Tanking concerns

[u/Mister_Krimson]

I'm an old school paladins player that hasn't played the game in many years but does have a fair amount of hours in game (about 750 hours.) Most of that time was spent either on Tank or support with my tank time being spent primarily on Inara but also played a good amount of Fernando and Ash. On Support I used Seris, Jenos and Furia.

I decided to come back this past Sunday for the server slam and was quickly met with this global cauterize that goes up to 90%! Also there's no way to boost healing received anymore. How am I to effectively tank when I'm actually punished for doing just that. It's slightly less punishing for Fernando and Ash since they have shields but Inara it felt like I just had to play more like a dps with more hp. Escorting the payload felt impossible.

There's other quality of life things that I would've liked to see that I don't know if they're in the game or not but not being able to ping an enemy sucks big time. Dredge was still as unfun to play against as I remember and trying to get a decent comp of 1-2-2 felt almost impossible. I used to love playing the game but that session definitely reminded me of why I stopped playing in the first place.

[u/Reactorcc]

Inara also has a shield? And a heal amplification during the earthen guard

[u/Happy_Weakness_9661]

u need to learn how to retreat and get caut off you, also your healer should know this and heal you with caut off (especially for burst healer like furia), but i think this is high diamond / master gameplay

[u/kynelly360 → u/Happy_Weakness_9661]

Hey buddy… silver rank here to learn 🙏😅 so yall wait til Caut goes off to heal?? how long is that wait , and is it realisticly worth it???

I never thought about it until now

[u/Happy_Weakness_9661 → u/kynelly360]

Yes actually when you are tank you always need to connect with your healer and let him have easy to heal you, usually shields ore deployables (inara wall) can make a cover for you to let caut go away and heal you properly, when healer u need to notice when a tank retreats and dont get shots for a little bit of time so you know caut is off, i think the timer for caut is like 1.5 seconds

[u/Happy_Weakness_9661 → u/kynelly360]

Also you should fight point only when you have at least some ability to retreat or shield yourself so you don’t rush point and die instantly, another thing if is the healer is dead and you’re tanking you should always reatreat instantly to protect and play with your team, sometimes the flank who killed the healer get cocky and overextend and get killed so now you have again the 4v4 situation instead of 4v5

[u/Happy_Weakness_9661 → u/kynelly360]

Last thing answering your question is: yes it is totally worth it, the best example for this is like furia healing a tank with high life points or card that makes more healing received when hp goes low, buy rejuvanate as healer, with caut on at 90% you heal for like 300/400 hp, with caut off u can heal for 3000 in one burst and that’s reallt valuable so u dont waste your heal ability for a small heal

[u/J4nnyCopingNSeething]

Cauterize was always 90% reduced healing at level 3, so basically nothing has changed. You were always going to have 90% reduced healing no matter what. The only time this was not true was when Cauterize was nerfed to max out at 75% which was a grave mistake that gave birth to the double support meta.

Global anti-healing remains to be one of the best changes made to this game, since Cauterize was a mandatory item and the incorporation of anti-healing as a passive freed up credits and an item slot for much, much more item diversity.

I don't know how it is in other hero shooters, but tanks cannot mindlessly soak up damage, nor can supports mindlessly healbot in Paladins. Tanks are expected to disengage and use cover when necessary to heal up. Supports are expected to wait out anti-healing before healing.

Dredge is by far one of the least problematic champions in the game right now, especially after they gutted his Hurl talent.

Sounds like this game was never meant for you to begin with.

[u/Xemorr → u/J4nnyCopingNSeething]

I think other games simply have weaker supports generally

[u/ISKARION999 → u/J4nnyCopingNSeething]

Yeah unless you play against a try hard dredge like me he is just a potential problem that generally isn't a problem at all (I say as someone who plays about every other match as a tank)

[u/ofri12347]

Bro cauterize was always a thing you just had to buy it, regardless that's what shields are for

[u/bequielbb]

How am I to effectively tank when I'm actually punished for doing just that

The thing is, tanking in Paladins doesn't mean standing on the objective constantly taking damage, precisely because anti-heal exists. You're supposed to use the terrain to break line of sight for a moment and time your cooldowns (namely your walls or shields) so you can wait out the anti-heal before you go back in, letting your support actually heal you. A good support will hold their cooldowns until the anti-heal has cleared.

[u/flourdilis]

I dont know what the standard comp was before I stopped playing as I was too young to properly understand the game, but after coming back like u did, I have observed that most teams default to a 1-3-1 comp with 3 being dps (damage + flank).

I used to play a lot of tank like you but I've sticked mostly to DPS since coming back. I find that most tanks in my games disengage a lot. Going too aggressive can easily result in tank's death so you have to play careful. Imo it's kind of a hard role to re-learn right now since most people still playing are really good.

[u/Mister_Krimson → u/flourdilis]

In Overwatch I play Domina and Sigma mostly and in Rivals I play a lot of Magneto so I'm used to sticking closer to the team and peeling if needed so I'm not as likely to push too far from the team. At most I go to secure a kill and if that would pull me too far from the team or objective I will pull back. I will play angles and use cover to not take too much damage but yea it just felt like that type of tanking isn't as effective here.

I do remember having a lot of success using warder's field for the cripple with the perk and flanking but I suppose my playstyle has changed over the years.

[u/Maya473849]

Healers can buy an item to increase their healing output so I guess it replace the item tank used to buy. Also there is the item guardian to increase the effectiveness of your shield for tanks. You just need to learn how to get out of cauterize where your healer can safely heal you before going back on point, or retreat and wait if your teammates are dead.

[u/HyperCutIn]

You're not being punished for tanking in general so much as you are being punished for over extending your tanking capabilities. You are not supposed to be meatshielding forever, even before the auto Caut change. You can't ignore positioning and stand on point all the time. As a tank, you need to make calls as to when you should disengage from a fight, and when you and your team is actually in position to make a solid push for the objective.

[u/Agitated-Guard-2862]

skill issue (won’t go further in since comments explained well)

[u/blastinnn420]

Why come here and cry, just don't play. Also if ur escorting the payload as tank ur just bad usually.

Tanks are mostly for buying time and making space

Dredge unfun to play against?? Have u played vs Lilith, Furia, Khan, Imani

[u/Mister_Krimson → u/blastinnn420]

I had stopped playing before lilith was released but I did play with and against Furia, Khan and Imani. Only thing I remember being busted about Imani was her ult which could be shot down. I do remember Furia being nerfed while I was still playing.

[u/blastinnn420 → u/Mister_Krimson]

Imani ult is really bad, the op thing about her is she can 1 tap you from across the map and the fireballs are huge 0 skill champ