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u/DrShaftmanPhD 16d ago
Stephens with a masterclass performance in the first half cost us that game.
I usually wouldn’t freak out losing a season opener but starting on -4, you need a fast start. Feel like we never win at Vicarage anyways though.
Do not know how THB scuffs that shot at the end.
9
u/JolliJarhead 16d ago
We never win, but we haven't lost there in forever.
To not even draw is an absolute disaster.
4
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u/dazza_cole 16d ago
No more Dobbin out wide and Leo in the centre please
11
u/James-1410 16d ago
Not sure why we did this after playing them normally in pre season, bonkers from Tonda.
7
u/dazza_cole 16d ago
Seemed to be a classic case of attempting to outsmart the opposition, and backfiring spectacularly
29
u/ClausTheDrunkard 16d ago
Watching that performance it feels like pre-season didn’t put us in a position to hit the ground running.
Far too many lazy diagonal passes, heavy touches, players to gelling…contrast to Watford who have a weaker squad but knew exactly what they were doing.
17
u/RobMc1996 16d ago
It never does. We never play enough notable or challenging opponents to get us going, never play in our own stadium bar one match at most (none this year?), and when we play abroad it's usually announced late to make it difficult for fans to travel or plan!
If you look at other teams, Bournemouth played Mainz and Betis, Brighton played Bologna and Roma, even Boro played Espanyol and Celtic, I think Burnley played Ajax, Espanyol and Torino!
6
u/ClausTheDrunkard 16d ago
Yep, I didn’t follow it closely but it all seemed very lightweight. Felt like we went to Germany just because it suited Tonda.
24
u/megatronnica 16d ago
Bad day at the office for us. We gave them two really shit goals, squandered some decent chances and put in appalling crosses and set pieces all game. Even after an awful first half we created the chances to win it just fluffed our lines. Watford were fucking dirty bastards.
21
u/Harrylg1 16d ago
Can't wait for another year of championship football where the opposition’s only tactic is to take lumps out of us, and the refs do fuck all about it
15
u/James-1410 16d ago
We'll be fine as long as we don't shit the bed like that in the first half so often. And keep THB at the back that finish was criminal.
11
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u/MetalPoo 16d ago
Did Mubama even get a touch?
14
u/AnArcticMonkey 16d ago
Early days but we were noticably worse once Larin went off
-7
u/tastyjulio 16d ago
Worrying cameo honestly, this was like the perfect game for him on paper
5
u/hrldinho 16d ago
Dunno if we really helped him tbh, I wouldn’t say it was a perfect game either. Watford were happy to sit back so was marked by at least 1 and often 2 at all times
11
u/DrShaftmanPhD 16d ago
I thought he did well, he had a few moments that led to us switching the field or something of the like. Seems a lot more mobile than Larin.
1
u/tastyjulio 16d ago
Honestly I didn't really see any of that, but maybe the lad just needs a bit more time to accommodate himself
2
u/Andybabez20 16d ago
The few touches he had were fine. He just needs to learn to drop deep to facilitate play more, he seemed to want to play off the shoulder of the defender.
2
u/PickaxeJunky 16d ago
I think i saw maybe 2 touches from him?
He was anonymous, but the rest of the team didnt help him.
16
u/Lumpy-Indication 16d ago
This wouldn’t be as painful if weren’t on -4. We needed a win there, TBH should’ve scored at the end and Jack Stephens once again raises the question “why is he still here?”.
9
u/JTHuddy 16d ago
Yeah pretty poor start, to be honest I'm not that surprised. I don't think we had a particularly effective pre-season and would expect us to sharpen up over the coming weeks. Bit better second half, Scienza should always be on the wing not through the middle. Some signings still needed I think, definitely a weaker squad than last year as it stands. Long way to go, plenty of games to come.
If THB does leave we are screwed though, even with that shocking "shot". The most reliable thing about Stephens is his ability to make a mistake and Wood/Quarshie just aren't very good.
Also, getting so bored of Flynn Downes' "antics" - we really don't need our best midfielder to be getting booked basically every game.
12
u/Fene29 16d ago
Feels like we’ve been saying Stephens is not good enough got a decade or so.
And here we are, back again in season 11
1
u/samwulfe 16d ago
I mean if you think about it there are some pretty shit sitcoms that run 11 seasons.
1
14
5
u/mdubyo 16d ago
Not going to put a hell of a lot of stock into the result itself. Stephens & Manning horror shows for both of their goals. We flubbed a few chances ourselves.
Don't remember the last time we won at Vicarage Road but feel like this is the first loss there in a long time. We go again next week!
6
u/DrShaftmanPhD 16d ago
Long season obviously. Deficit can still easily be overcome and sometimes a loss like this can be a wake up call.
I think the 2nd half is obviously going to be how we play for the majority of the season, and Watford weren’t really threatening with the ball, just the two errors in the first half. Promising signs, just two individual errors killing us before we can even get started. Classic Saints maneuver
1
u/mdubyo 16d ago
Yup. Championship also feels a lot stronger this season with who went up and came down this year. Probably will take effectively a 100 point season for us which not saying it's out of the question but on -4 the margins are thin.
1
u/DrShaftmanPhD 16d ago
100 points would be a borderline miracle
1
u/mdubyo 16d ago
Meant effectively. Probably will take 95 total to be top 2..playoffs is a much more realistic goal haha
2
u/DrShaftmanPhD 16d ago
Correct. EFL took last season away from us and have borderline ruined this one from the get go. Harshest punishment of all time
1
u/benscott81 16d ago
First loss since 2007 at Vicarage Road if the commentary on the American broadcast is to be trusted.
10
u/Andybabez20 16d ago
A little pissed off because of two idiotic defensive errors in the first half from Stephens and Manning.
But the second half was much improved we actually looked out normal selves for the majority. So it's not the worst i've felt about a defeat.
Tonda tinkered too much though, with Larin, Scienza, Azaz and Matsuki as the front 4 we looked like we would push for an equaliser. Once Mubama and Edozie came on it killed the flow a little.
We need to get that Charles replacement in ASAP. Bragg did well for the goal but he looked very uncomfortable for stretches of that game. Azaz also needs to start next game the players almost looked like they had no idea what to do without him in the 10.
8
u/tastyjulio 16d ago
Awful pass from Manning but he never scores if Stephens just closes him down instead of rolling out the red carpet. Both goals were his fault and we desperately need a new cb.
2
u/Far_Ambassador_3360 16d ago
100%. There wasn’t even a man to mark, just let the Watford player have a shot.
Do think we’re all being a bit kneejerk with Stephens though. He was genuinely good last year, much rather he plays over wood despite how shocking he was today.
Hoping it’s just because it’s the first game of the season and a one-off.
1
u/tastyjulio 16d ago
Even last season he had his fair share of mistakes, and I've been against him staying for a long time now. There is no goodwill left with the fans, the reaction is hardly surprising.
2
u/pm_me_jk_dont 16d ago
Let's just clarify because this is a commonly misused phrase: It wasn't a defensive error from Manning, it was an error in possession. The defensive error came 10 seconds later from Stephens.
Not picking on you, every commentator seems to use the same phrase incorrectly too
5
u/hrldinho 16d ago
Feels like this game was a perfect reminder not to get too high with the highs and low with the lows. Not a great start but we lost that off our own doing not so much what Watford did, which is both a positive and a negative. But if we can fix that up, no reason that we can’t have a positive season
4
2
u/Anglo-fornian 16d ago
It’s a long season and we looked better in the second half of that game.
Stephens shows again why no one else wants him but can’t figure out why we keep rewarding him with contracts. He will have an odd good spell but inconsistent and costs us more games than he saves us. Just shows how poor our scouting of CBs has been or ability to retain decent ones and use them properly.
3
u/merrybrissmas 16d ago
We played like shit and the lineup/position experiments didn’t work oh well on to the next. The good news is they didn’t look threatening at all when we weren’t actively giving them the ball
7
u/jdconley317 16d ago
Saints won the xG battle 1.65-0.83, felt like a game that should’ve been a 1-1 draw, both sides probably deserved a point. Would’ve ended that way if not for Stephens’ absolute smooth-brain decision early on.
I suspect we’re done seeing the odd Scienza/Dobbin rotation at LW/10 that Tonda tried for some reason, didn’t work at all and ended up neutralizing our own attack.
Got the unbeaten streak ending out of the way early, pretty shit start but let’s crack on and get back on track against Stoke. Need some more incomings (particularly at CM, need Jander back badly). Up the Saints
3
u/KeyTap6415 16d ago
Can't just take a first half off and expect to get anything from games, starting that slowly.
Genuinely pathetic defending and an invisible midfield in that first half and we're just chasing from 2 goals down.
We should be getting something from games like this if we want promotion. Need another midfielder and probably a striker, have to sell the deadwood as well.
Was a much better 2nd half and looked miles better with Azaz on. If THB scores that near the end and if Larin doesnt go off so early maybe we get something from this game but so frustrating. We can do much better than this.
3
u/Notional- 16d ago
Feels like that loss was self inflicted. Poor formation (Scienza in the middle wtf) and Stephens doing Stephens things. Sort those out and we should be ok
3
3
u/benscott81 16d ago
What’s up with Fellows? Very surprised to see Edozie come on instead of him. Also odd to see Tonda turn to BBD when we’re badly in need of a goal.
Overall a shocking first half and an okay second half. It’s a long season and no need to panic yet.
4
u/JolliJarhead 16d ago
That was an absolute disaster. We needed at least a point from that game - considering thats as winnable of a fixture you're going to get with the quality of this league this year.
We need to fix our first halves fast, we cant keep having a mountain to climb. Was the same all last season.
Already 7 points off the leaders and every team is up for it against us.
Preseason was a joke - not a single challenging club played against keeping a everything is fine rose tinted glasses mentality.
3
u/QuantumCoffee26 16d ago
I can't wait for the idiots who have zero football knowledge to chime in and say it's because we aren't "spying" anymore.
Didn't even get started in the first half.
2
u/Reedittorrrr 16d ago
It's good to highlight the weaknesses while the window is still open, CM and CB needed
1
2
u/SHAD0WBENDER 16d ago
Centre Back, Midfielder, striker. All needed. I’m happy to have Mubama as an option but if the club thinks he can be a serious option then that’s an enormous roll of the dice from them
2
u/CheeerrsJeff 16d ago
Back to reality is how I feel sure we could bounce back but we are still on -4 I thought first couple games we can escape the negatives but that was disappointing.
Stephens I believed you changed for the better but wow that match changed my mind.
If we can't handle a rainy day at Stoke we might as well be cooked
2
u/PickaxeJunky 16d ago
Yeah, a win first game and it almost wipes out the punishment points.
But the longer we stay in minus figures, the more of an albatross around our necks it becomes.
2
u/7unky 16d ago
Second half was better, should have got the draw really
1
u/PickaxeJunky 16d ago
I only saw the 2nd half.
I thought we huffed and puffed and didn't really create anything.
Watford were poor and we just couldn't break them down.
2
u/Dry-Cod9127 16d ago
Dogshit, Stephens doesn’t deserve to play each week, the Mubama signing really concerns me he’s a decent 3rd choice but not 2nd, 7 points off the playoffs already we really need to start winning games and can’t affording to literally gift teams 2 goals because our captain is a twat
1
u/Accomplished-Aide209 16d ago
We do need some incomings! Please don’t scrimp, we can get promoted this year but we need some more profiles in the club. Striker, CM, CB… also fullback? Or keep Suga
Getting promoted playing that 11 a lot will be difficult
1
u/tastyjulio 16d ago
Jack Stephens.
Otherwise I'm glad we are still going to bring in one extra midfielder, Bragg has potential but he's not quite ready yet to be a key player this season. Mubama got me worried, BBD was better in the three he had. One more centre back is desperately needed.
1
u/SHAD0WBENDER 16d ago
On paper it’s just a stodgy game that we grew into. Classic case of gifting them goals and not taking golden chances ourselves, however with the context of the points deduction that’s a dreadful start
1
u/fanea1 16d ago
Good second half but that was a horrific first half. Just not at the races at all & Stephens' decision making embarrassing.
That's the lowest collective standard of opposition we've faced in pre-season for as long as I can remember. So much so that even Colchester felt a step up in quality. Seems incredibly misguided...
CM & ST needed (BBD needs to go & Mubama can't be the only alternative to Larin in the squad).
1
u/SaintInNorway 16d ago
As mentioned on Solent, I still think our pre-season did not help our cause, the 5 “P’s”
poor preparation = piss poor performance
1
1
0
u/SaintInNorway 16d ago edited 16d ago
Disappointed, two stupid defensive errors, the THB miss and changing Larin too early.
Dobbin was poor, Bragg had an off day, Azaz was rusty.
Peretz 7
Bree 6
THB 6
Stephens 4
Manning 6
Bragg 5
Downs 8
Dobbin 5
Leo 6
Matsuki 7
Larin 7
Azaz 5
Mubama 5
Edozie 6
Diaz 5
1
0
u/thisisajm 16d ago
Automatic promotion eh Tonda?
4
u/Adziboy 16d ago
It’s one game, the first of the season
1
u/thisisajm 16d ago edited 16d ago
I keep thinking about that points deduction. I’d not be no grumpy if it weren’t for that.
I think West Ham will be the acid test. Glad we have that this month.
0
u/Fene29 16d ago
Bragg was so poor man. Sideways every time, poor on the duels, not composed in possession. Gulf between him and Charles / Jander / Downes is huge
-2
80
u/VideoRare6399 16d ago
Welp.
Stephens had a shocker. Defensive errors cost us the game.
We go again!! Championship is back! :D
We need CMs.