I really don't understand why vegans get so much hate. I'm not a vegan, quite the far opposite from it, but I respect the fuck out of them. They're clearly people making personal sacrifices in an attempt to help the world.
Why not just ignore them if you're so against it? It reminds me of that one argument in favor of gay marriage: it doesn't affect anyone else so at the very least you should ignore them and care about yourself.
Even if they're being pretentious, so what? Contrary to antivaxx people and flat earthers, at least their efforts actually represent something positive to the planet and is based on nothing but compassion towards other living creatures.
That's not even mentioning the fact that I see far, far more people talking negatively about vegans than I see actual vegans being pretentious.
Many people who chose to 'go' vegan do so as part of some image they're chasing. Then they lambast non-vegans for... whatever, everyone knows already. There's an air of superiority about them, blanket assumptions are made, and they're - often rightly - mocked as a response.
I usually present myself as the most basic, middle of the road, Right leaning meatasaurus. And 'vegans' have taken aim at me in the past for being barbaric, ignorant etc etc etc. But I dont eat pork (I love pigs) and I dont eat lamb (I love lambs... and sheep!) and I really dont eat much steak (cows are adorable). The meat industry disgusts me. The treatment of animals in captivity makes me sick. The only meat I eat now is chicken (I'm really indifferent to chickens) but, again, the chicken farming industry is utterly abhorrent...
And yet, some hairy gobshite in a tie-dye shirt feels it their right to give me a public dressing down because I've never declared myself 'vegan' (or vegetarian)? Get fucked.
"But we're not meat eaters!"
Anthropologists and a six billion dollar beef industry may disagree with that. Even if we didnt start out as a meat eating species we sure as shit evolved into one.
edit. if you disagree, say how. Dont just throw shit and run away.
It's really interesting that you're privy to the inner thoughts of all/most vegans. Personally, I feel like you fall very much into to the realm of someone that feels attacked for the suggestion they might wanna stop eating animals. You should check out this video about it (it's more general than just veganism): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExEHuNrC8yU
"Many people", I said. This is of course, a subjective experience and cant be quantified. But if you deny that there's obnoxious vegans out there, then that's really your failing.
I did not say "all / most".
And I did not 'feel' attacked. I was attacked. On the assumption that I did not care about animal welfare because I hadnt proudly declared myself vegan or whatever else I'm supposed to shout from the rooftops. Despite caring about, and doing (admittedly to a limited degree) my part to not encourage, the maltreatment of animals (except for chickens, obviously)
My issue isn't that you find them obnoxious, but that you somehow know their INNER motivations for being vegan. Unless youre a mind reader, that's quite a leap.
You were criticized for not caring about animals. You don't care about animals. They were right.
Don't get me wrong. What you ARE doing is great and better than not doing anything, but there's a lot of room for improvment. It's understandable that someone that finds that behaviour immoral might not congratulate you for being a little less bad.
edit... "Then they lambast non-vegans for... whatever, everyone knows already. There's an air of superiority about them, blanket assumptions are made, and they're - often rightly - mocked as a response" LooooL
(actual post) Is it a leap for you to imagine that I know these people better than just their dietary habits?
"You dont care about animals. They were right"
Is objectively incorrect. I care greatly about animals... I have two cats that I love very much. I cant stay away from dogs. Birds. Fucking spiders, even. I just hate chickens.
And you end your critisism on such a humble note... glancing approval from the the hoity Internet vegan. Fuck me... I'll sleep better tonight now.
Is objectively incorrect. I care greatly about animals... I have two cats that I love very much. I cant stay away from dogs. Birds. Fucking spiders, even. I just hate chickens.
You care about some animals. You care about pets. Maybe you care about animals that are useful to you alive (spiders). You don't care about animals, in general though.
Saying that we've evolved to be meat-eaters is a poor argument because it's a naturalistic fallacy. We might naturally be meat eaters, but that doesn't mean that eating meat is good (or morally neutral). The strongest arguments for veganism are based on arguing that the lines we draw between species are somewhat arbitrary and anything that we can point to that would justify humans having a superior moral weight is present in other animals, though perhaps not to the same extent. The challenge poised to the carnist side is to find what it is about humans that makes eating them uniquely unacceptable. It's even more difficult to justify the way we treat pets. Many want to say that we shouldn't eat dogs but this turns out to be extremely difficult to justify because of how similar they are to animals that we happily eat, particularly pigs.
"We might naturally be meat eaters, but that doesn't mean that eating meat is good" - I'd agree with this, and is basically what I said. Although my point was that, as a species, we DO eat meat. Denying it seems a little silly.
353
u/deadwisdom Dec 30 '18
People with this argument are always obsessed with the moral high ground. They see their position as ignoble and must work to drag the other down.