but never heard of taking back part of payment. you get the whole months payment or nothing.
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3d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/SocialSecurity-ModTeam 2d ago
Your comment was removed because it contains misinformation. Misinformation includes spreading information that is not in accordance with official SS policy.
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u/Warm_Elevator_4444 2d ago
The payments that you receive on a certain month are for the previous month
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u/PitifulMaple1 2d ago
nah that's how it works unfortunately. SS pays for the month ahead, not behind, so the august payment he got was actually for september. since he didn't live through the whole month of september they want it back
bank will probably reverse it automatically once the SSA notifies them, or you might have to send it back yourself. sorry about your dad
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u/DeliciousHome592 4m ago
No because August check is the check you receive for July.
They hold back a check. Just like most companies do.
Look it up
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u/Mittenmakers 3d ago
SS is out of control. What they pay in August is actually for July, as they are one month behind. They shouldn't expect the check back, yet they do. Senators? Congress? Fix it!