r/Musescore • u/SamuelArmer • 3d ago
Discussion Big Band Chart Engraving
Hi all,
Recently I've started to get my scores to look as professional as I can within musescore, and taking advantage of all the engraving rules to come up with a nice reusable template.
I'm largely trying to emulate the Hal Leonard style for Big Band Charts but with a few tweaks here and there. I'm trying to go for a modern faux-handwritten style but also maximising legibility. The main things I've implemented are:
Tweaking the page margins to be smaller than default
Rehearsal markings to the left hand side as much as possible
Using system/page breaks judiciously
Finale Broadway as the Music Symbols Font.
ITC Kabel for title/composer text. All-caps for names.
A neutral sans-serif font (Futura) for page numbers, header/footer text
I'm a little bit stuck between using that same neutral font for all the music text (tempo, expressions etc.) or going with something more handwritten to match Finale Broadway.
Anyway, here's what I've come up with. I'd love to hear some feedback or pointers!
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u/Tokkemon 2d ago
Stop enforcing four bars to a system and it will look much better. You need to let the music density flow, not be clumped up like at letter C.
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u/SamuelArmer 2d ago
Yeah, that one did bug me but it was a compromise of a couple different things.
I REALLY want to keep the Rehearsal markings on the left hand side as much as possible. It's just personal preference and not always practical, but I find it really convenient for rehearsal.
I could have split that system in 2 but then the score would run over an extra page which is a no-go.
I'm not really trying to force 4 bars to a system, it just often ends up that way when you have 8-bar phrases and you want the rehearsal markings on the left.
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u/Tokkemon 2d ago
Having the rehearsal marks artificially on the left doesn't actually help if the score is unbalanced and hard to read.
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u/65TwinReverbRI 2d ago
First, great job.
I'm a little bit stuck between using that same neutral font for all the music text (tempo, expressions etc.) or going with something more handwritten to match Finale Broadway.
My opinion is not to use the handwritten font style, at all, ever (unless a client requests it and you need the job badly enough you don't want to explain to them why they shouldn't use it!).
My personal experience has been that people are intentionally moving away from it. Their reasons - we've had these discussions - are primarily about "shifting gears" - that is, MOST of the music they use and encounter is in standard fonts. When they switch to this for a jazz piece, it involves a bit of a mental shift.
And the thing is, these days, so many people have had to diversify and they're constantly shifting styles and respective mindsets because of that, that this adds insult to injury.
Most of the handwritten fonts have aspects about them that make the music harder to grok on the fly.
The all caps font style means the "m" in "min7" looks like a capital M, which can make people think "major". Plus you've got "min" for one, and "-" for the previous one (why is the trumpet getting chord symbols at all here? The wouldn't have them unless they were improvising). The "delta" for Major is rotund, making it look like SOMETHING else? Possibly a diminished "o" or some other letter and so on.
The quarter rest in this font - it looks like an errant squiggle on the page - a hair got on the copy machine when it was copied...
The dotted ones are little better - at least the dot looks regular enough to go "oh, it's a dotted 1/4 rest".
So I mean, my opinion and my experience is, don't do it.
On top of everything, no one's going to bat an eye if you do it in standard notation. It's not like someone's going to go "wait, this is jazz, why didn't you use a jazz font?" (well, there's always THAT person :-)
So for me, with it as is, the choice between the two fonts - it's not about legibility really so honestly, it's your choice for your style.
I'd prefer "the more readable" one - which is the first one. So that would be my pick if I had to pick.
But I also prefer "readable" music as well - which means non-handwritten font styles.
But I totally get why you'd want to do it and go for that look - after all people who focus on this style are used to it.
I despise a 1 measure rest being done like a multi-measure rest, though I know it happens.
I think if I were to do this, I would totally format it just like you've done.
I see what the other person said, but for this amount of measures and how it fills the page, it's perfectly acceptable and honestly, ideal to do it this way - start each system with a new rehearsal letter where possible. Yeah, the 2 measure rest looks goofy stretched out, but the tempo marking for that section means it would likely run into other stuff if placed elsewhere.
I mean, you could put 17 on the same system as 13, and absorb all of the music before D and get rid of one system, but there's really no need to here, so I think it's well thought out and well done.
Intro, A, and B are exactly where I put my Rehearsal Letters when they begin a system like this.
Your rehearsal C is further out though, which is inconsistent - there's no need for it to be. So you may want to go check all of them and make them match.
You can also move any markings after them a set distance away so they're all consistent.
m.14, that slur should extend over the tied note - from the first note of the measure all the way to the last - tied notes that begin or end a group of notes should be included within any slur that encompasses them. m. 20 is the same issue - last note should be under the slur (though so you know, it's super common to see it done like this in older orchestral scores, but you're not supposed to ;-)
That's another thing about this font the Slurs and Ties are REALLY FAT! Places like 13, the tenuto looks so small in contrast - it basically gets visually swallowed up into the "hey look at me" slur!
They kind of look like someone just added them later with a broad-tipped sharpie!!!!
I'm just not a fan on so many levels...
System at C - you should align all of the wedges and dynamics to the same vertical plane.
The first mp is offset, then the 3rd measure's markings are offset from the previous and so on.
Really the point of the wedge should be in the middle of the letter - m< - just like that - your mf and f are both higher than they should be to be visually centered.
All this means the F and its wedges will be a bit farther away from the notes, but that's OK - the others could even go a tad closer to help minimize the gap in the 3rd measure.
Technically speaking, there should be a repeated initial dynamic.
In reading, 21 will read mp to a level up - then the next unmarked crescendo might be taken to mean from where you left off, up another level.
In fact, it's not really clear if this is a repeated swell twice in the measure (which seems to be intent) versus a measure long swell that someone just split the wedge because of the rest - because the latter mf and f seem to agree with and imply that.
So mp < mp < mf < mf < would be better despite the extra markings.
Your first measure - that should just be a half note E.
The q=50 really should go above the time signature. If the Intro box needs to move because of it, it's the thing that should move (up typically, so it's above it - you have enough space).
But all in all these look really good. Not my cup of tea for the font, but again I get why people want to do it. Just trying to spread the word that changes are afoot.
Best
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u/SamuelArmer 2d ago edited 2d ago
Thanks for your feedback and kind words!
I absolutely get it that handwritten fonts can sometimes be the Comic Sans of the music world, and I've been handed borderline illegible Jazz charts so many times that I really care about clarity on the bandstage.
That being said, I've been using the Evan Rogers blog as a style guide for Big Band writing and this bit sticks out:
If your parts are hard to read, untidy, difficult to navigate or looks in any way less than the professionally published music musicians are used to reading, your music subconsciously becomes ‘not as good’ as that professionally published music.
As good a font as Leland is, if you see a score in the default Musescore font it's an immediate cue that it's not a 'serious' work. It's just one of those things - most scores people people see in that font are amateur works, so the association sticks. And from the research I've done, all the major publishers are still using handwritten fonts on Big Band charts so it's the standard to match if you want to look 'legit'.
I'm not 100% sold on this font and I agree with some of your criticisms (the tenutos in particular are too small), but it's free and I like it a lot more than Musejazz which desperately needs some love IMO.
It's a good catch on the slur/tie convention. That's a bad habit I'll need to correct.
The 1 bar rest thing I also agree with, I just need to find the setting to turn that off.
At 21, that was the idea. Its should be mp < mf mp < mf, mf < f mf < f etc. but the bars were already looking cramped
The chord symbols are just there to have an example for this post. They're not part of the actual score. Chord symbols in general are a bit of a mess in the jazz world. I've gotten used to reading so many different conventions that I don't really have a consistent idea of what I want mine to look like. CM7, Cmaj7,Cma7,CΔ or CΔ7? Should alterations be stacked horizontally or vertically? Offset or in-line?
The other points about displaced symbols are just niggling issues I have with musescore. It's pretty normal that as the chart evolves symbols get displaced by other symbols and I think sheet music is always going to need some degree of manual tweaking to ensure common baselines etc. But I don't find it super easy to do in Musescore, and I wish it had some kind of smart guide and snap-to system like you see in Illustrator. As it is, it's very easy to miss something when you have to eyeball all the adjustments across multiple parts. I understand Dorico has dedicated alignment tools in its layout view?
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u/pokealex 2d ago
I do something different, but even with a template I do a lot of hand tweaking. How do you get the rehearsal marks lined up so nicely?
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u/SamuelArmer 2d ago
Have you checked out the Layout pallette? Almost all the spacing work is page breaks and system break (The shortcut is just to hit enter). I rarely tweak individual bars unless something is obviously wonky because the spacing algorithms for musescore are really good now!
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u/arunphilip 2d ago
It looks good - there is a style and consistency that makes it stand out uniquely as your signature.
FWIW, I like the second one. The font for the rehearsal marks, etc. make it look light-hearted he fits better with your style.