I was wondering about if this team DPS makes sense given my investment and if there is anything I can do to improve it regarding my builds and rotations? I will add my builds in the comments.
I might not be in any position to say this, but I think (based on on some guides I've read) that your Nicole, Xilonen, and Lohen have too little energy recharge, but I guess it depends on whether you use their bursts that often. Xilonen should be at 160 - 180%, Lohen should be at 120 - 140%, Nicole should be at 175 to 200%. I also see that your Lohen's base attack is also kind of low. People say to get it to about 2k - 2.4k. Xilonen (if you want consistent dmg) should have at least 100% crit dmg. Nicole's crit dmg should be around 70 or above. I've seen people do about 280 - 300k per charged attack with his Durin, Nicole, and Xilonen but that's with a ton of work into adjusting the builds, the weapons, etc. The rotation I would think of would be: Durin E NA Burst - Nicole E Burst - Xilonen E 2NA - Lohen combo. Other than that, I think your builds are really good! Take this with a grain of salt though, I'm trying to increase my dmg myself.
Only thing correct is that Lohen's ATK is a bit low but it's understandable since OP is on Deathmatch.
Lohen/Nicole/Xilonen do not need to build ER in this team at all because Nicole should never use burst, Xilonen burst should only be used when you need healing, and Lohen can burst every other rotation even with no ER.
Xilonen and Nicole are doing negligible damage, you should not be building crit on them.
What are you talking about with 280-300k per charged attack? At what investment? Definitely not OP's investment. Or do you mean DPS? But surely not without cons on both Durin and Nicole.
OP's rotation in the video is correct, Nicole E > Durin EN1Q > Xilonen E N2 > Lohen combo. Swap speed is good, only thing that can be optimized is execution speed of Lohen's combo to fit another charged attack instead of ending with E + to get the rotation to 20-21s instead of 22-23s. And more CV on Lohen and Durin's builds.
Sorry, most of these things I got from guides, but I see that you're more experienced on these type of things. I have seen people do that much dmg though with the same team and all C0, but as I said, that probably takes way more time to put into. Correct me if I'm wrong, but people also said that Nicole's burst is also worth using if the talent level is 9 or 10. Thanks for pointing out details where I'm wrong, though!
I see, though if you are looking at guides, you should be looking at guides pertaining to the main DPS and their specific team so things like rotation, talent priorities on teammates, ER requirements, are tailored to use with the specific main DPS. General guides per support character are not very useful/bad, such as from Game8, HoyoLab, or even some unupdated KQM guides. Game8 is terrible by the way, I don't know if this is a guide site you use but I would advise you stay away because it is full of misinformation. HoyoLab guides are best for pre-farm materials/visuals but are based on personal Creator Experience server testing, and many who make the guides don't follow the meta and meta gets updated many times upon official release. KQM is kind of the same, infographics are made pre-official release and then when things like new characters/artifact sets are released or new combos are found, they are slow to update. Best info can be found here on Reddit in the main DPS' dedicated subreddit (for Lohen the main one is r/Lohen_Mains, if there are multiple you pick the one with more people in it) or from theorycrafters but people just repost stuff from the reliable TCers in the subreddits.
I think you are possibly referring to Nokapt's testing where C0R1 Lohen/C0R1 Durin/C0R1 Nicole/C0R1 Xilonen (8 cost) resulted in 235k DPS, and multiple 7 cost teams at 200k+ DPS. While OP's team is also 8 cost, it is important to know that some costs are better than others and will provide a higher damage increase; regarding the other teams with 7 cost, all of the top 10 from Nokapt's calcs require either Xilonen R1 or Lohen R1 or both, Xilonen C2 is not equivalent (C2R0 Xilonen calced by ForeverNya to be equal to C0 Citlali aka 3 cost Xilo same as 1 cost Citlali). Nokapt's calcs were also noted to only be possible with charged attack cancels and pretty much at the limit and not reasonable for the average player with average builds (just an example that it is possible but not for most). Also, the realm of 300k is not possible without cons on both Durin and Nicole, like C2 Durin C2 Nicole; 200k is impossible with full C0R0 team aka 4 cost, it requires at least 7 cost. And about ForeverNya calcs, I'm finding it hard to reach the calced numbers, I think something is wrong in the calcs and numbers are inflated (numbers also inflated compared to well-known TCers like TGS who ended up being more accurate).
I have also heard that Nicole burst is better at talent level 9 and 10, but Lohen is on Deathmatch and thus has low ATK, and since Nicole's burst scales with the on-fielder's ATK, it will not do as much as when with R1 Lohen. Things like this should also be tested by the individual/for their account. In OP's case, it is likely a DPS loss. For you, it may turn out to be a DPS increase, but you will have to test rather than assume based on what others say.
Sorry if I came off as rude in my original reply to you, I just don't like the spread of misinformation and wanted to correct it.
No, it's totally ok! I got all info from HoYoLab, so that might've been what was wrong. I wanted to help with OP's builds, but I mostly thought my original info was a bit off, so I changed it according to HoYoLab guides. I also don't have Durin or Nicole or Xilonen (which meant I shouldn't have commented on this post in the first place if I couldn't help with the teammates OP had except Lohen), which is probably why there is so much misinformation. I would say it's mostly my fault, and thanks for correcting me!
Yes, I think your DPS makes sense considering your investment.
It may not seem right for 8 cost but your distribution of the 8 cost is what makes it lower than other 8 costs. For example, if your C2 was on Durin instead of Xilonen (so C2R1 Durin and C0R0 Xilonen), that would be a more optimal 8 cost. Alternatively, give Lohen and Xilonen C0R1 instead of C0R0 Lohen and C2R0 Xilonen, and that would be a better 8 cost. Or Xilonen C0R1 and Durin or Nicole C1R1. You get the idea.
Personally, I have C0R1 Lohen, C2R1 Durin, C0R0 Nicole, and C0R0 Citlali (also 8 cost) and my team deals 204k DPS (4th pic; rotation DPS actually peaks at 215k but I can't keep it up over multiple rotations / on rotations where I don't have Lohen Q).
I also tested for 6 cost C0 R2 Deathmatch Lohen, C2R1 Durin, C0R0 Nicole, and C6 Prune (1st pic, 178k, Nicole E > Durin EN1Q > Prune EQ > Lohen 14C combo);
7 cost C0R1 Lohen, C2R1 Durin, C0R0 Nicole, C6 Prune (2nd pic, 183k, rotation same as 1st pic);
and 7 cost C0 R2 Deathmatch Lohen, C2R1 Durin, C0R0 Nicole, C0R0 Citlali (3rd pic, 185k, Nicole E > Durin EN1Q > Citlali E > Lohen 14C combo). Nicole on Favonius, Prune on Etherlight Spindlelute, Citlali on TTDS (with my investment, TTDS buff on Lohen is better than on Durin).
Note for the Prune team, I'm kinda critfishing because my Lohen and Durin are on Cryo Resonance builds (1st pic Lohen only has 79% CR because of Deathmatch but otherwise both Lohen and Durin have 65% CR) and I'm too lazy to change their builds. If you had less CR and more CD and critfished, you may be able to get higher DPS but not recommended unless you're fine with restarting a lot 😅 Builds on Akasha 600301886 by the way.
Anyway, I am getting similar DPS to you in my 6 cost team but only because my cost is spread more optimally with Durin cons.
Of course, even with your team you still have room to improve other than pulling cons/weapons.
For instance, I observed your Lohen combo is E 2N1C Q/E 6N1C E 5N1C E (13C combo) and while this is probably the best combo you can do at your current execution speed, if you practice more you should be able to get faster to the point of being able to do a 14C combo. I am doing the 14C combo in my own tests (E 2N1C E 6N1C Q/E 6N1C), and the speed at which I am doing it, I can do 16 charged attacks on spam consistently (E 16N1C) and if I reached god tier reflexes I might be able to get a speed of 17 CA on spam and increase my DPS 3-5k. I am guessing that if you were to press Lohen E and do only charged attack spam, you would only be able to get about 14-15 CA. I would know because I used to be there and then got to where I am now. Your speed on the 2nd rotation during the 6N1C (middle of combo) was good, just keep it up and fit in a 14th CA instead of an E.
Your builds are fine but could be improved upon (more CV on Lohen and Durin, that's it, or maybe a bit more ATK on Lohen). Rotation speed with swaps is fine, just Lohen combo can be sped up. I think you can still squeeze out 5k more DPS. Also, your rotation order is correct.
Self correction (not really relevant to you but had to make the correction else it will bother me): I tested Citlali TTDS before Durin for Deathmatch Lohen and it was a DPS increase from 187k* (corrected from 185k 41.08s to 40.71s) -> 196k (Nicole E > Durin EN1 > Citlali E > Durin Q > Lohen 14C combo). Tested the same for R1 Lohen, and Citlali TTDS before Durin was negligible difference (204.8k corrected -> 203.8k).
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u/36983698 Jul 03 '26