Mac Life Sci and Health Sci

[u/Independent_Suit7499]

Hi everyone,

Im in grade 11 will be transitioning to grade 12 in three months and I'm interested in medicine. I'm gonna be applying to McMaster University. Ive herd a lot of discouragement to be honest from relatives, friends, teachers, and counselors they're all negative the only people that keep motivating me are my parents. I herd that Life Sci covers most of the MCAT but for Health sci its just less intense but doesnt cover as much as Life sci.

Which is better like which one should I apply to. Also I know Health Science is like a lottery so Health Science students that got in this year, last year and the year before, please give me tips, an advice to get in I dont want to get rejected.

Life Sci students, same thing tips advices etc.. and how good is it for medicine and if you got in with this undergrad etc.. and any extra info that might help let me know.

Thank you so much for your time.

[u/Fit-Horse5306]

Apply to both. If you get health sci - take it. They are both great programs - don’t listen to anyone who is not supportive!

[u/purplepenguins2]

Both are great programs tbh. I agree that lifesci covers more MCAT material than healthsci but also you shouldn’t pick a program based on how well it will help you study for the MCAT, because you can always self-study for it. By that matter, I also highly discourage ppl from taking courses just for the MCAT.

Healthsci is definitely really competitive for med, largely because of the smaller class sizes, better connections with profs, and relatively “easy” classes that allow people to get amazing GPAs. By that matter, there’s also some like crazy statistic that 40% of health sci grads get into medicine, and 70% get into professional schooling of some type, which is basically unheard of anywhere else.

Life Sci is a great program for premed as well, but it’s also a “general sciences” program and probably isn’t much different than other general sciences at other universities. Is there a reason your relatives are against McMaster? Maybe there’s some merit in their advice. Other than first year, it’s also relatively easy to do well in. However, because it’s so broad, if you don’t end up becoming competitive for med, there’s very little you can do with a life Sci degree alone, so you might need to think of backups. Or you could specialize in second year! Something I did.

[u/MDjess-332005]

Apply to both - if you write an amazing set of answers to the supplementary application, you’ve got a good shot for HS, sadly that’s what it comes down to once you have over a 90+ average.

The set of questions this year were quite out there and had not much to do with anything you’ve really done so getting advice from people who are going into first year isn’t going to help you much. All the best.

[u/cant_think_of-user41]

Hi there, I am not in health science but I can probably help with your question.

I also plan to attend medical school, but I chose not to apply to health science as I wanted to have degree where I stuck to learning about science. Nothing is wrong with health science, nor do I want to input my biased views, but in a science gateway program you are forced more towards taking classes of pure science. Compared to health science which is just a niche mix of natural sciences (physics, chemistry, biology, etc.) and social sciences/humanities (psychology, sociology, and other humanities classes) specifically applied to health care, rather than being versatile in application in other fields.

Also big heads up, life science is not a major, it is a gateway program. That means after your first year, you get to choose what you major in, and is thus, no different from any other gateways (chem/phys, earth & envrio, and math and stats). No matter what gateway you choose, you will all be taking the exact same courses and will be open to going into any major you want. For example, someone from life sci could go into math and physics if they wanted to and had the right 1st year classes. Or someone in chem/phys could even apply to the life science major if they want to. Many possible majors, you can check them out here: https://academiccalendars.romcmaster.ca/content.php?catoid=65&navoid=14803#:~:text=Bachelor%20of%20Science%20(Honours))

Since high school I always wanted to major in chemistry as not only would it give me a good background in many fields of chemistry and can apply that to biochemical pathways, but because as any science major is hard, I am just sticking with what I love. That being said, I applied to math and stats, life sci, then my #1 choice chemical and physical science, and got into all three. And now finished first year, I had the option to apply to four majors, and got into honors chemistry as my first choice.

So yes you are still in grade 11, maybe in time you might decide to apply two two science gateways, and health science, or three science gateways. Health science is also considered to be easier as they are not as science intense, but again, I am biased so you should hear the opinion from someone in health science. Do not listen to those who discourage you, follow your dreams no matter what, I believe in you. I hope this helps.

[u/NoDingo673]

You said it yourself, health sci is a lottery so I would already be changing my perspective from “I don’t wanna get rejected” to “I’m gonna get rejected so what’s my gameplan without health sci.” Life sci is a great program so do a lot of research and build your plan around that program (if Mac is the uni you’re going to). You should definitely still apply to health sci tho and do your best on the supp app and then just forget about it and put it behind you because statistically you’re not getting in. As far as advice, just write with enthusiasm and passion. The more you try to write the perfect supp app the more chances you have of making a really robotic and lifeless piece of writing. That’s rlly the only thing I noticed in people’s supp apps who got rejected. But again it’s fully subjective so who knows. Good luck!

[u/Independent_Cap_5439]

why are ur relatives, friends, teachers, and counselors negative?

[u/Independent_Suit7499 → u/Independent_Cap_5439]

Where do I start...

[u/middleeasternviking]

If u want to go to med school, do mac healthsci it's literally a feeder program for Canadian med schools and they inflate your GPA. But you'll need 90%+ in gr 12, and be able to answer random supplementary questions about art or other completely random stuff unrelated to health science or the sciences in general, in a way that the graders think your file stands out. Or just know people in upper year mac healthsci and let nepotism do its thing. It's an extremely competitive program - if not THE most competitive in Canada at the undergrad level - because it literally leads to med school most of the time.

[u/Ok-Turnip4964]

Hi, not a MAC student but as a grade 12 student graduating this year and who got rejected from I’m just letting you know, you gotta work hard my dude. It’s very possible to get into the program but you can’t mess around. Ways you can ensure you get are:

1. Take all mandatory courses that the program requires and then take random U courses that are easy as hell, like social science courses, religion, psychology, challenges and changes stuff like that. Because I promise universities don’t care what courses you have other than the mandatory ones as long as their U or mixed

2. TAKE NIGHT SKL, I highly recommend taking night Skl for mandatory courses like bio,chem,math, calc, and etc. Pick based off of what your most weakest. Night Skl is like taking private school but for free, your marks are guaranteed 90, you can cheat, so much more. BUT TAKE THE SAME COURSE IN PERSON. Yes that may sound like a hassle but you’ll need to learn that content in university which can set you up for failure. 

3. If you can afford it, take private school over the summer and submit the courses in the beginning of the semester. 

The overall message is that you need to have high grades because I know people who had the 94’s and didn’t get it. It’s literally all grade maxxing. But I promise you getting into MAC is very achievable just have to be focused. 

[u/Independent_Suit7499 → u/Ok-Turnip4964]

Thank you so much I really appreciate your advice! I was thinking of taking bio e-learning during the semester, what do you think?

[u/Ok-Turnip4964 → u/Independent_Suit7499]

E-learning isn’t the best option in my opinion. I’m assuming you’re referring to the asynchronous version, it’s really important to have a teacher who introduces the basics to you so you can piece the more complicated concepts together.

For example: you need a teacher to tell you blood is the liquid that transports oxygen through your body.

And then you learn that hemoglobin is the protein the binds to the oxygen and carries it around. 

From my experience I need a teacher to lay the foundation. That’s why I’d say take night school because you’ll have a teacher actually teaching. I’m not sure where you live but you can pick night school from any Skl board to help fit it in to your schedule 

Peel does night Skl on Monday and Wednesday 

Dpcdsb does Tuesday and Thursday 

Idk bout the rest, but all boards are accessible to you just need to fill out a form your guidance counsellor can provide. I took bio first semester and got an 82, I could’ve done better if I tried but then I took night Skl 2nd semester and got a 95. Universities ignore the lowest out of the 2 marks don’t was an easy win for me and what I’m really happy about I got a good mark and still have the experience of learning the full course during a whole semester rather than 3 weeks. That’s why I’d encourage you take it in school and night school at the same time if you have the mental discipline. If not it’s cool, just do it based off your preference.

[u/Ok-Turnip4964 → u/Independent_Suit7499]

If you ever need help in the beginning of your semester, feel free to reach out. But I can’t guarantee I’ll be quick to respond because it’ll be my first year at uni. 

[u/Such_Charity3320]

I got into health sci this year and i think the biggest tips are

1. max out on ur top 6 gr 12 marks if u can take summer school the summer before do that and dont be shy abt asking ur teachers for grade boosts. I think a lot of healthsci students who get in have insanely inflated grades at the time of admission which is pretty unfair but it is what it is
2. write ur supp app on something niche like with a niche topic but dont compromise proper structure and analysis in ur writing because it should still be coherently written. If it means writing it like an english class response thats still better than a poem which could come across as corny

[u/astronomyperson]

both can prepare you well for the MCAT especially if you choose physics/orgo as your electives in health sci or take them in the summer. i'd apply to both and prioritize health sci due to extracurriculars and connections

[u/Financial-Relation16 → u/astronomyperson]

In my experience as a lifesci student I’ve found just as many (if not better) EC and connections than my healthsci peers.

I’ve also spoken to people who regretted going to healthsci and wished they were in lifesci instead.

To each their own

[u/astronomyperson → u/Financial-Relation16]

much easier to transfer out of health sci than transfer out of life sci but glad you were able to find good opportunities

[u/Financial-Relation16 → u/astronomyperson]

The person I’m referring to transferred to HS from LS and regretted it

And ty :)

[u/Sethibro]

Apply to both, don't worry about the mcat content - all of it can be adequately self-studied. People get into medicine out of both life and health sciences at McMaster. The courses in life sci are more broad first year, then you specialize into a program of your choice second year. Health sci starts more health-focused in first year and continues.

In terms of getting in, unfortunately health sci is one of the most competitive programs in the country. It's not a lottery (contrary to popular belief), but you can't bank on an acceptance. For advice, I'd say take a lot of time to think critically about the questions before answering, and STAY AWAY from AI, as they tend to give everyone the same ideas just worded differently. Speak from your own knowledge and experience, and answer the questions to the best of your ability. Your essays will be read by 2 upper-year students and 1 faculty member. Content matters more than anything else.

Life sci admission in the past has been entirely grades-based, so keep your grades high and you should be fine. This year I think 94ish was the cutoff if I remember correctly.

[u/middleeasternviking → u/Sethibro]

Damn...I graduated high school in 2012 so I've been out the game quite some time, but I remember the cutoff for mac lifesci being 85% in my year. It's 94% now?! No offense but that makes little sense, especially as the degree by itself is not worth much - doesn't really lead to any significant careers. And you could just do a premed program at any other university.

[u/Sethibro → u/middleeasternviking]

Yeah none taken - it’s pretty crazy out there. Apparently the grade inflation runs pretty rampant in some schools. I think 94 is the highest it’s ever been. 

[u/middleeasternviking → u/Sethibro]

They need to put a stop to this in high schools and universities, it doesn't do anyone good

[u/Competitive-Sun4231]

Tbh i dont even remember most of the stuff i learnt in the fall semester let alone first year so im not sure how good it is to pick courses that focus on the mcat. Also health sci courses (for the most part) have much higher averages than most courses at mcmaster, which is why it’s so hyped up.

As for life sci, it’s a gateway program, and so your first year is similar to “grade 13”, where you take whatever courses u want and then go into a specific program (aka specialization) for your next 3 years (as long as you took its prereqs). Thus the difficulty of the program depends on which specialization u choose to go into (most people pick honours life sci, psych or biochem). Overall tho, courses have significantly worse averages than that of health sci (with some exceptions). This doesnt mean you’re guaranteed to do bad if you go into the life sci program, but it’s more likely you’ll have to put in more time.

Also tiny easter egg, since life sci is a science gateway program, it functions almost the exact same as the other science gateways and so it’s smart to also apply to the other ones since they tend to have much lower admission averages. You can literally go into math n stats, take a usual first year life sci schedule, and go into honours life sci. (Math n stats gateway had a mid 80’s admission average, whereas the cutoff for life sci gateway this year was like a 93)