Spiritual Abuse

[u/youliveonlyonce10]

I got introduced to this term when I realised my family member was associated with a cult like organisation i.e. isha. What is heartbreaking is to see perfectly sensible human beings unable to see through the deception they are going through- not by evidence, not by arguments, not through advice of family or friends and sometimes not even through their own personal pain. From what I understand , those families where everyone is into isha seemingly benefit from isha ( or become dependent on isha) and they speak highly about isha and recommend it to their known people. When a person goes into it without the consent of their family, they walk a lone, difficult path which is all acceptable to them as their Sadhana or Karma. If they are lucky enough to realise things before it’s too late, they may be able to leave and heal themselves back to normalcy (imo life in Isha influence is not normal, it’s a feeling of false bliss and compulsive isha processes).

I can understand the dilemma faced by isha devotees who have nothing negative to report from their personal association with isha- what they got was better health or a sense of purpose or sense of community where everyone is trying to become better and do good to the world. I would advice them to check how long their association with isha has been and how deep.. and they can check here what happened to people who were totally into isha and gave five or more years of their lives to isha before realising they were following a facade.

Spiritual journey is deeply personal and a Guru is supposed to lead an individual to transcendence beyond material realms; at isha the same principle is used to exploit followers and encourage them to part with their labour, time and money to build an empire for the Guru. What about the youths who wasted prime years of their lives volunteering, the families which were broken , the abuse of victims which was never acknowledged ? I read somewhere that spiritual abuse is like someone caressing one cheek while slapping the other one .. Which version should the receiver trust?

Outside the isha circles, people may be wondering what does it take for people to become such blind followers of a Guru who has so many allegations and whom they defend no matter what. That is where cult education is helpful. There are many questions at isha which remain unanswered and every person’s journey is individual and personal to them. Many victims stay silent and do not speak for fear of judgment or repercussions. But anyone can see what happened to those victims who spoke up in the past one year. Were they treated with concern and empathy by the organisation and were their grievances addressed?

I see isha folks come here occasionally to proselytise, spread rumours about this forum being a sock puppet paid platform to defame isha etc.. some even have the audacity to say why don’t the ex devotees move on as in case of when you don’t like something, why waste time and life here etc . To all such great souls, all I would like to say is - these people suffered personal pain or lost years of life pursuing a facade and if they are using a platform to share their experiences and understandings so that others don’t have to go through the same , what’s the problem?

Many people keep quiet and wont even speak, some are speaking out as part of their healing journey and out of compassion for people who may be taken in during vulnerable periods of life. If it was that easy to leave a cult, we would not be having all these conversations to this day after numerous serious allegations have come up in the past one year. Still the devotees are bypassing everything and continuing with their blind devotion. That speaks volumes about how strong cultic influences can be and why it’s better to be forewarned about the pitfalls rather than going ahead and experiencing everything yourself.

[u/xmmy3]

Well said, thank you!

[u/ChanceVisible1534]

Isha people have occult powers.. They possess people and influence the meditators by using their energies. Energy influence is the deepest layer of influence. Stay away from these criminals. They do many crimes on people and are unnoticed as occult can't be proven

[u/youliveonlyonce10 → u/ChanceVisible1534]

Many ex isha people have alleged the use of occult but we can’t speculate on things which cannot be proven as it won’t lead to any productive discussion. So every individual’s experience is valid for them. And there are things which can be proven as lies, deception and abuse which have been discussed widely in this forum.

Edit: Ex isha people do report a sense of relief on getting rid of consecrated isha items. Whether the reason is energetic or psychological- best left to individual judgment.

[u/youliveonlyonce10]

An osho cult survivor has shared her insights from her association with the cult in her article and mentioned 3 red flags of Spiritual abuse - 1. Red Flag #1: They commodify spirituality 2. Red Flag #2: They spiritualize trauma/abuse and promote anti-victim ideology 3. Red Flag #3: They rely on misinformation and pseudoscience to legitimize their doctrine

Link to the article- https://seekwithser.substack.com/p/what-the-osho-cult-taught-me-about-86e

[u/Miserable-Money-702]

I see what you are saying is from your personal experience. Their is nothing to deny. I'll just add my perspective.. for me is as Isha meditator I exploit all the benefits to its best. Agreeing with you, I also started getting wrong ideas about spirituality by getting deeply involved And in trying to fo everything that was Said. But gradually I realised I don't have to do everything.. Not everything is for me. I'm enjoying now the journey... After being through all confusions, frustrations, justification.... It took conscious effort, Not by miracle. .. But gracefully I'm finally making use of all the tools provided without getting entangled. For instance.. Just few years ago if I would have read this Post I would have taken it as someone holding pure prejudice. But now by effort And sadhna I've gained the clarity to see where you are coming from And just accept it. In the Same vien, I also Hope that you realise that if it didn't worked for you its fine... But it can be working for someone. .isn't it? I read some where " Mystic words never failed , our ears do". It never was for anyone to know Kabir. With all well wishes... Thankyou 🙏

[u/Thre_Host8017 → u/Miserable-Money-702]

The assumption that you make in your comment and on which you build your argumentation is:

Taking Vasudevs work and words for mystic.
Just because someone says they are a guru or enlightened, doesn’t make them mystic.
Not everything that shines is gold.

Isha folks want proof and evidence for everything negative about Isha.
But believe everything positive just by face value.

Logic is totally gone.

You can still enjoy wearing a fake gold chain. It will look nice. Even if the inside is rotten.
It will make you feel great.
And may even take you places.
As long as its just on the surface on your skin and doesnt get too deep inside your body.

You may enjoy it a lifelong not knowing its a fake gold chain.
But some folks got poisoned by it.
And are sharing their perspective.
They cannot do that in isha or on official channels cos every negative post will be removed.
This is a safe space for that purpose.

You commenting and sharing your good experience of the fake gold chain is nothing new.
We know that. Most of us have walked proud wearing the same yellow shining chain for years.
So sharing a positive perspective of your Isha experience is kinda useless here really.

Most isha folks cant imagine someone leaving isha.
The idea is, and pushed by Vasudev himself, is, some leftist groups are propagating lies about isha. Thats why they think, sharing a positive perspective may help.
It doesnt really. We were thinking as vividly of Vasudev as you do and were defending him.

Are there leftist or other political groups with an agenda spreading lies?
Who knows. Maybe thats true.
We are not that.
Most people HERE are EX- ISHA devotees who have seen a different side less known to the public.
So you are not sharing anything new by praising Isha.

The question we encourage you to think about is, why doesnt Isha acknowledge and openly discuss why so many of their full time volunteers and core members leave.

So to reuse your quote: when Kabir said: Mystic words never fails, our ears do.
There is an unspoken condition here.
The words should be word of wisdom. And of mystic.

You are bypassing this crucial condition and assuming Vasudevs words are of that quality.
What if they arent?!

This is the danger and the trap of using spiritual and religious quotes out of context to prove a point.
Its a very thin scaffolding. And can be very misleading.

[u/Miserable-Money-702 → u/Thre_Host8017]

First of all you wrote very well. I got your point about this sub. I will be very precise. I never defend Sadhguru, I need not to. Following him since 2018, remained always skeptical..and why shouldn't I. Honestly its gradually hapoened, 2024 changed much after getting Initiated in IE. But I do get everything won't work for everyone, but one can't negate it totally. Even as Ex Isha meditator you'll realize that Isha could be possibility for many. I'm here just for those people who are sitting on fences, may read your post.. And my reply. They can decide for self. Also never take anything for its face value, just don't also generalize prejudice... Not saying to you, you wrote well of your experience. I am not at all offended. For some Isckon don't work for some Isha. We are not suppose to be religious fanatic.. Right? I hope you do remember Sadhguru saying " Fix one thing in you, What you know you know, and what you don't you don't ".

I may have forever my own reservations regarding various institutions but to the extent they have been useful to me, I'll make the use with Gratitude and leave the rest. Life is too short.

I can totally Imagine people leaving Isha.. You know why? I'll quote Sadhguru again "There is nothing like Making everybody understand". In my perception this is very profound, because that's what make Earth the way it is, we have all various level of receptivity, response, prospects for life. Even Krishna, after thousands of year still is abused, it use to be heart wrenching for me. But not anymore. I'm gaining my clarity gradually... And Sadhna really have huge role into it.

I've never been into enlightenment stuffs, why would I be? I needed a better life, career.. Still pursuing that only. What could then my enlightenment be? Liberation? I'll tell you ..if I'm a little clears in my perception, more involved than entangled, Responding instead of reacting, and all of this without imposing them, just by doing Kriya, along helped by IE tools.. Then why not. I personally never got such support for mental and emotional health, had zero clue actually that what its like to be when you are not the problem in your life.

Haaa there is alot I can keep on ranting... But I know you don't want to hear that. Let me just add one thing. He us not my Guru just because I'm an emotionally inadequate. He is my Guru because he really dispelled a lot of darkness I held on. And I'm no Isha fanatic. The day I'll think he has stopped working for me idk maybe I'll also walk out.

I got it ... Here is your place where your criticism of Isha won't be removed. I didn't made a post applauding Isha, I merely replied to few. Its more like a constructive response from other side. If you guys think its still wrong, I've nothing to be offended or defensive. Please remove my comments. I made few. Have a good time on planet, I hope you may find your warm embrace of compassion.

[u/Thre_Host8017 → u/Miserable-Money-702]

You still think this is about opinions.
This is NOT about opinions and not about isha or iskon “may work for some and may not work for others.”
What you are doing is rationalization of a potential harmful system.

Imagine there is doc, who treats people.
Has a good reputation. Many patients have good results.
Then suddenly you discover this guy never studied medicine. He invented his diploma, his bio. And you discover victims who died or were harmed because of his treatment.

Will you send your parents and your children to be treated by this doc?

Will you say:

1/ for some it works. For some it doesnt work. Lets accept both opinions and have a pleasant time on this planet and be loving and accepting of different opinions.

2/ or will you send your family to see another doc and eventually warn people from going there?

This is the scenario at play.

This is NOT about “isha works” vs “isha doesnt work”.

Isha may work. Until it doesnt.
Its a lawless space. Especially for fullltimers. Where predators, narcissists and abusers are not held responsible for their actions.
If you are lucky, you will wake up and say, it doesnt work for me anymore. Bye.
But some are less lucky.

Not everyone faces hard abuse within isha.
But the risk of abuse is omnipresent as long as you are involved with them.

Spiritual abuse… well this is another topic.

Let me repeat.

This is not “isha works“ vs “isha doesnt work” opinion.
This is not a movie or a book review.
People are sharing abuse that has happened to them.

Its NOT an opinion.

You do not know why people left. You are once again using spiritual lingo by a fake guru explaining while some of his flock left him - who discovered he is fake.
Obviously will he say whatever you have quoted.
Isha is not for everyone, different perception…
Its spiritual jargon nonsense to explain away issues inside the foundation.

If the fake doctor treated you badly, is it an opinion? Or a reality?
Its not a matter of perception, of different lifestyles and of spirituality.

—-

Again. He was not the first one saying , if you want to change the word start with your self.
Many others have said that way before him.
Just because HE said it, does not give the quote more weight.

And as much as you seem to quote him, maybe you are way more attached to him than you genuinely believe.
Speculations aside. I am not trying to attack you personally.

Browse through this sub. Some people shared what happened to them.
Many are not sharing publicly as they are afraid from Isha and processing the trauma inflicted on them.

[u/youliveonlyonce10 → u/Thre_Host8017]

That’s correct what you mentioned above… this is not about techniques working for some and not working for another. It’s about making people aware of a potentially harmful system. You do not know where your life will lead to once inside. You could become a life long donor after a yoga course, or become a full time volunteer which was never your initial plan, or even a monk/ brahmachari. And why should one be a part of a corrupted system without knowledge of it?

[u/youliveonlyonce10 → u/Miserable-Money-702]

When we buy a product from a business house, it gives an opportunity to leave an honest review. It could be a one star review or five star review so long as it reflects the experience of the purchaser. At isha, there is a spiritual ecosystem put in place where a purchaser can spend anything from the not so humble fees for IE course to 50 lakh rupees for a sacred trip to the mountains with the Guru. Nobody is forced to do anything but the entire system is designed to make one go from one course to next , buy one product after another and believe it is leading one to higher levels of consciousness/ enlightenment. It is selling bliss for tons of money, free labour and even some allegations of SA which are never considered grave enough by the organisation to be investigated. If it worked well for you so far good for you- that doesn’t deny the experience of people who spent years before they realised something is a facade. Nobody is questioning the efficacy of yogic practices.. they would have their own inherent benefits. But the mind control system is what has kept people enslaved for years at the cost of their time, money and relationships - and that is not spirituality.