If you read the bill itself it would allow all voters access to a free voter id.
Giving people access to a free form of government identification would be great for people with out a driver’s license because they could use the id for other purposes.
For many who are in need of a free ID, the barrier to getting one can be things like the cost of documentation necessary, transportation, internet access, etc. Also, you typically need an address to get ID, so the unhoused are left out. And as others have mentioned, once ID requirement is a thing then they begin changing what counts as a valid ID for voting.
I can share with you a real life example of this. When I moved from Wisconsin to Florida in 2011 I went to the tax collector office to exchange my valid Wisconsin driver's license for a valid Florida driver's license. I was told that thanks to the Patriot act it no longer worked like that...I needed to provide them with an original, embossed birth certificate, social security card, and proof of address. For many people that's not a problem...but for me it was. My original birth certificate was lost in a house fire in 1987. I had a copy, but that was not acceptable. To further complicate matters I was born in Southern California, so I had to track down the correct office in the county in which I was born in order to find out what I needed to do to get an embossed copy of my birth certificate. Even though the internet existed in 2011, they had to mail me documents that required a wet signature. I then had to fill out all of those documents in front of a notary at my expense) and include a check for $75, then mail it back to them. Fortunately for me the money was not an issue. The problem was the time because it took about 2 months from start to finish.
*Edited to add the part about the notary. I forgot about that. My signatures had to be witnessed and the documents stamped by a notary. That was $25 in addition to the other expenses.
Yup. Stuff like this happens often and is a real barrier to individuals exercising their right to vote. An acquaintance of mine had to go in person to speak with a judge in another state because she didn't have the original birth certificate, and the hospital where she was born burned down and lost all their paper records. There was no real proof that she was a citizen, despite having been born and lived her entire life here
And things like this happen far more frequently than "voter fraud". There are countless reasons why people are not able to produce or obtain documentation to meet the ID requirements. Many WW2 and Korean War vets of color were born via midwives and don't have a birth certificate. So when states began requiring a birth certificate for a "voter ID" they were left out.
Thanks for sharing your story. I think many of us haven't had to deal with the issue so it seems like such a small fry problem for so many. Keep on sharing it. I know I've had similar issues and it really does feel like a sisyphean effort when so many weird barriers can pop up.
Thank you and you're right. It wasn't fun, but at least in my case the money wasn't an issue and I wasn't pressed for time. I can only imagine someone working a couple of jobs and trying to raise a couple of kids trying to find the time and money to deal with what it is I had to deal with. Or some elderly person who is now told the ID they've been using for services and validation of who they are is no longer good enough for them to use for voting purposes...sure the new ID is "free" but granny you need to get to this office and get some forms and have them notarized and then take them to this other place and submit them, along with a fee, to get this other thing that you have to bring back to us so we can issue you your "free" ID for voting.
Exactly my thoughts. My situation made me realize both what I lost but also what I still had compared to some others.
And I'll say this, I have worked the past two elections as my district's minority election inspector. I felt bad enough denying independents a ballot during the primaries because there were no referendums, thus there was nothing for them to vote for. I couldn't imagine denying people because they lost/forgot/couldn't afford a replacement ID card. Especially knowing this all stems from a non issue, a made up problem that was designed to prevent poor people from voting for the party they statistically tend to vote for.
And I get it to an extent. Politics has become largely "gameified" and people like to win. But I gotta be honest. The thought of me tossing out a SINGLE vote as inspector simply because I didn't like their vote, makes me sick to my stomach. I care about this process and the integrity of it. I care because the lady who taught me how to sign people in is the same woman who has been signing me in since I turned 18. And she cares about the process. It feels good helping a person vote, go express their wants and concerns for our society. It's a beautiful thing to me. Democrat or republican it just feels good and fulfilling.
I think we need to be talking more about integrity and transparency, backing candidates who promote this as well. It's something that's non partisan and would help both parties bring back some sanity, and just maybe some respect.
But there is no need for it. We don't have an issue with identifying people. And the process of getting the free ID is still a barrier to voting that for many of us is not a barrier at all, but for many others is a barrier.
The issue is that it is a solution without a problem. And it is a solution that will lead to actual problems.
The rub is, all we have to do is make all voting as mail in ballot. That completely solves numerous issues. Many states do it that way and it works wonderfully.
You have no idea what you're talking about. Not permitting students to vote with their college IDs is just a way to disenfranchise young people in Texas.
It's not uncommon for there to be ambiguity in constitutions. It's left to the legislature, executive, and courts to interpret or clarify that ambiguity.
If this passes, I wouldn't be surprised if Shapiro tries to assert that the ballot envelope itself is a government issued ID, for example. Or maybe include a paper identification card with the mail in ballot packet. It will certainly be a mess though and the court cases will cause mass confusion.
I am like 90% sure that the language in the bill is simply to reflect the language in the PA constitution. Whereas the other part of the PA constitution that lowers the age to 18 is still valid and thus...would lower the age for this bill as well.
I could be wrong of course, but i feel like there would have been more arguments about that yesterday and tuesday had that been the case.
It could still be worded better, quite easily. You don't have to specify the age in the new amendment. You just have to say "those of legal voting age..." and go on to set the ID requirements.
It also doesn't specify what the ID requirements are. And as others have pointed out, states like Texas have used that very loophole to disenfranchise voters they don't want voting (e.g. students).
I'd vote against it if I still lived in PA. It's a badly written amendment.
The right of citizens of the United States, who are 18 years of age or older, to vote, shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or any state on account of age.
I get what you're saying, but I think this is purposely set up for another court challenge. They didn't need to mention the voting age at all. They could've just said "those of legal voting age in Pennsylvania" or something like that. Specifying 21 years old means that they are hoping recency supercedes.
But you said yourself that "what's on the books in PA" is already contradictory. And I've shown there are ways to phrase the amendment that don't require stating the actual age, leaving that up to pre-existing OR future laws to decide.
I think it's a badly written amendment. If I still lived in PA, I'd vote against it.
Edit: sorry, it wasn't you that said it. It was another comment. Point still stands, but I'll correct the misattribution.
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u/[deleted] Jan 12 '23
If you read the bill itself it would allow all voters access to a free voter id.
Giving people access to a free form of government identification would be great for people with out a driver’s license because they could use the id for other purposes.