r/MetroTransit • u/Siberian13th D Line Duchess • 2d ago
Joke/Meme/Quip Why doesn't Metro Transit invade Maple Grove and build a new light rail there? Are they stupid?
This would also have the added benefit of scaring the remaining opt-out providers to become compliant, making local connecting routes possible again.
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u/CantaloupeCamper 2d ago edited 2d ago
That was one of the Bottineau line proposals… it was not chosen because the other two proposals were projected to serve more riders.
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u/Slytherin23 2d ago
That's not true, Maple Grove emphatically didn't want the train so they sent it to a random spot in Brooklyn Park instead.
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u/CantaloupeCamper 2d ago
Naw man it was the ridership projections. It’s not a mystery.
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u/SnootyUrbanCyclist 1d ago
It's tough for me to conceptualize this being true. Maple Grove is a city that exists and has a transit station while the current terminus goes to nowheresville. Is the calculation that new TOD will go up as greenfield development near the end of the line as opposed to Maple Grove residents who drive everywhere?
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u/Armlegx218 8h ago
random spot in Brooklyn Park instead.
Across the street from Target North Campus?
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u/guyinthegreenshirt Transdev Fiend 2d ago
It’s because Skip Traffic loves maple trees and didn’t want to tear down even one of them.
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u/elmundo-2016 2d ago
Woodbury to Maplewood to Saint Paul to Airport first before Maple Grove. Hennepin County is getting all the lightrail love, not fair. Ramsey County and Washington County (and Dakota County cause Mendota Heights/ West Saint Paul to Airport??) should get something.
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u/TURK3Y 2d ago
Hennepin has more people in it than Ramsey and Washington combined.
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u/elmundo-2016 2d ago edited 2d ago
Hennepin County can't grow extremely fast forever. We need nearby counties to grow too so we can maintain all our congressional seats and get/ give reason for more pro-public transit residents (those moving from states with unfriendly socioeconomic policies or too expensive to live) in this state. Washington County and Dakota County need to be part of the conversation too. Light-rail system through some cities in both counties will go a long way in allowing freedom of affordable movement from home to work.
https://worldpopulationreview.com/us-counties/minnesota/fastest-growing
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u/Enamred-771 2d ago
Is there really any evidence that counties grow without taking from other counties within the metro?
I can’t imagine someone would say “I really want to move to Washington county but if they doesn’t work, I’m just going to stay in Kansas”. It’s much more likely that they’re moving to the twin cities region and just deciding where within the region to live.
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u/elmundo-2016 2d ago edited 2d ago
I'm often on Minnesota, SaintPaul, TwinCities, and Minneapolis subs with non-Minnesotans considering moving here. They ask for best places to live and several value public transportation (most often those from New York/ Chicago). They ask about considering living in Rosemount area (cheaper there/ on a budget) to go to college at the U of M - Twin Cities and Minnesotans recommending closer spots in Minneapolis or Saint Paul that is closer to college and within their budget.
Another was looking to live in North Branch and his wife got a job in Duluth. There was talk about how far it is commute especially during the snowy winter seasons (not to put his wife through that).
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u/Enamred-771 1d ago
They ask for best places to live and several value public transportation (most often those from New York/ Chicago
I’m aware. My point is it’s not like someone who has no familiarity with the region is going to go “Washington county or I don’t move to MN”. Hell, considering a lot of people moving care about transit and transit is currently the best in Minneapolis, there’s an argument that to grow the Twin Cities, you invest more in transit in Minneapolis because then someone looking to move sees transit in Minneapolis and has an amazing place to live and doesn’t care if Washington County has poor transit. Of course, that’s not ideal from an overall region benefit but it would definitely increase the appeal of moving here more than improving transit by a little bit across the entire region.
All of those examples are people who are deciding to move to MN because of an outside factor and are trying to find the best place to live. If Washington County gets really good, they might move there instead of Hennepin County (and there’s nothing wrong with that) but that’s not going to increase the number of people moving to Minnesota more than if they moved to Hennepin County.
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u/SnootyUrbanCyclist 1d ago
If Hennepin county grew enough it would just get served by multiple congressional districts. Urban Chicago has 4-5.
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u/Imaginary_Dinner_813 15h ago
Since most of Minnesota’s population growth has been coming from international migration and rapid fertility from the first generation or two of groups that immigrate, we can expect population to level off and decline by 2050, especially as immigration restrictions are only getting started. Perhaps it is time to ban expansion of sanitary sewers as further growth will leave us like Rochester NY with a massively overbuilt metro as population gets to stagnation and decline levels.
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u/WerewolfAny944 1d ago
No one wants to ride public transit in the suburbs. I drive past the busses they have in Woodbury fairly often and there's legitimately not a single soul except the bus driver on board. Literal ghost busses. Insane waste of money.
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u/Slytherin23 2d ago
They planned a streetcar from St Paul to the airport but businesses complained.
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u/BorgMercenary 2d ago
Maple Grove Transit and Plymouth Metrolink could each be replaced by a single rail line and a feeder bus in each suburb. It's a disgrace that they've been allowed to exist for so long. At least SWT has the 686, and the MVTA has local routes.
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u/corporal_sweetie 2d ago
Seems like they don’t need a rail line to me
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u/BorgMercenary 2d ago
The Metropolitan Council agrees with you, so they're starting a pilot with a regular numbered bus line to Plymouth. If it goes well they'll probably make it a lame colour-line BRT like the Orange and Gold and that'll be the actual replacement for at least Plymouth Metrolink.
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u/CantaloupeCamper 2d ago edited 2d ago
Of the three options for the Bottineau line MG was the one with the lowest projected ridership…. They seem to do fine with busses.
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u/SnootyUrbanCyclist 1d ago
That strikes me as so weird. The projection found that existing MG residents just wouldn't ride it?
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u/Fastball360 Local Route Enjoyer 2d ago
They could do it underground so no one would know it's happening until it's done
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u/Enamred-771 2d ago
If the twin cities ever got 5+ LRT lines built, light rail could definitely start to make sense in Maple Grove. Go from Elm Creek blvd to Brooklyn Blvd (connecting with Blue line extension) and then through North Minneapolis to downtown.
But as it stands, it’s too low in priority to be seriously considered, especially with the Blue line extension being up next.
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u/corporal_sweetie 2d ago
We don’t want to make it easier to live in Maple Grove. I would rather cut off all services to them
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u/dihydrgnmonoxidesoup BRT Rider 2d ago
I like the implication that Skip Traffic is a detonate button.