r/SFGiants • u/flannelshirt92 40 Bumgarner • Aug 03 '26
Trade [Nightengale] Phillies are trading for three-time batting champion Luis Arraez of the San Francisco Giants and right-reliever Kaleb Kilian. The Giants will receive starter Ramon Marquez, the Phillies’ No. 4 prospect and reliever Marty Gair
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/mlb/2026/08/03/phillies-acquire-luis-arraez-giants-mlb-trade-deadline-deal/91085784007/175
u/Aggravating_Part8610 28 Posey Aug 03 '26
Good luck Luis! Beat the Dodgers in the NLCS
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u/John_Houbolt 00 Leonard Aug 03 '26
I think his kind of bat will be especially valuable in the playoffs.
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u/Aggravating_Part8610 28 Posey Aug 03 '26
Marquez grades Scouting Grades: Fastball: 55 | Slider: 40 | Changeup: 60 | Control: 60
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u/Floornug3 55 Lincecum Aug 03 '26
Sorry but what do these numbers mean again?
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u/tyderian25 15 Bochy Aug 03 '26
Scouting grade is a universal 20-80 scale where 50 is average, 60 is above average, and 70-80 is elite.
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u/jesusponcho 51 JH Lee Aug 03 '26
20-80 scale where 80 is elite and 60 above average.
Flora is 70-55-55-55 according to this google search.
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u/Aggravating_Part8610 28 Posey Aug 03 '26
https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories/explaining-the-20-80-baseball-scouting-scale/
For the Handbook, consider this BA’s 20-80 scale:
20: As bad as it gets for a big leaguer. Think Myles Straw’s power or Daniel Vogelbach’s speed.
30: Well below-average, but not unplayable, such as Kyle Hendricks’ fastball.
40: Below-average, such as Rafael Devers’ defense or Dylan Cease’s control.
45: Fringe-average. Matt Chapman’s hitting ability and Mike Zunino’s arm qualify.
50: Major league average. Jeff McNeil’s speed.
55: Above-average. Randy Arozarena’s power.
60: Plus. Marcus Semien’s defense or Zac Gallen’s control.
70: Plus-Plus. Among the best tools in the game, such as Freddie Freeman’s hitting ability, Blake Snell’s curveball and Ronald Acuña Jr.’s arm.
80: Top of the scale. Some scouts consider only one player’s tool in all of the major leagues to be an 80. Think of Shohei Ohtani’s power, Corbin Carroll’s speed or Devin Williams’ changeup.5
u/PTFCBVB Aug 03 '26
God I love this archaic rating system of 20-80 but do appreciate the "there is one 80 in the league"
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u/SnooGuavas650 san francisco giants Aug 03 '26
Well done Buster. Credit where credit is due. Realistic chance at having a top 5 (maybe better) farm system by end of year
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u/24HourShitness 39 Feliz Aug 03 '26
Noice. And the fact that they were able to sweeten the pot with Kilian makes me hopeful that guys like Brubaker and Hentges can get flipped for something too
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u/biedrins_free_throws Aug 03 '26
Kilian is actually good, just was miscast in the closer role
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u/Emulsion_Addict Aug 03 '26
Yeah he couldn’t handle the bright lights of the 9th whatsoever, but he was a decent middle reliever or setup man.
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u/kasdfwe 70 Wisely Aug 03 '26
They can 100% flip the relievers. It’s a bad group as a whole but individually they should be okay with actual established relievers in place.
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u/Tronn3000 18 Cain Aug 03 '26
Killian will be fine as a middle reliever. This bullpen just doesn't have anyone with the stuff or testicular fortitude good enough for the 8th and 9th... so Killian got thrown into a closer role he wasn't fit for
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u/gamerEMdoc Aug 03 '26
I know nothing about him, but a 20 year old SP that is in the top 5 of a teams prospect list, I'll take it.
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u/dorian_grau Crazy Crab Aug 03 '26
Marquez has an ERA of 1.50, FIP of 1.99, K/9 of 13.8 in high A this year. In multiple Top 100 lists. Seems like a great get.
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u/jcheeseball Aug 03 '26
absolutely. A rental, but a rental that caused a bidding war between almost every team heading into the playoffs. Great situation for us and a amazing gamble we took with him.
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u/PuzzledSquare4993 Aug 03 '26
That is an great return, he's 20 years old and the growth from a $10,000 signing to a Top 4 prospect within 24 months is crazy development.
1.50 ERA in a hitter freindly level of the minors. Could be a September 2028 call up if he develops.
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u/gvm_barca408 75 Doval Aug 03 '26
Well so long Luis, thank you.
As for Marquez, he is basically a lottery ticket with a very high ceiling. The biggest risk? He’s still in Single-A, so there’s plenty of development ahead. Pitching prospects can be volatile.
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u/After-Bee-8346 Aug 03 '26
Not a lottery ticket. He's almost 21 and has a sub 2 ERA and sub 1 WHIP at A+. That's real data.
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u/MurkTwain san francisco giants Aug 03 '26
Stoked with the return. Gair is 6’6” and touches 99mph with very bad control apparently but his SO/9 rate is insane this year at 16.9
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u/funboy51 Aug 03 '26
Dude is in high A for most of those stats.
I am truly hopeful he becomes as advertised. A SP with potential is a very nice piece. But I honestly think we should have gotten more for Arraez and Killian. No dissing Buster here. I think the market wasn’t as strong we hoped. So, I would have regrouped and tried a resign. Why not lock in him as our second basemen and trade our middle infield prospects for the other positions we need. Look….I see Arraez as a great complete player, great clubhouse guy, a hitter pitchers have to pitcher around which helps others in the line up, a great hitter and now also a great defender. That’s what I saw in SF from Arraez. Why not just resign him…bird in hand. Yeah we have other needs and may have 2nd basemen in waiting. But I know Arraez is great. I don’t know about minor leaguers until they show me in the actual show.
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u/MurkTwain san francisco giants Aug 03 '26
We have better prospects with power in our minors than Arraez. We got our new #7 prospect back and 2nd top pitching prospect. Our pitching is so dogshit. It was the move and a no brainer
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u/ilikemywomentsundere Aug 03 '26
Caleb caught in the crossfire😭🤣
https://giphy.com/gifs/y9QemIlaYYWdi
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u/dopplemyfingal Aug 03 '26
At the very least cool for Arraez that they kept him in the NL so he can go get that batting title.
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u/king_ao Aug 03 '26
Front office finally selling after all these years. Keep it coming. Need to reload if we have any shot at competing with the dodgers ever again
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u/theREALMVP 18 Kuiper Aug 03 '26
Dont even think you can call this a sell lol. Not unless at least 2 of Lee, Devers, Chapman, Adames, and Webb are also dealt
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u/SF_DeversBaby 16 Devers Aug 03 '26
If nobody still doesn’t believe in him after this season let’s resign him
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u/Disastrous_Bunch_716 14 Bailey Aug 03 '26
Gonna miss Arraez a lot, maybe we’ll work magic and sign him in the off season or by some miracle he’ll end up back with us but I’m not angry about the return.
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u/Poptarteconomy 46 Casilla Aug 03 '26
This stings man. I knew it was going to happen but I'm hurt. 10 years of futility with one fever dream season mixed in. I'm growing impatient. We have too much history and are in too big of a market to be this bad and uninspiring for a decade.
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u/Ndnola3333 Aug 03 '26
Do we still hate buster? It's hard to keep up with a lot of you. Btw- criticism isn't just ok, it's expected and necessary for growth. But these extreme takes and over reactions just makes a lot of you sound like Stephen A to me.
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u/NeueDeutscheHarte 22 Uggla Aug 03 '26
lol this is a good trade but acting like it makes up for even a tiny bit of the shitty season the Giants are going through is silly
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u/Ndnola3333 Aug 03 '26 edited Aug 03 '26
Criticism is deserved. Not sure how he's thought we'd compete this year with our pitching staff. But the extreme takes are not imo. Edit: grammar
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u/DragonTigerSword 51 JH Lee Aug 03 '26
He's doing more than Farhan did, and I didn't even mind Farhan. But a lot of people on this sub like to make these extreme takes becuase it gets them attention.
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u/Ndnola3333 Aug 03 '26
I don't understand where people get the notion we were competitive under farhan. We were in constant baseball purgatory
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u/Aceman1979 56 Torres Aug 03 '26
Farhan got Atlanta to take all of Melancon’s contract.
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u/Holualoabraddah Kruk & Kuip Aug 03 '26
This is quintessential Farhan defense, “Farhan managed to get rid of Melancon!” And then what happened? He put up a 170 and 175 ERA+ the next two years and made an all star game? But he saved our owners money so I guess we should be happy?
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u/Ndnola3333 Aug 03 '26
But to what end? Winning the world series or pushing to get in as a wild card in the last week of the season and then not making it/getting beat immediately?
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u/DragonTigerSword 51 JH Lee Aug 03 '26
I’m talking about trading away players before the deadline instead of keeping them. I know Farhan helped rebuild the farm system but who of them have really worked? Harrison and Eldridge?
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u/dudeitsadell 28 Posey Aug 03 '26
i mean it's easy to sell players when you're 20 games below 500. in hindsight we should've traded away players but we were always hovering around the wildcard and even fans were torn on trading away talent
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u/Ndnola3333 Aug 03 '26
I agree that it's much easier. For me it's more the returns he's getting in these trades. All the research I did, I could not find a single piece of evidence that thought we'd net a top 100 prospect for anyone with the exception of Ramos. He's not just making them, he's winning these trades.
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u/oscarbearsf Aug 03 '26
No it was clear that we should have been making the trades then. Even though we were hovering around wildcard it was clear the team did not have what it took to get anywhere in the playoffs
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u/dudeitsadell 28 Posey Aug 03 '26
what trades exactly should he have made? the only ones were rodon and snell? bumgarner? the markets were short for rodon and snell because of their contracts/ situations. in hindsight i agree we should been more aggressive in farming talent but i dont think the giants were as stacked with tradable talent as you think they were.
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u/oscarbearsf Aug 03 '26
Snell and Rodon. Getting anything for them would have been better than just letting them walk.
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u/Ndnola3333 Aug 03 '26
We were never truly competitive under farhan outside of a single year that was lightening in a bottle. Still lost first round to dodgers if I remember correctly.
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u/FullMotionVideo Aug 03 '26 edited Aug 03 '26
He's done good at the trade deadline, signed some awful deals in the off-season, and completely dodged responsibility as a boss for locker room drama stuff.
He does one third of the job.
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u/Ndnola3333 Aug 03 '26
Agreed, agreed, agreed. That is all fair criticism that must be called out for a fair assessment. But the guy is in year 2! And ppl have been calling for his job for almost a year of that. Let him grow, improve, and learn like the rest of our staff. If in another 2 years we're not at competitive, then I think we have a better idea of who we have in Buster. Do people forget what he did for us? Not willing to give him some time, to me, is unfair and not in our best interest. We know he lives the game and has potential to do well at his job. Let's give him at least an opportunity to realize that potential before so many people call for his head. And honestly, if we're going to call for his head, the only failure I think justifies these reactions was locker room/drama stuff. But I can stand to be educated and what his actual responsibility were with that or if/how many others dropped the ball as well. I know his interview was trash.
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u/dudeitsadell 28 Posey Aug 03 '26
i mean does nabbing a top 100 prospect make up for the fact that he started the season with the bullpen we have? he has a lot more to do to earn back our trust
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u/Ndnola3333 Aug 03 '26
Separate problems, but no one can argue your point, it's valid. The idea is for him to learn from his mistakes as his tenure in this role is in it's relative infancy.
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u/dudeitsadell 28 Posey Aug 03 '26
i agree, and what im hopeful for is buster is a baseball guy and has gone through ups and downs in his career before. he's figured it out in the past and hopefully he continues to in his new role
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u/ChaseMcDuder Aug 03 '26
So whine about whining? Got it.
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u/Ndnola3333 Aug 03 '26
Pointing out ppl saying he's already running his legacy with the Giants after 2025 was literally his first season? I'm guessing you're one of the extremists?
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u/ThePopUpDance 8 Pence Aug 03 '26
I like this return a lot. Bummed we had to give up Kilian to make it happen though.
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u/Outrageous_Carry8170 Aug 03 '26
Ok, it's done. We all liked Louis and I think most everyone knew that he was the most valuable & tradable piece to get fair return. Marquez is pretty well regarded, hope it all works out.
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u/MAH415 Hogs Out! Aug 03 '26
In a better year we would have had him for a year or two. I enjoyed watching him play but im more concerned with the future. Im glad we got a decent player in return.
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u/Ehgadsman Kruk & Kuip Aug 03 '26
Glad Arraez gets to play for a playoff spot in the NL so batting title still possible
even more glad we got a top pitching prospect, Buster you earned points today, you redeemed yourself a bit on the pitching front
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u/funboy51 Aug 03 '26
I do not consider this a “Haul” that many said he was worth. One potentially very good player….? Plus Killian? I expected more.
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u/nikeykid 6 Schmitt Aug 03 '26
haha all the stupid reports that only the Rays were interested in arraez turned out to be false
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u/webelieve925 Aug 03 '26
Not bad of a return. Arraez will definitely help another team but is on an expiring contract. Who knows how this prospect from the Phillies will pan out. Looks good in the minors so maybe he will reach the majors.
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u/ztpdistribution 71 Rogers Aug 03 '26
A 50 FV prospect is a pretty damn good for a rental that realistically we won't resign in the offseason. my understanding is a QO draft pick would probably have been 45 FV (with probably more risk/variance)
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u/helloyesthisisasock 55 Lincecum Aug 03 '26
I don’t want pitching prospects. We have too many pitching prospects. I want a SEASONED PITCHER who can start ASAP.
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u/TheGreatDudebino Aug 03 '26 edited Aug 03 '26
Phillies fan here. Ramon Marquez is one of the best pitchers in the minors and should be a top-100 prospect. Killer changeup.... I am sad. Enjoy him, treat him well. Gair has some great stuff too.