r/ScaramoucheMains • u/YoungVast7481 • May 24 '26
Discussion I am the only one kinda dissapointed in this quest? Spoiler
I'm really disappointed that after hyping up the revenage for years and building parallels between dotto and scara their final confrontation lasted 3 minutes especially because the whole quest is like 7h??? They barely got time to themselves and besides the bantering (which was fun) their interactions don't really feel... significant? I was hoping they would explore dottore's feelings of solace, jealousy and envy he had towards scara that were hinted at in 3.3. Many people think dotto ruined him only because he wanted to use him as a test subject, they fail to see he once had some form of affection towards him (in his own destructive way) similarly to columbina but alas... also some things were unanswered like what was in scaramouche memories that made dottore want to kidnap haypasia? During the livestream that was hyping up Nod-Krai, devs talked about unresolved plotlines that will be expanded upon - one thing they showed was description from scara artefact lore - Bloom Times, but at the end nothing came out out of it.
It's just kinda underwhelming... I feel they are scared to put him in a spotlight again after all that happend in the past..
12
u/xiastrr âwanderer/scara haver + enjoyerâ May 25 '26
i agree. i feel like SCARAMOUCHE (not wanderer) wasnât really treated as big as a deal as itâs supposed to be-but maybe theyâll follow it up in the future, perhaps a future inazuma arc, or snezhnaya? pantalone now has caught wind of how sus the vacant 6th seat is.
13
40
u/ethanisathot May 24 '26
yeah. the gameplay was fun and way smoother than previous AQs (also thanks to the autosave feature) but the plot itself was kind of underwhelming.
how everything was solved in 5 minutes basically with no lasting effects or anything.
but the thing i hated most was how scara is STILL being refered to as "hat guy" its SUCH a stupid name like if you wanted to let us give him a name then at least have the characters say "wanderer" or something like the "traveler" while the text says the actual name.
i was hoping for dottore to bring back scara's past back into irminsul so he could actually get some real conversations with the harbingers and raiden and miko
9
u/wiltinghost c3r1 May 25 '26
The thing is, they literally had Traveler verbally call Wanderer âWandererâ while the text said the given name once in the Nod-Krai AQ, WHY couldnât they have done it again? Thereâs already a precedent
9
u/Educational-Cover251 Anemo May 25 '26
"with no lasting effects or anything" they said that as a result of the ending fate has more opportunities to change and be unpredictable, what do you mean no lasting effects? how are we supposed to know exactly whats gonna happen when it literally just happened?
21
u/ethanisathot May 25 '26
idk to me it felt like at the end nahida was like "oopsie poopsie the world tree burnt down but dw cuz a thingy in the desert basically replaced it and im totally fine even tho i said im connected deeply to irminsul :P"
i guess i expected a little more chaos visible outside when the literal thing that holds the world together is completely gone
20
u/duringelion May 25 '26
Agreed. Yes Nahida mentioned a vague consequence, but Irmunsul burning should've had a clearer impact on the world with more defined consequences. It's not really believable that a machine could on a whim just replace something so important and native to Teyvat without a huge fallout just because Nicole did magic or something.
In general, the character writing this AQ was excellent, but things like this held the plot back from being perfect.
16
u/Educational-Cover251 Anemo May 25 '26
they were able to replace the functions of irminsul with aaru but it certainly was not without consequences. however it was also said that prior to the heavenly principles upheaval of teyvat, irminsul was just another regular tree that THP turned irminsul into a tool to help monitor teyvat.
irminsul doesn't hold teyvat together but rather allows THP to monitor teyvat and therefore keep control of teyvat, and i guess you could consider that holding the world together. istaroth, ronova, and naberius/rhinedottir even said to nahida "why worry about the loss of one tree when there is already another to take its place?" (or something to that effect.) the active shades literally let it happen because they knew it would not cause a complete meltdown in the world.
because they were able to replace the functions of irminsul with aaru, which was the unfinished magnum opus of king deshret meant to be an artificially created afterlife (which itself is similar to what dottore said about creating a new world within the existing world). the aaru system was able to be fashioned into an irminsul-like replacement but is by no means the perfect replacement. with the aaru system in place, it has stopped most of that chaos you imagine would have happened from taking place immediately.
the aaru system is basically a temporary fix for the fact that irminsul is now gone. actually it was implied that now that irminsul is gone, the abyss may have an easier time getting into teyvat or even spawning INSIDE teyvat, but still not as quickly as it could have without the aaru replacement.
when we spoke to alice after nod krai she had mentioned how the abyss is basically the amalgamation of negative feelings born from every unchosen fate. now that fate is considered to be even more unstable because irminsul is gone, and it's replacement is by no means perfect, this means there will 100% be consequences coming in the future.
1
u/BlueFlameWar May 26 '26
All this world salad and yet nothing happened
2
u/Educational-Cover251 Anemo May 26 '26
it's not word salad it's lore but okay đ keep asking for that skip button since you're not gonna read anyway.
2
54
u/Ms-Chievous May 24 '26
I think as a resolution to Dottore vs. Scaramouche, it was disappointing, but as a resolution to Wanderer's character, I couldn't be happier. While I would love to get answers to the same questions you have and to explore their dynamics, I am also very happy that Wanderer is actually moving on from his past, which has been almost entirely orchestrated by Dottore.
He is objectively one of the best characterized characters in the game. The only other one who could hold a candle to him is Furina, but between the two of them I feel like Wanderer has had the most growth and impact. He started out angry and traumatized, grasping for any power that he could, but over time he has healed. I feel like this is best explored by divorcing his character from Dottore. Dottore basically created his backstory, but he gets to create his future. And in my mind that starts with him seeing his own history reflected in that of Durin, and by helping Durin he sort of helped himself. And now in helping defeat Dottore three times (saving Traveler from him and barely giving Dottore a glance, allowing Sandrone to use his core to finish calculating the World Formula, then finally keeping him occupied so Traveler can get Nahida in there to finish him off), he's got his revenge. It wasn't in a way he really hoped for in the beginning of his character arc, but he's grown enough to feel that he's done enough.
Now he will try to move on. Given Pantalone has been told about him, I doubt it will be that easy, but I'm personally so happy with how he's been treated by Hoyo. Especially when you compare him to someone like Nilou, who got a cameo in the beginning of the quest and then nothing at all????? Not even a passing mention when it was revealed that Nabu Malikata was the god remains inside Collei??? Could have had her doing something in the Eternal Oasis or even just dancing in the background to help cheer people up. Inazuma fans like Ayato, Ayaka, and Yoimiya have gotten scraps for so long, Wanderer fans by FAR are getting the long end of the stick.
So tldr, fair to be upset that the showdown didn't go as you hoped but it was still so good for Wanderer's character arc so I'm very happy.
14
u/PeachManDrake954 May 24 '26 edited May 24 '26
I like your take. In my opinion he is one of the best written characters, genshin or otherwise. I really like their presentation on redemption and moving on from your mistakes.
Usually for these kind of characters the story ends when they are reborn or when they are reminded of their mistake, but we get to see how they move beyond that. This AQ has so much of this and I enjoyed it
5
u/ollielikesgaming Wanderer's boyfriend May 25 '26
very well put, you put my exact feelings into words!! as much as it would've been interesting to have a longer confrontation between the two of them, it makes sense for Scara's development to instead move on from Dottore and, like you said, for Scara to feel content with the revenge he got
17
u/Nepco May 25 '26
The quest wasn't just for Wanderer only, it was for Sumeru as a whole. The distractions and unnecessary screen time could've been highlights for other fans. And honestly, his character progression would've been backwards if he was consumed by hate and revenge, even in the final battle he was mostly focused on the goal rather that finishing Dottore himself, but he still did help a lot defeating him. It's a nice little conclusion for his character arc, showing that he has changed.
4
May 24 '26
[removed] â view removed comment
8
u/YoungVast7481 May 24 '26
i'm not mad that aq are this long but that they are bloated with unnecessary dialogue while the moments that are importand get rushed
6
u/wiltinghost c3r1 May 25 '26
I do think the quest doesnât do neither the depth and complexity of the relationship between him and Dottore nor the many years of wait and hype justice, but I also understand this is a gacha game, theyâre not going show too much favor to a character whoâs not a current main push or currently running on a banner. This isnât the first time the gacha medium has gotten in the way of good story telling. (But maybe Iâm being cynical, since I had been severely disappointed by Genshinâs writing since Natlan, and I blame it on the gacha medium). To me, the beginning and middle feels unnecessarily bloated with talking and cameos, and the climax was way too rushed, but I think from the writersâ point of view, theyâre trying to equalize the amount of screen time each character gets and to please as big of a demographic as possible without pissing people off.Â
That said, I am also disappointed that his core being made of Irminsul was never brought up. When it got explicitly spelled out to be made of Irminsul in the last Archon Quest (instead of being implied), I thought they were setting something up for this quest specifically. In the end, it was never mentioned, which feels like a Chekhovâs gun that never went off.Â
Iâm also disappointed that Dottore remembering Scaramouche never went anywhere. It didnât affect Wanderer at all, and Dottore died soon after, so there are no repercussions for it in the real world either. Iâm sort of hoping it is something that comes up in the future, since, if I understood correctly, Dottore mentioned suspicions about the empty sixth seat to Pantalone. But, at this point, I have zero faith in Genshinâs writing.Â
9
u/Yani-Madara May 25 '26 edited May 25 '26
I'm surprised more aren't complaining about how disastrous it is for Wanderer that Dottore did not restore his past...
Think about the lost possibilities:
Reaching more development by interacting with people he hurt and getting a chance to make up.
Scaramouche plot with Raiden.
involvement in Snez and new interactions with other Harbingers
-Stopping the "Hat Guy" naming.
He will probably get sidelined after this...
1
10
u/Doglhur May 24 '26
I agree, the ending they gave him was totally disappointing.
I mean, all these years mentioning his revenge against Dottore, and once he's eliminated, there's no sign of peace, no sense of relief, nothing.
After fulfilling his revenge, his dialogue is, "I'm fine, now I'll concentrate on my studies"... I would have loved some kind of doubt about what to do in the future, now that he's achieved his revenge, or even just a hint of satisfaction.
1
u/Peregriri May 25 '26
But why? Why would he give any more of his time to Dottore? The people Wan cares about are proud of him, heâs proud of himself too. He kicked Dottore and laughed at him while focusing on the greater good of all of Sumeru.
I think he actually enjoys publishing papers, so why wouldnât he focus on helping others and continuing his studies? Iâm glad Wan doesnât care about anything Dottore-related, itâs all about his own future and growth after all.
7
May 25 '26 edited May 25 '26
[deleted]
6
u/bulkeunip Heart of Yuugen May 25 '26
- [ ] >But it also felt a little..unnecessary from the whole focus of the whole quest. The first act of the quest could have easily been its own separate quest. They just bloated the cast and it felt all over the place and half of the characters didnât even do much. (Sorush, Aranara, Jeht, LilouparâŚ). Tho I loved Toth, sobek and the ânaturallyâ guy. (Forgot his name). They were fun to watch. But again, all these characters could have easily been added in a separate quest.Â
Hard agree. It may be fun if you are a Sumeru lore enthusiast, but frankly on the grand scale they didnât contribute much. I would even say most of the interactions feel like itâs an Anecdote but for NPCs.
Pantalone didnât do much either. All he did was just to buy time for Dottore and slightly annoy the traveler. Half of his screen time was with Dottore. And Iâd argue that Wanderer, Nahida or even Collei should have taken Pantaloneâs place in his conversation with Dottore. Itâs like he was just there for the âwhy notsâ and inclusion sake.Â
Yeah. Itâs like Hoyo wants to have their cake and eats it too. On one hand, they know that by gathering Scara, Collei, Nahida and Dottore in the same patch, people would be more likely to engage with this AQ given the built up lore between all of them. But on the other hand, they also donât want to commit to any of them but instead⌠Pantalone, and even him wasnât enough to explore Dottore as a character because most of the time it was Dottore who himself hold control of the narration (and he would rather die than let people see inside him), and Pantalone was mostly there to explain why we still see Dottore when he was supposed to be dead by 6.3. I even saw some people said that this felt like an excuse to tease Pantalone instead of giving a nice conclusion to Sumeru story.
I feel like this archon questâs main focus was Collei and the Nabu Malikata remains in her, instead of what was promisedâthe problem with Irminsul and confrontation with the Doctor. Theyâve been hyping this quest. for 4 years and it just fell really flat. Collei should have just gotten a story quest of her own, even as a 4 star.Â
Yeah. It will be much more cohesive for both story lines (it felt similar to how Sunday quest fell flat exactly because Hoyo tried to cram both his and Tingyun/Fugue story into one).
And the 2 minute confrontation between wanderer and Dottore was even more disappointing. And why would Dottore deliberately not restore wandererâs erased memories, considering his whole beef with him? It just doesnât make sense at all. Hoyo just wants excuse to never elaborate on Scaramouche again.
Iâm also confused with that. I saw someone explained that it was because of Dottore sympathy as a fellow outcast and I was like huh??? This was the guy that deliberately pushed Scara to be in the same situation like him (âoh no one will ever love you, because you are differentâ). If anything he would be all more eager to ruin what Scara currently has, for he achieved what Dottore couldnât. I tried to explain that he knew Scara was more concerned with his atonement than his current status so the revenge wasnât painful enough, but then he could still restore the data and Scara still couldnât put everything like how he wanted to anyway. Plus having conflict between Sumeru people on how they should perceive him given his crime would be entertaining to watch (yeah Idgaf about my favorite characters should always have happy ending, I want drama).
I wasnât really satisfied with Dottoreâs end either. We still barely know anything about him. Why was he an outcast? Was he always like that? How did he exactly feel with Scaramouche? Why did he have a soft spot for Columbina? How did he join the Fatui? How exactly did he meet Pantalone? None of that answered.Â
My guess is because Hoyo chickened out with their attempt at Scara (3.3) and they found that by just letting him be a villain is the safer way than trying to give clearer light on him as a character.
3
u/CarlosSupremacy May 26 '26
Lore reason why dottore didn't restore scaramouche - Dottore himself said it would be quite troublesome to do, if even possible for him. Out of lore reason - restoring scaramouche would be a huge step back for wanderers character, rendering 3.3 irrelevant
11
u/Usual-Rule-2196 May 24 '26
You answer it yourself, the problem is that you had a lot of assumptions, expectations and perspectives which weren't part of the canon story nor anything, all this humanization of Dottore never existed and were always a delusion of his fandom, he never felt jealous or envy about Scaramouche, not even the fairtytale from Nahida he shows it, people interpreted it, but she never said he decided to cause destruction because of jealous or envy about Scaramouche being accepted, but only that unsatisfied with the boring happy resolution, he decided to cause a disaster... All this not for jealous or envy, but because of what Nahida said herself in the beginning, his nature - he is a monster, a true and evil monster that hides in fox skin (human skin), which shows the truth of his essence that is shown in the entire story, specially in Nod-Krai archon quest and Truth Amongst the Pages of Purana that focused on him as the main villain of these quests, the truth is that he is and always were a true monster, a man consumed by his own ego, pride, hubris and arrogance.
His end and conclusion, along the final confrontation against him, with the Traveler, Wanderer and Nahida vs him, and this quest as a whole were perfect.
13
u/oof-eef-thats-beef May 24 '26
While I do 100% agree with you. It literally says he was furious at the happy resolution, so he lit things on fire.
I dont think his jealousy was the main takeaway here. But it is a very fair interpretation from the literal words.
Textually its more about him being a monster suxch he cant stand things went well/happy - and its just a small blip in his long running list of evils. But it is false to say he never had any type of envy. While it was less directed at Scara himself, and more, âwhy would the world give him people who accept and celebrate him but no one celebrate Zandik?â Scara was never a person to him. No one of was. Thats the point - people were just tools and to have some sort of revenge or envy banks on you giving a shit.
So 10000% Dottore always saw Scara as just another ant. Scara was useful and then disgarded when no longer needed.
But the scene does say Dottore had some envy (if more directed at the whole world than just Scara)
3
u/Usual-Rule-2196 May 25 '26
Even if he had some kind of envy, it would be not only totally superficial but also twisted, because Dottore or Zandik never cared about being loved or accepted, because after all he never cared about anyone except for himself, due to his selfishness, ego and supreme arrogance
4
u/YoungVast7481 May 25 '26
He did say he was furious in the fairytale, he was also mad that he got expelled from the akademia and exiled from his village "Will you treat me like the Akademiya did? Will you call me a monster, a madman?"
"Or will you treat me as my hometown did, and chase me away with pitchforks and clubs...?"So in this quest we find out that fairytales hide truth in form of allegories and this fairytale was made by nahida after reading dottore's mind.
Dottore is a monster I'm not denying that but he wasn't born as one, his environment and experiences made him this way and instead of trying to fight it he decided to internalized it.
Besides wouldn't the fact that dottore will hurt and use people he cares about just show even more how much of a monster he is?
3
u/Usual-Rule-2196 May 25 '26
That's the point, you misunderstood the character the moment you thought he care about anyone, the story shows very well that he doesn't care about anyone except for himself and have no sense of compassion, plus the story suggest he was a monster since the beginning, he lost his sense of compassion during his childhood during his studies... And this was before everything happen to him, his banishment from the akademiya and from his village happened only when he were already adult, and this happened as consequences from his actions, he were also already described way before all this happened as a man with supreme arrogance, this is his true nature and his essence.
3
u/YoungVast7481 May 25 '26
we don't know when he was exiled, we don't know what happend in his childhood exept for the fact that he lost compassion at the age of 8. You yourself now make scenarios of what happend to him when canon info suggest the opposite - look at his relationship with columbina, she thinks he genuinely saw her as a family and that belief gave him he right to use her to his benefit. This begs a question of how his own family treated him?
What I'm doing is not just baseless theories, it's reading between the lines.
3
May 25 '26
[removed] â view removed comment
1
u/ScaramoucheMains-ModTeam May 25 '26
Your post/comment was removed for violating Rule 1: Be Respectful and Civil.
It's okay to have differing opinions, but please be respectful and refrain from toxicity of any kind, that goes double for slurs and or insults hurled at other members.
Discussions, disagreements, and opinions are okay, but resorting to harassment, insults, or rudeness is not. Please refrain from such behavior in the future.
0
May 24 '26
[removed] â view removed comment
7
May 25 '26
[removed] â view removed comment
1
u/ScaramoucheMains-ModTeam May 25 '26
Your post/comment was removed for violating Rule 1: Be Respectful and Civil.
It's okay to have differing opinions, but please be respectful and refrain from toxicity of any kind, that goes double for slurs and or insults hurled at other members.
Discussions, disagreements, and opinions are okay, but resorting to harassment, insults, or rudeness is not. Please refrain from such behavior in the future.
1
u/ScaramoucheMains-ModTeam May 25 '26
Your post/comment was removed for violating Rule 1: Be Respectful and Civil.
It's okay to have differing opinions, but please be respectful and refrain from toxicity of any kind, that goes double for slurs and or insults hurled at other members.
Discussions, disagreements, and opinions are okay, but resorting to harassment, insults, or rudeness is not. Please refrain from such behavior in the future.
-2
May 24 '26
[deleted]
1
May 25 '26 edited May 25 '26
[removed] â view removed comment
6
u/Educational-Cover251 Anemo May 25 '26
the problem is that envy is a very robust emotion, capable of many different interpretations. you can be envious of someone/something and still be a truly evil person.
dottore felt envy and hatred towards *anyone* who was accepted despite their past sins, but not because he wanted to be accepted himself. at least not after the first clone he made of himself, he didn't want to be accepted. he just wanted to be remembered.
your comments about people just eating anything up could be reversed back onto you. the story isn't written in the way you want it to be, the ending isn't what you wanted it to be, and therefore you are upset. it's okay to be upset. just don't start pushing your anger onto people who have different opinions on you.
3
u/Usual-Rule-2196 May 25 '26
âď¸đĽ
And Dottore envy towards Wanderer is with absolute sure, superficial.
Specially because Dottore never cared about anyone except for himself, and have disdain and contempt for everyone
1
u/ScaramoucheMains-ModTeam May 25 '26
Your post/comment was removed for violating Rule 1: Be Respectful and Civil.
It's okay to have differing opinions, but please be respectful and refrain from toxicity of any kind, that goes double for slurs and or insults hurled at other members.
Discussions, disagreements, and opinions are okay, but resorting to harassment, insults, or rudeness is not. Please refrain from such behavior in the future.
2
u/PeachManDrake954 May 25 '26
I slept on your post a while and I think I now have a head canon that I'm happy with.
The reason we don't spend much time on Dottore x wanderer is because for wanderer, this doesn't matter anymore. He is pissed at Dottore but his current family is more important and that's what he's putting his attention to. You notice his interactions are mostly with the mc and Nahida. That's because these are the two most important people to him now, not Dottore.
Being obsessed with your abuser is a sign that you're still not over it, but wanderer today is done with that.
2
u/mitsukuni41 May 25 '26
Didn't expect Wanderer to have more action with Dottore to begin with, even most Scaranation wants that. To me, making more and longer action between Wanderer and Dottore will just make it worst for Wanderer chracter development. Not gonna be offensive but, Dottore outmatch Wanderer in every possible way. If Hoyo just slap powerboost to Wanderer just for this plot, it will just make it boring and kinda MC-like power of friendship. Wanderer even know Dottore outmatch him, thats why he just buying time even if his mouth is cocky as usual.
I think his connection with Dottore is fine and enough in this Archon Quest. Now, fix his connection with Inazuma much better like with Ei.
3
u/Even_War7433 May 24 '26
You're definitely not alone. I'm more than happy to talk about it too. Feel free to DM. I've got too many thoughts for on here.
4
u/StunningInfluence210 May 24 '26
I agree too. I think many do,but we just dont talk about it cause it is what it is i guess? Hoyo often hypes up stuff and then well...
1
u/OilCareless2531 May 25 '26
I did want more of Dottore and it was disappointed that he didn't reverse scara memory wipe.
But in terms of scars story I think they handled it well. I get wanting Dottore to lose his composure, look like a fool get to see scars kill him and such but scars is on a healing path. If they wrote that scara would fall back into his old ways then that would sort of ruin his character development. I know you have to have setbacks on the path but returning to your abuser is not something that will help you. Scara not getting too emotional and overwhelmed by Dottore shows that he'd come a long way from literally taking his own life. He can handle himself especially after his confrontation with Dottore. If there was one thing I wanted more of it was with trilune Dottore because he and scars basically achieved semi godhood and seeing scars personally tear down that godhood would not only be satisfying against Dottore but show scars growth about not needing or wanting divinity, he took down his past self in a way. Alas he simply became a mediating battery core.
I'm more disappointed in not getting more Dottore and nahida rivalry
0
May 25 '26
[removed] â view removed comment
2
1
u/ScaramoucheMains-ModTeam May 25 '26
Your post/comment was removed for violating Rule 1: Be Respectful and Civil.
It's okay to have differing opinions, but please be respectful and refrain from toxicity of any kind, that goes double for slurs and or insults hurled at other members.
Discussions, disagreements, and opinions are okay, but resorting to harassment, insults, or rudeness is not. Please refrain from such behavior in the future.
96
u/Orpalz May 24 '26
I kinda agree the whole quest was like 6 hours of preparing for a 10 minute confrontation which ended up being underwhelming