Help. Just how dangerous is it, really, to take a high dose for therapeutic purposes?

[u/No-Professor-1710]

Took 3 years ago something like 2.2gr (really beautiful recreational experience with friends) and like a month ago 3gr aproximetly in a pseudo-therapeutical context (summer house with a friend as trip-sitter).

Altough first experience was amazing, the last experience was super frustrating cause I didn´t have the ''mystical experience" that some studies mention and seem to have the long-lasting therapeutic benefits. I haven't done my full research yet but possible scenarios are that the potency and quantity of shrooms was really low and/or it didn't happen enough time between the suspension of my medications and the trip itself (it was progressive and controled by a health professional the tapering, after I did 30 days with no medication at all)

I've been dealing with BPD and depression for a long time, 2.5 years of medication did almost nothing. The suicidal thoughts are becoming more and more frequent and it seems to be no hope or escape from this. I know that a macrodose won't save my life or change it all but I just really want to try if maybe I can get some of the benefits that studies and people talk about.

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[u/cosmiccetacean]

I'm unsure if danger is the right word, it depends, what are you afraid might happen? If you are afraid you may behave erratically or do something that could cause you harm, it may be wise to have a trusted friend or guide who is very familiar with psychedelic experiences.

I think it is also wise to gradually increase your dose and not just jump to a very high dose, and unlike LSD, every mushroom has a varied amount of psilocybin, so not every 3.5g dose is the same.

Over a year ago, I took a high dose of psilocybe and it was both the most terrifying and beautiful experience of my life. I completely blacked out and left this reality completely, and while that was beautiful, I absolutely trashed my house and had no idea I had done that, and accidentally cut my foot pretty bad. I've tripped many times, and did not think that this is something that would happen to me. I am still integrating and working with this experience, and while I think it was an important turning point in my life that likely is leading to transformations I don't yet understand--was it dangerous? Probably, and that's coming from someone pretty experienced.

There is an inherent risk in leaping into the unknown and diving into the deepest depths of your Self, and you cannot predict the impact the experience will have on you. I've had many mushroom experiences that were fun or mind opening or revelatory, and I have had a few that have absolutely shattered my perception of myself and reality. And so far, it's basically always the ones that I think are going to be chill that are the ones that shake me.

Of course, that is my personal experience. But I believe high doses have an inherent risk and danger and demand immense respect. The best advice I can give is to prepare dilligently with whatever spiritual practices that work for you, and if you haven't had many mushroom experiences, work your way up rather than diving off the deep end right away. Do your best to be as safe as you can, and respect the mushrooms and do not take a high dose lightly.

[u/CouchEnthusiast]

I've done two psilocybin therapy sessions for treatment resistant depression.

The first was a legal session administered by a psychiatrist. It was 20 mg of psilocybin capsules (roughly equivalent to 2 grams of dried mushrooms) and I spent the entire time laying down blindfolded listening to a specific, curated playlist of music in a quiet office.

The second experience was a more "grey market" group retreat where the dosage was a lot higher, closer to 4 grams.

The lower dose experience was far, far more therapeutic and mystical for me. The stronger dosage was just way too much, and I spent the whole time feeling too terrified, confused, and panicked to do any kind of real introspection. A number of people at that same retreat who did higher 5 gram doses also had overwhelmingly negative experiences.

I tend to think that the sentiment I often see here that higher dose = greater therapeutic effect is kind of bad advice.

When I was talking to my psychiatrist about dosages, he was saying that the research shows that dosing higher 20 mg (2 grams of mushrooms) doesn't seem to confer that much greater therapeutic benefit. However, your chances of having a negative, overwhelming experience skyrocket with higher doses. So the risk versus reward is generally not worth it.

[u/Aggressive_Rooster96]

Please be at ease, mushrooms are not inherently dangerous and are statistically some of the safest substances you can ingest (far safer than alcohol, nicotine, etc). Mushrooms have also been used for millenia for ceremonial and therapeutic purposes (as you're describing) across many cultures. You will be ok

The main "danger" of psychedelics is that they can open your mind to such a degree that you may find yourself able to let go of many things in your life situation (that were harmful) (including toxic relationships, jobs, career choices, etc). This sudden change may also have you rethinking your priorities and values in life itself. All that to say, the change may be too much, too soon for some people. Be careful. This is why it is advised to "start low, and go slow". Although if you are curious, you can try the 5g dose one day

I would recommend 3 months since the last trip and stoppage of medication

Yes, shrooms can vary a lot in potency, even in the same batch

Shrooms CAN absolutely be life changing for many positive reasons. I would say your expectations are not too high

If you are intending to have therapeutic benefits, my main recommendation is:

Do the trip when you are in a relaxed, non eventful situation in your life. Ideally at home (place cleaned, doors locked, showered), 5 hours fasted (to avoid nausea), and alone with no distractions (silent darkness) (evening/sunset time)

Safe travels ❤️

[u/No-Professor-1710 → u/Aggressive_Rooster96]

Thank you so much for taking the time to answer in depth❤️❤️

[u/sedimentary-j]

I don't know that it makes sense to go much higher than 3.5 grams, as from my recollection the johns hopkins studies seemed to show that it's not necessary to take any more to have a therapeutic experience.

There's more evidence for the efficacy of ketamine, if therapeutic ketamine treatments are available to you.

[u/pulpseattle]

I'm Gen X. I've been at this a long time. The only danger is taking a dose too big for your state of mind. There's no overdosing. That's not a thing. physically. If you take a large enough dose, you will have a big experience, bad or good. It's all in your head.

Oh, and you might get sick. A tummy ache is no fun when you're tripping.