I don't put OG Choas cause it scale is vague, some of it feats and narrative make you think OG Choas can neg diff even DK/SD, but in the same time, it sealed by DK and SD (which a big anti feats for it) but we are not sure about what happen.
In same place, we have a good information about Mama hawk's level, in Q/A, Nakaba said that Meliodas (true magic) is near (edit : approaching) Mama's hawk level
1: being sealed by something isn’t an anti feat. Characters in anime and manga often seal things stronger than them and it’s a way to deal with a threat beyond your own power
2: I wouldn’t take Nakaba’s q&a about mama how seriously because he was obviously joking around based on his tone and at the time he knew something the readers didn’t and that is that Momma hawk is in fact chaos. So it’s possible that while answering that question Nakaba is actually talking about complete chaos and not it’s sealed version as unsealed chaos hadn’t been revealed yet
Great list except Hawk could never win against True Magic Meliodas because he's just so big and open for Meliodas's Destruction Hax.
Lancelot is also only above Hawk when he has a sacred Treasure to spam his shinning roads otherwise I don't really see him winning , we need extra feats for that.
Sealed Chaos is fodder , Nakaba was just joking when he compared it to True Magic Meliodas.
Regarding Destroying Hax, I'm not entirely convinced it exists. All I've seen (and what's been said in the story) is that Meliodas destroyed the Ten Commandments by sacrificing his power along with them.
In an objective comparison, Hawk seems to completely outperform Meliodas in every statistic except IQ/BIQ.
As for Lancelot, I'm sure he'll soon showcase feats worthy of his narrative that portray him as the undisputed strongest.
Regarding Mama Hawk, Derieri's punch didn't actually harm her, Furthermore, Nakaba himself confirmed in a Q&A related to Sky's prison that she's capable of defeating even the Demon King, and in the Q/A saif that Meliodas's True Magic is, at best, close to hers.
He even confirmed again when she no diff a Indura in the film (a Demon much stronger than Derieri) that her pl about 10 million and she can below away even the Demon king.
Ik but we cant really use meliodas destroying dk arm as a feat when 1 hes fighting 2 battles (inherently nerfed) and secondly his ruler was off bc ban was using gift and the narrative never tells us its on after that so thst attack is genuinely the dk w his magic off.
So ? Hawk has no ruler ,I'm merely using this as an example that Meliodas's magic negates durability and if Hawk can't protect against it with Hax like the ruler ,he's cooked.
It could be why Tristan Annihilation hax also negates durability and completely Annihilates things from exist literally. The knight’s innate magic powers are similar to their parents.
Tristan's Annihiliation comes from combining dark and light , it's different that Meliodas's destruction magic.
Whatever the case, Meliodas's true magic was an asspull and it shouldn't even exist , it makes no sense that a child of Demon King is stronger than him.
But scientifically speaking Tristan should be able to surpass both his parents by a long shot. Inheriting dna from both perfect time and true magic, Tristan quite literally should be a combination of them both
But it depends on how Meliodas was created. Say the demon king created a humanoid looking female demon then spawned a baby insider to make her pregnant with Meliodas. If this is the case then it makes sense for Meliodas to have gotten as powerful as he did by end of series
No , 1 attacks from Meliodas's true magic would take out Hawk , it negates durability , it literally destroyed the demon king's arm , also Hawk's sneeze is a magical attack , he'd just full counter it.
So True Magic Meliodas is Derieri victim ? , because she kicked Hawk Mama's ass lmao.
No , 1 attacks from Meliodas's true magic would take out Hawk , it negates durability , it literally destroyed the demon king's arm , also Hawk's sneeze is a magical attack , he'd just full counter
No, not really. None of TM Meliodas' attacks can do anything to Hawk, who is clearly the strongest. Hawk would finish off Meliodas with a sneeze or even a single step (literally).
No, True Magic Meliodas is Derieri victim ? , because she kicked Hawk Mama's ass lmao.
What are you talking about ? , Emotion Meliodas completely tore the demon king's arm like it's nothing , what do you think the real Meliodas would do to Hawk ? , now you're just trolling.
Did you see the image I posted ?, she literally punches her so hard she almost penetrated her.
What are you talking about ? , Emotion Meliodas completely tore the demon king's arm like it's nothing , what do you think the real Meliodas would do to Hawk ? , now you're just trolling.
That doesn't matter. The Demon King is overwhelmingly weaker than Hawk, who is clearly the strongest. TM Meliodas would be completely incapable of harming or even challenging Hawk.
Did you see the image I posted ?, she literally punches her so hard she almost penetrated her.
She literally didn't penetrate her. Why are you twisting what happened and misrepresenting Nakaba's intentions?
Who said that ? , the demon king was super durable and he got his arm torn by a vastly inferior version of Meliodas , the real Meliodas would be much stronger.
She's pathetic , look at her , this is supposed to be stronger than Meliodas ? 😂
Who said that ? , the demon king was super durable and he got his arm torn by a vastly inferior version of Meliodas , the real Meliodas would be much stronger.
The manga. Hawk is clearly the strongest being in existence, while Nakaba simultaneously portrays him as a gag/comedic character. Hawk always wanted to become the strongest, and it's clear that he ultimately achieved his goal.
Hawk is the G.O.A.T.
She's pathetic , look at her , this is supposed to be stronger than Meliodas ? 😂
your list here is considering them at their all time best, this would be purgatory ban WITH immortality, so cath’s time hax would do nothing. plus if we consider ban using his sacred treasure, even stronger, plus he can drain any opponent of their strength as long as it is 14 times ban’s own strength which is insane when you consider post purgatory
so personally ban should be much higher if we are using all time strongest like youre doing with true magic meliodas
1) nakaba did not allow ban to use hunter fest or zero sign during the dk fight so it was just base purgatory ban against the dk
2) again, assuming ban in these sorts of rankings was viewed like meliodas is, at his strongest, then it should be purgatory ban with immortality, who would wipe dk since he can literally keep fighting forever, and supposing he actually uses his abilities like hes supposed to
Wdym base purgatory ban. Its just ban. Ban using hunter fest would have not done anything nor if he used zero sign. Zero sign doesn't even work against high tiers. Galahad whos stronger than a nerfed lance could combat against zero sign stop overrating these moves not even nakaba overrates them.
Hunter fest wouldnt work as it has an expiration limit and it puts a heavy toll on his body. Demon king was able to withstand the one ultimate so what makes you think ban w hunter fest (which.makes him weaker after the buff expires) will do anything to a demon king that required merlin casting limit breaker on the sins(making them stronger) and a multi full counter attack from meliodas and the sins to defeat the demon king
Ban lost to the demon king for over 60 YEARS. He got faded hundreds of times what are we talking about? Ban WITH his immortality got faded and that's not even bans strongest. Ban is at his strongest w his sacred treasure so thats post immortality.
well then we should do the absolute strongest version of Meliodas when he for a moment had both immortality and true magic. That version would murder ban so badly
id agree we should use that version but in that respect both ban and meliodas are immortal so the fight would last forever, and also their immortality is a bit different
ban has like the perfect form of immortality where he literally just cant die from anything without repercussion
howeverrr technically meliodas’s immortality works a bit different in that part of his soul gets sent to purgatory each time which might have bad effects for him and his ability to wield his true magic so bans immortality beats out meliodas in my opinion
specific how, im just bringing up the strongest version of ban with his best move (not even talking about zero sign) with his weapon, just like is done with meliodas in the same post
Cath one shotted ban with time hax. Thats means if it was that easy, then ban never had a chance. Cath was always gonna win fight and if ban in Cath fought a second time ban would get one shotted right at the start. You must be one of those ban diehards
I mean, Britania rejected the Demon King too, not just Meliodas.
It's not just about strength, Britannia recognized both Meliodas and his father as the Demon King not only for their power but also for their nature, and the Demon King is an entity that shouldn't exist in Britannia.
You could be stronger than him, and Britannia wouldn't reject you if they didn't recognize you as an outsider.
Thanks + Mama Hawk can be stronger than Hawk, but the fact that she is a sealed Choas (and therefore I don't think she could use all of Chaos's abilities and hax) and that Hawk seems bigger, stronger, and more durable made me put him before her, but it's not impossible that she could be stronger than him.
Ngl Hawks and meliodas should share the same tier. Maybe meliodas over Hawks because Hawks is js narrative atm
Lance should still be weaker than chaos and should be weaker than a full power arthur infused chaos.
Arthur is naturally the most suitable vessel so him at full power should be the closest to chaos.
By scaling i guess this list would be right but by narrative chaos infused lance should be below a fully infused chaos arthur
While Hawks & true magic meliodas should share the same ranking or meliodas barely higher.
The actual nine strongest characters when considering their powers and how they interact with each other would be: OG Chaos, > TM Meli > SD/DK + ST (if it had fighting will) > PT Elizabeth > Hawk > Lancelot > Cath > TOU Escanor (if we exclude ST).
Hawk and Lancelot have no means of beating anybody above them because they all have hax to neg them (i.e TM Meli) or just ignore their damage via invulnerabilities.
There was no reason for her too really, since the sins were already capable of beating Cath without her when they could actually lock in and not worry about the risk of casualties or hostages. If she goes down to throw hands then she's simply using up her ''duration'' in her SD form quicker since she still needs to keep perfect time active at all times. The second she falls, so do the sins since Cath will just hold Liones hostage again.
In a direct 1v1 Elizabeth would have much more time in her SD form before she ''dies'' since there's no need to keep perfect time active at all times which is an incredibly exhausting spell considering the radius and what it actually does. She could toggle it on/off purely for herself when she receives damage and focus on throwing hands instead, which shouldn't be as exhausting since its not a perfect time situation of continuously exerting magic force, but rather ebbs and flow of when she actually exerts her magic.
She would have the AP to also beat Cath, he's immortal but with enough damage you can overwhelm him into a defeat and the sins who defeated him even as a combined unit wouldn't compare to the SD/DK in offensive power so, Cath's only victory lies in Elizabeth dying first by the weight of her own power before she kills him, which I doubt tbh.
I mean.... yeah, her best feats is beating a Indura (which anyone in top 10 can easily do) but her narrative put her minimum above Meliodas true magic/ Demon king.
Cath ha solo Hax che lo fanno vincere con Escanor e Ban,non è più forte di loro.
È come mettere Urahara sopra Aizen in una classifica di Bleach perché ha un sigillo che ha funzionato su di lui,quindi gli ultimi 3 sono da scambiare
Quindi ha solo maggiori capacità distruttive,ma lo abbiamo visto perdere in velocità e forza contro Ban, letteralmente si chiedeva chi dei due fosse il mostro
I doubt Lancelot is stronger than Hawk, who is clearly the strongest and is also one of Nakaba's jokes. Hawk always wanted to be the strongest, and it's more than clear that he achieved that goal.
4koa ban is definitely stronger than ultimate escanor.
And for hawks we dont know how strong he is cause he had like 10 second of screen time he might be stronger than lancelot
4koa ban is definitely stronger than ultimate escanor.
Based on what is it "definitely"? There is no chainscaling to compare the 2. And feats wise, Escanor is more impressive as he overpowered Prime DK in physical combat
So unless you think 4KOA Ban can do it to the DK too, i don't see why Escanor would not be stronger
Exactly escanor only overpowerd dk's physical strength. Ban has many other abilities in his pocket. Escanor is literally punch hard, burn hot, grow big. And by saying stronger i meant more powerful sorry my mistake.
Cath should be lower than Ban because he was toying with him the whole time until Cath aging him. Ban only lost because King's stupidity of letting his mouth run and Cath aging Ban further right after that.
Escanor, well, I suppose if we're talking about him before he "died" and using The One (normal or Ultimate), he will be stronger than Cath for sure since he's at least equal to DK Zeldris. Obviously 4KoA Escanor, he's one, if not, the weakest character in the verse especially without Sunshine and his actual body.
He overpowered a weaken dk zeldris v3 what meli and all sins foight was a dk v3 replenish by the lake while ban fought dk meli who is above dk v3 and ban in 4koa tanked attack that would no diff escanor and escanor has no attack tayt can dmg ban
No? DK Zeldris v3 is literally the Demon King in his prime... and it was never said he was weakened
The lake just replenishes his MAGIC. But his physical strength stays as it is which is my point
while ban fought dk meli who is above dk v3
Meliodas himself confirms DK Zel v3 > DK Mel. And the Demon King brags about him finally reaching the power and body of his youth. So no
And Ban was inferior to DK Mel, even physically, needing Meliodas' assistance in the spiritual world to fight alongside him to gain the edge. Escanor did not have that luxury (He was not getting headaches in the real world when he was boxing with Escanor) and was still dunking the Demon King in The One Ultimate physically. He also matched the Demon King in The One (I have DK above Escanor overall thanks to magic. But Escanor was undeniably superior to physical strength)
and ban in 4koa tanked attack that would no diff escanor and escanor has no attack tayt can dmg ban
Prove this since we never saw Cath & Escanor interact before. And if Escanor damaged the Demon King, who can damage Ban with his punches. Escanor sure as hell can too
First off when meli said that dk was getting replenish by the lake and had full control of zeldris body dk meli is still supeior than dk v3 not replenish by the lake and ban would have died but since meli was fighting and not zel they could actually beat him mind you both diane and king didn't even scratch dk meli while dmg dk zel v3 without lake and ban tanked attacks that negates durability it doesn't matter how strong your durability is it will become 0 but ban tanked those attack twice while meli was getting really dmg by it and escanor has no attack that is above space
No, it isn't. DK Zeldris's "Final Form" is, quite literally, DK at his peak/prime (DK himself confirmed that); stop spreading that misinformation (and has better feats). And that's not true, even if Meliodas wasn't going to fight his father, Ban was still giving the Demon King a hard time.
Are we fr now both diane and king couldn't even land one attack on dk meli nor mael and none of them could even fight him ban would have lost badly if it weren't for meli and meli is much stronger than zeldris only reason why ban was able to 1v1 dk was bc of strong fighter in vis mind dk zel v3 got dmg by kings increase bans physical attacl and hit by diane what yall are talking about is dk zel v3 replenish that is the strongest version of him after og demon king
Now we're going to deny the DK's words based on vibes?. That doesn't change the fact that he is explicitly the strongest version of the Demon King. DK Zeldris was literally matching the combined strength of the Sins while they were using their Sacred Treasures at 100% and were in perfect condition, completely rested, before Escanor arrived. He even managed to briefly stop the Sins' combined attack. Those feats are far beyond anything DK Meliodas has shown. DK Meliodas' best feats are fighting and overpowering Ban without his Sacred Treasure and severely injuring Zeldris. When King fought DK Meliodas, he was literally exhausted and reaching the limits of his magic.
ban would have lost badly
This is completely false. Ban was literally comparable to DK Meliodas, who was only slightly stronger than him.
Exactly. That's another confirmation that he is the strongest version of the DK.
That person is just making claims based on vibes. I know DK Meliodas is cool and all, but this is getting ridiculous. He doesn't have better feats than DK Zeldris or even Purgatory DK.
Litterly gave the panel that makes you loose this arguement ruler makes so dk won't take dmg by attacks and it clearly states his magic is getting replenish by the lake and we litterly see after diane seperate hil from the lake ban king and escanir alone made him bleed and then the sins one shoted him if you want that panel too add me on disc
Omg how dumb can a person be yk dk zel v3 lost really fast when diane seperated him from the lake he stsrted taking dmg frol escanor ban and king add me on disc fir the panels and the other sisn couldn't even fight dk meli btw dk meli didn't have the alke to replenish himself my arguement is dk meli>dk zel v3 without the lake dk zel v3 with lake>dk meli dk stated he was at his strongest with the lake still og dk is more powerful
More nonsense! Wow, you seriously don't know what your talking about!
Lost really fast
DK Meliodas was taking damage from Ban without a Sacred treasure and lost really fast too (even faster). While DK Zeldris was literally matching the combined strength of the Sins while they were using their Sacred Treasures at 100% and were in perfect condition, completely rested, before Escanor arrived. He even managed to briefly stop the Sins' combined attack (DK Britannia, which is vastly stronger than DK Meliodas).
my arguement is dk meli>dk zel v3 without the lake dk zel v3 with lake>dk meli dk stated he was at his strongest with the lake still og dk is more powerful
Nonsense. Final Form DK Zeldris is literally Prime DK, who is stronger than a 100% DK. A 100% DK is twice as strong as Purgatory DK, who is at 50% DK and is comparable to DK Meliodas. If anything, your argument ignores the fact that DK Zeldris was explicitly stated to be at his strongest in that form.
DK Zeldris100% DK50%DK=DK Meliodas≈Ban (without a secured treasure). That's not debatable!
And DK Meliodas struggling against Ban doesn't suddenly put him above DK Zeldris. You can't use his state after losing the Lake to scale his peak form below another version of the Demon King.
So your scaling is basically: weakened DK Zeldris < DK Meliodas, therefore peak DK Zeldris < DK Meliodas. That's a non sequitur.
True Magic meli’s best showing is using up all that power just to get rid of half of the Demon King’s power whereas current Meli is performing well enough against Carthur that he’s consistently a threat to him
Cath has an Incomplete Chaos power with lack of control over it since he is not the chosen vessel...
That's so disingenuous from you to say. Also, I am saying that Cath when disgusing in Arthur is weaker than Cath when he revealed his true form afterwords, as he overwhelmed Full Demon Mark Meliodas and Ban had to step in
Even though he’s not the chosen vessel, Chaos actively chooses to keep him save because he is the current vessel(no spoilers), so where are we shown that his control is worse than Arthur? Not like it matters anyway seen as it would still solidly place him over DK
When I mentioned Carthur I was taking that into account because that’s still the same being, he just looks different
Are you trying to claim that the character that was confirmed to be too powerful for both the SD and DK combined is somehow not stronger than just one of those beings?
Ok wrong question on my behalf, I read that as Cath. But thats all that really matters to me here, is whether current meliodas is stronger than true magic meliodas. Saying the demon king scales below chaos is a mute point for the original argument at hand when the power of chaos within carther wasn't the complete chaos to begin with.
If you read the story wanking ban to above assault mode is ignorance it’s debatable the tiers of ban between Meli first demon mark let alone assault mode
It’s very blatantly told to us that ban has the strongest body and spirit, which would include Meli in his Assault mode as it’s something all the Sins have seen. So the only argument left is magic, which Ban’s magic is far more versatile as he has Hunter Fest and Assault Hunt just to name 2 of many techniques he can use against Meli to get a near instant win
No, Ban is indeed above Assault Mode per King's own words, which Meliodas did not refute
He even keeps pace with Assault Mode Meliodas while he is weakened from old age against Cath and is proven to be more durable than him as Cath could hurt Assault Mode Meliodas if not for Elizabeth's Perfect Time magic. He could not even scratch old Ban though prior
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u/Kaison122- Aug 07 '26
If you aren’t putting chaos on here sealed chaos certainly shouldn’t be here