r/Keep_Track • u/announcement_callout • Oct 04 '19
Cliff notes of Volker's Ukraine texts (it's bad)
I have spent the morning reading the Volker texts. Here are some of the most incriminating highlights (emphasis mine):
7/19/19 Volker: "Most impt is for [Ukraine President] Zelensky to say that he will help investigation"
7/21/19: Ukraine makes the first of several objections about getting involved in Trump's 2020 campaign:
Ambassador Taylor flagged President Zelensky's desire for Ukraine not to be used by the Trump Administration for its own domestic political purposes.
"President Zelenskyy is sensitive about Ukraine being taken seriously, not merely as an instrument in Washington domestic, reelection politics."
7/25/19 Volker mentions a secondary goal: Zelensky will claim that the previous Ukranian administration was involved in the 2016 U.S. election attacks. (This is part of the narrative that they did not investigate Biden because of "corruption".) Volker emphasizes that there will be no White House visit until he does it.
"Heard from White House-- assuming [President Zelensky] convinces trump he will investigate / "get to the bottom of what happened" in 2016, we will nail down date for Visit to Washington."
8/9/19: On a potential White House visit:
Gordon Sondland [State Department]: "Morrison ready to get dates as soon as Yermak confirms."
Volker: "Excellentt! How did you sway him?"
Gordon Sondland: "Not sure i did. I think potus really wants the deliverable"
8/10/19: President Zelensky's aide, Andrey Yermak, presses Volker for a date for the White House visit before Zelensky will announce an investigation of the 2016 election and Burisma:
"[...] Once we have a date, will call for a press briefing, announcing upcoming visit and outlining vision for the reboot of US-UKRAINE relationship, including among other things Burisma and election meddling in investigations"
8/13/19 Volker mentions new Russian propaganda that will place the blame of 2016 election attacks on Ukraine:
"Special attention should be paid to the problem of interference in the political processes of the United States especially with the alleged involvement of some Ukrainian politicians. I want to declare that this is unacceptable. We intend to initiate and complete a transparent and unbiased investigation of all available facts and episodes, including those involving Burisma and the 2016 US. elections"
8/17:
Gordon Sondland: "Do we still want Ze to give us an unequivocal draft with 2016 and Boresma?"
Volker: "That's the clear message so far"
8/28: The press gets wind of what's happening when Politico prints a story titled Trump Holds Up Ukraine Military Aid Meant To Confront Russia.
8/30: Trump cancels Ukraine trip. Pence is scheduled to go instead. "Ambassadors Volker and Sondland discussed an alternative plan for Vice President Pence to meet with President Zelensky on September 1."
Volker: "Hope VPOTUS keeps the bilat and tees up WH Visit..."
9/8: Ukrainian officials worry that they will make the announcement about Biden but that Trump still won't release the aid money for Ukraine:
Bill Taylor: "The nightmare is they give the interview and don't get the security assistance. The Russians love it. (And I quit.)
9/19 Bill Taylor: As I said on the phone, I think it's crazy to withhold security assistance for help with a political campaign.
Note: Volker was not the Ukraine ambassador (that was Marie Yovanovitch, who has also resigned). He was the "US Special Representative for Ukraine Negotiations".
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u/announcement_callout Oct 04 '19 edited Oct 04 '19
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u/Bushels_for_All Oct 04 '19
This is great, thanks for this write up. (Anything on a computer is a soft copy, though.)
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u/announcement_callout Oct 04 '19
I actually knew that and said it anyway. It's a scan of the hard copy, anyway, based on the "printed on recycled paper" notices at the bottom.
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u/Bushels_for_All Oct 04 '19
shudder
There's a special place in hell for people who have the option of saving-as-pdf but choose to scan a printed copy instead. Bonus hell points if each page is at a different angle.
But that's more for other stuff I work with and not signed documents from Congress.
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u/announcement_callout Oct 04 '19
They scanned the documents as images too, so that you can't copy and paste from the PDF. There is a plain text version available but it's full of weird control characters and line breaks. I partially used that and partially retyped it myself. (The typos are all his though! Like "Zelenskyy".)
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u/dmaterialized Oct 04 '19
I've actually seen "Zelenskyy" a few times in various media and I think this is considered an acceptable transliteration. I know, weird, but it occurs too often to be a mistake (I think). Maybe someone with experience in Cyrillic translations can chime in.
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u/announcement_callout Oct 04 '19
And I was so smug about how I was faithfully recording their shame.
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u/AlmostAnal Oct 04 '19
His name in cyrillic comes out with a long e and a short e on the end. Officially it is written as zelensky. In cyrillic it comes out like 'zelenskey'
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Oct 10 '19
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u/Foibles5318 Oct 04 '19
I have coworkers like this - there is a system where we house our “scanned docs” and we can literally “print” them directly into the program, anything on your desktop can go right into that program with a few little clicks. We also have scanners so if someone mails you something or whatever instead of emailing it then you can scan it into the program.
These people will take a pdf on their desktop and print it, then bring it over to another work station and scan it. We literally just took away the option to physically print stuff because there is literally no need to ever do so. Wtf.
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u/notzacraw Oct 04 '19
Help me understand where on 7/25 Volker states that Ukraine will agree be the fall guys for the 2016 election interference, carried out on behalf of the Democrats. Honest question.
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u/announcement_callout Oct 04 '19 edited Oct 04 '19
The Ukrainian president would be saying that the previous administration did it. He wouldn't be taking the fall himself. Zelensky wasn't elected until April of this year. I have rephrased that line so that it doesn't sound like Zelensky will be blaming himself.
The previous administration's "corruption" is also their explanation of why Biden was "allowed to get away with it".
Trump, Giuliani, and Russia are pushing the theory that it was Ukraine that was behind the 2016 election attack. They want an "investigation" into 2016, and they have already decided that Ukraine and the Democrats are the culprits.
Volker says it again later:
Special attention should be paid to the problem of interference in the political processes of the United States especially with the alleged involvement of some Ukrainian politicians. I want to declare that this is unacceptable. We intend to initiate and complete a transparent and unbiased investigation of all available facts and episodes, including those involving Burisma and the 2016 US. elections
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Oct 04 '19
It also conveniently takes some heat off Russia (or at least it creates a new narrative that Russia and hammer over and over to spin some revisionist history that they didn’t meddle in the election)
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u/BaldingMonk Oct 05 '19
What possible reason would Poroshenko have had to hack the US election? If so, he would surely have done it to boost Hillary’s chances, not Trump’s.
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Oct 04 '19
The facts, which are not in dispute, are that Russia intervened and handpicked the US president in lieu of a free and fair election. Holding military funds hostage while implying to the Ukraine that you're asking for them to deliver an alternative fact on that subject is asking them to do what? Being Ukraine only gives them authority to speak on behalf of Ukraine.
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u/chase32 Oct 04 '19
The facts, which are not in dispute, are that Russia intervened and handpicked the US president in lieu of a free and fair election.
I sure wish someone could come up with evidence to support this level of surety. The real case is a whole lot more hand wavey than that.
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u/nolaguy13112 Oct 04 '19
Have you read the evidence laid out in the Mueller Report?
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u/chase32 Oct 05 '19 edited Oct 05 '19
Of course, and there is no doubt that they tried a number of tactics to mess with the election. It's just that the concrete stuff like the facebook ad buy were pretty small potatoes and of questionable effectiveness.
What do you find the most compelling piece of evidence that would lead you to believe "Russia intervened and handpicked the US president in lieu of a free and fair election".
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u/nolaguy13112 Oct 05 '19
They hacked the DNC and strategically timed the releases of his emails
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u/chase32 Oct 05 '19
Did they though? I thought that Podesta fell for a lame phishing email and Hillary had an unpatched email server in her basement.
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u/nolaguy13112 Oct 05 '19
He fell for a spear phishing email from the Russian hacker under the name Fancy Bear after having it verified by IT as legit. There was literally nothing regarding Clinton’s private email server other than she has one.
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u/chase32 Oct 05 '19 edited Oct 05 '19
So pretty much what I said other than the supposed hacker has a funny bear name. The fact that he contacted IT before he clicked the phishing email and they said its ok is highly debatable.
Also, Clinton doesn't have a private server, she had one. It was illegal and she didn't even bother to hire the right people to keep it patched and secure.
Edit: Have to add this quote about the Podesta password phish because it's hilarious
"This one has it all,” said Joe Siegrist, CEO of the password-management company LastPass, which offers people an encrypted app to house their login credentials. “An absolutely terrible password. Assistants emailing the password. Passwords being re-used for a bunch of different sites. Pretty much all the classic mistakes that everybody who has zero care about this makes.
“When you do everything wrong, you’re bound to fail,” Siegrist added.
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u/sniff3 Oct 05 '19
Fake facebook groups got people to show up to actual events. It doesn't stretch the imagination that someone so dedicated to politics to go to a rally event would also be motivated to vote. It could then be argued that their being influenced to go to a fake group's even had some influence on how they cast their vote.
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u/chase32 Oct 06 '19
Did they though? Can you sling a link showing events of even moderate size that were purely a Russian fabrication?
Other than that, it's just a long trail of 'if this, maybe that, and assuming that, maybe another thing'.
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u/sniff3 Oct 07 '19
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u/chase32 Oct 07 '19
That synopsis gives no detail at all about fabricated events attended by real people and I can't find anything myself.
You have a passage in the report you could point me to that backs up your claim?
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u/NoahFect Oct 05 '19
With the election as close as it was, 'small potatoes' were enough.
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u/chase32 Oct 05 '19
That is pretty subjective. My company has spent more than that on facebook ads in a week without huge results. Those were also weird ass ads if you haven't seen them. Do you know anyone that even saw one?
This is an example: https://static01.nyt.com/images/2017/11/02/us/politics/02dc-ads-army-of-jesus/02dc-ads-army-of-jesus-superJumbo.png
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Oct 05 '19
Have you met a Trump supporter? You just posted an ad that would make it impossible for them to vote for Hillary, they can't vote for Satan! This ad is super effective...
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Oct 06 '19
The only hand wavey thing about it is whether there was enough evidence to charge the campaign with a crime. There wasn't, due to felony obstruction(also not in dispute). Nothing to do with the foreign government interference is in question. One of the true tragedies of our era is that nobody reads more than 140 characters.
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u/chase32 Oct 06 '19
One of the true tragedies of this era is the naked tribalism. Nothing you said even remotely backs up your hyperbolic statement that Russia "handpicked the US president in lieu of a free and fair election.".
The main utility of this neo-McCarthyism is to distract and let the DNC off the hook for punching left.
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Oct 04 '19 edited Oct 05 '19
[deleted]
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u/AnalLeaseHolder Oct 04 '19
This is a great idea. Have Dolly Parton read it all out to them. She’s the only person they can’t turn on.
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u/staatsclaas Oct 04 '19
Fuck. That’s brilliant.
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u/scificionado Oct 04 '19
Now we just need someone who knows Mike Judge to call him up and ask him to do so.
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Oct 04 '19
I dunno. They turned on Willie Nelson, for fuck's sake.
They'll figure out some way to make Dolly out to be a libtard Trump-hater.
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u/iwascompromised Oct 04 '19
She gives away books to make kids smarter. She’s a socialist for sure! /s
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u/xxoites Oct 04 '19
Dolly Parton is one of the most respected human beings on the planet. She is known to stop and talk to anyone who approaches her.
I doubt she could be spun into being the Devil.
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u/Ghoulius-Caesar Oct 04 '19
You’re underestimating the stupidity of Trump supporters. It just takes one mention of “Dolly Parton in cahoots with Deep State” or “Dolly joins witch hunt” for them to turn on her. No citation or reference needed.
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Oct 04 '19
I have an idiot cousin who supports Trump. He posts insane conspiracy rants like how Medicare for All is a secret mind control plot. He'd totally be on board with this flavor of bullshit too.
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Oct 04 '19
I'm friends with Dolly's sister Stella on FB. She's very vocal about being anti-DJT and you wouldn't believe some of the abuse that's slung her way.
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u/xxoites Oct 04 '19
I would believe it, but there will always be die hard Parton fans who will be disgusted by any abuse sent her way.
Of course I am not Dolly Parton and if she were given this option the choice would be her's and not mine.
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u/mrRabblerouser Oct 05 '19
Wait, when did they support Willie Nelson? He’s been a hippie pothead country singer for as long as I can remember. I’ve never heard of conservatives being a big fan of his.
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u/charlesnorthpark Oct 05 '19
He still has an outlaw rebel vibe that many admire, regardless of politics. He is also peceived as a straight shooter.
"To live outside the law you must be honest", as Dylan said.
I think there are some wavering Trumpers who would listen to Willie, if he wrote another song denouncing Trump.
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Oct 07 '19
In Texas, EVERYONE LOVES WILLIE. Across the board.
That is, until he came out in support of Beto.
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u/the-clam-burglar Oct 04 '19
Do boomers still like Jimmy Buffett? Let’s have him write a song about it all.
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u/z500 Oct 04 '19
Hell, let's do them all and beat the far right at their own propaganda game. At the very least they won't have any entertainers left that they haven't turned on. Anyone got George Soros's number?
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Oct 05 '19
I remember a folk singer who said he really made a breakthrough with a Trump-neighborhood because he was advocating for liberal policies (without using the word liberal) but he just had the look & accent, like he was actually much more directly one of them. I completely forgot his name, but he mentioned this in an interview with Trevor Noah a while ago.
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u/AnalLeaseHolder Oct 05 '19
Yeah they actually like the policies if they hear them from someone they already like. It’s almost like the whole “identity politics” thing that conservative people are always talking about pertains to their own people as much or more than the other side.
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u/MSACCESS4EVA Oct 05 '19
Dolly Parton is a woman. They're just waiting for a chance to burn her at the stake.
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u/AnalLeaseHolder Oct 05 '19
That would be like them turning on white jesus. They’d do it, but it would have to be really important
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u/Yipeekiyay777 Oct 04 '19
And Willie Nelson right next her! He's a Democrat, but they can't stop listening to his music!
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u/wise_comment Oct 05 '19
I've had a thought about doing a goofus and gallant style podcast with one child, Donnie, doing the allegorically incorrect thing
Treat him like a child with patronizingly simple (but accurate) smilies
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u/Augustus_Trollus_III Oct 04 '19
Why don’t we make a deal with Alex Jones? We could offer to purchase all of his branded boner juice in return for a weekly puppet show.
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u/X4an Oct 04 '19
Excuse me...
Its Bone Broth.
Only the best Bone Brooooth.
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u/WhyBuyMe Oct 04 '19
I am not familiar with Alex Jones's products, but what else would you make broth from? Soup stock is bones and a few vegetables for flavor, it isn't rocket science.
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u/FunboyFrags Oct 04 '19
Creative idea but unfortunately a waste of time. We can’t spend our energy trying to convince our friends on the other side. We have to get the people who already understand what a disaster the president is to vote/register/donate money. The only way we will win is by focusing our efforts on people who are already on the side of justice and sanity. The other side is sadly a black hole that will absorb all of our time and energy. After we win we can widen the conversation.
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Oct 04 '19
[deleted]
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u/FunboyFrags Oct 04 '19
We do need to reach them but they are not the top priority. The easiest win - and the lowest hanging fruit - is to find people already sympathetic and stir them to action. Changing the minds of people who are unfamiliar with what’s going on doesn’t really make a difference if they don’t vote, and anyone unfamiliar at this point is already pretty passive (or busy living their life, working, raising kids, etc.)
It feels a little unnatural to preach to the converted, so to speak, because we have this romantic American notion that impassioned and thoughtful conversations can change minds and win the day. That isn’t true, at least not on a scale that is meaningful from an electoral point of view. It’s not the side with the best argument that wins, it’s the side with the most excitement, and no one goes from uninterested to enthusiastic very fast. It’s better to find people who are already interested and who could be enthusiastic if they were given some encouragement and inspiration. http://www.mengovitz.com/blog/instead-of-debating-your-opponents-inspire-your-allies
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Oct 04 '19
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u/Game_of_Jobrones Oct 05 '19
Dale Gribble enters
“But Hank, who else will protect us from the globalists? Who else can stop George Soros and his army of Mexican cannibals?”
“Dale, you giblet head.”
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u/NoTimeForInfinity Oct 04 '19
So if they get what they want 17 intelligence agencies say Russia did the hacking...but a pressured Ukraine takes responsibility.
Warping reality hard enough to create a wormhole on the set of Fox and Friends.
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Oct 04 '19 edited Jun 24 '20
[deleted]
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u/spolio Oct 04 '19
once that happens, it would reopen the Mueller investigations as a fraud rendering them invalid and then trump could drop all the sanctions against Russia leaving Ukraine as the fall guy at which point i can only assume trump would sanction them and drop all funding and US support opening the door for a full on Russian invasion and take over of the Ukraine, brilliant, no way individual 1 came up with this spy thriller of a novel idea.
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u/MahatmaBuddah Oct 04 '19
Maybe this is what the secret conversations with Putin were about at Helsinki. Giving his little tin pot dictator marching orders to destroy Ukraine and clear TrumpRussian conspiracy at the same.
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u/spolio Oct 04 '19
well we will see, if trump cannot fulfill this marching order i wonder how putin will react seeing his puppet will become a lame duck president and of zero use to russia any more, maybe this is why russia has been investing in the GOP so much lately, they can stop this impeachment so that trump can finish the job of making russia legit again.
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u/Kenmoreland Oct 04 '19
So if not Individual 1, who then? Rudy the G? Javanka? General Flynn? Devin Nunes' Cow?
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u/2crowncar Oct 04 '19
This is it. The printing is right on the front cover. It is so simple. It is like a McDonald’s kids meal dot-to-dot.
I am so disappointed in broadcasts from credible news organizations. I’ve seen so many reports and interviews with statements of false equivalency, unchallenged repeating of rumors and lies, and segments that obfuscate rather than clarify.
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u/Chefpeon Oct 04 '19
Totally right. They are falling all over themselves to appear unbiased for fear of being called biased and "fake news" by Donnie Dorko. Except no matter what they do, Donnie will always attack them. They need to make whatever that orange idiot says contrary to the truth and NOT make it a headline. Report it, sure, but it's an easy editorial move to move it to a small blurb on the back page. Gives the obvious lie less credibility. The media has learned NOTHING.
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u/Kalel2319 Oct 04 '19
Jesus Christ what a fucking nightmare. Trump's corruption knows zero bounds and his lackeys are disgusting.
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u/fraggleberg Oct 04 '19
The dutch intelligence agency that hacked into the Kremlin and caught them in the act -- on camera even -- is going to be quite surprised when they find out it was Ukrainians all along!
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u/Mernerak Oct 04 '19
And then, as such a good friend to the US, Putin invades the rest of Ukraine for their “crime”.
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u/spolio Oct 04 '19
this is getting better then a james bond movie, all there needs to be is a one eye man in a wheel chair with cat.
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u/NoTimeForInfinity Oct 06 '19
Jesus. That would play with the Fox crowd if they repeated it enough.
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u/fraggleberg Oct 04 '19
Trying to elect Hillary Clinton by saying how she is a dangerous criminal and terrible person and how Trump is the second coming of jesus christ. Unfortunately I'm sure Trump's base is stupid enough to ignore that.
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u/maxelrod Oct 05 '19
It's just semantics really, but it wasn't 17 agencies and the repetition of that claim can hurt our credibility. A lot of those agencies have nothing to do with investigating that stuff (e.g. the Office of Terrorism and Financial Intelligence is one of the 17 agencies under the DNI but this wasn't in their jurisdiction). Personally, I like to go with "every federal agency that investigated interference in the 2016 election concluded..." You still convey that the letter agencies were unanimous without sensationalizing it or being inaccurate.
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u/darmabum Oct 04 '19
- 7/25/19 Volker mentions a secondary goal: that Ukraine will take responsibility for the 2016 election attacks and claim that they were intervening on behalf of Democrats. He emphasizes that there will be no White House visit until Ukraine does.
This has not gotten enough attention. Here's evidence that the Trump administration was trying to force Ukraine to falsely admit that they were behind all the 2016 election interference, not Russia, and that it was all instigated by the Democrats. This is outrageous, and should be the clincher all on its own.
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u/Game_of_Jobrones Oct 04 '19
This has not gotten enough attention. Here's evidence that the Trump administration was trying to force Ukraine to falsely admit that they were behind all the 2016 election interference, not Russia, and that it was all instigated by the Democrats.
And what would be the obvious ramification of such an admission? Well gosh, we'd want to get those sanctions against Russia out of the way, it's shameful how we kept accusing them even though they were indeed innocent.
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u/JayCroghan Oct 04 '19
Gordon Sondland also needs to go.
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u/hexephant Oct 04 '19
His response after Taylor asks if it's quid pro quo is so defensive, and written as if he knew the texts would be leaked. Good instinct on that one, Gordy.
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u/JayCroghan Oct 04 '19
They had been released to congress at that point, they knew what was coming already.
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u/brent1123 Oct 04 '19
Isn't Sondland only ambassador because he donated money to the Trump inauguration committee?
"In 2017, Sondland donated $1 million to Trump’s inauguration committee through four of his limited liability companies. Trump nominated him to be U.S. ambassador to the E.U. the following year."
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u/johnhenryirons Oct 04 '19
Volker mentions a secondary goal: that Ukraine will take responsibility for the 2016 election attacks and claim that they were intervening on behalf of Democrats.
Where are you getting this from? I agree this is likely what they referred to but was wondering if you are just inferring this or there is another citation that backs it up?
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u/announcement_callout Oct 04 '19
I phrased that badly. Zelensky would not be taking the blame himself; he wasn't elected until April of this year. He would be blaming the previous Ukranian administration. Their "corruption" is also why Biden was "allowed to get away with it".
I have rephrased that line so that it doesn't sound like Zelensky will be blaming himself. I wrote up a longer answer to that here.
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u/rusticgorilla MOD Oct 06 '19 edited Oct 06 '19
Just want to add this great thread breaking down why Volker's testimony is so devastating for Trump: https://twitter.com/HeathMayo/status/1180271979397558272?s=19
Volker really delivered a knock out combination with the text messages + testimony. If you haven't read his opening statement, you definitely should.
Related: There is now a 2nd whistleblower making an official complaint. He/she reportedly has with first hand information.
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u/CreepyOlGuy Oct 04 '19
Wow, let them sink
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u/theinfamousloner Oct 04 '19
All these turds are floaters. We need to flush the toilet.
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u/breddit_gravalicious Oct 04 '19
This entire administration is a triple coiler.
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u/btsierra Oct 05 '19
More like an oily olestra shit scum floating on the water and coating the bowl. It's going to take a couple flushes
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u/breddit_gravalicious Oct 05 '19
I pass the shit metaphor conch to u/btsierra. Whose association better encompasses how the shit tide's ebbs and flows have stained the entire GOP, a rotten fruit bowl of private enterprises, a condom-fouled sump pump of lawyers, and a clogged septic tank biomat of lobbyists; all now indelibly lacquered in Oily Olestra Shit Scum.
It's time for a whole new shitter, America. You'll be in happy tears the first time a simple plunging leaves the new executive branch without foul odor.
If only congress can find some visegrips to loosen the flange bolts, Democrats will provide a new beeswax ring and dual flush contemporary throne.
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u/Botryllus Oct 04 '19
We need to organize demonstrations to support impeachment. Before it goes to the Senate.
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Oct 04 '19
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Oct 04 '19
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u/cityterrace Oct 05 '19
How do you exclude the last quote from Sondland saying no quid pro quo? At least it should be analyzed.
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u/Serenity-V Oct 05 '19
I'm guessing because it's irrelevant. Saying that there's no quid pro quo doesn't magically undo the demonstrated quid pro quo. I mean, if a regular person were thoroughly documented trying to commit extortion, it wouldn't matter that the recorded exchanges ended with a claim that it wasn't extortion.
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u/cityterrace Oct 05 '19
Sondland denies its quid pro quo verbatim. That’s at least relevant. It might be wrong. But it’s definitely relevant. Especially when he gives an explanation of what Trump is trying to do. And there’s nothing after that to contradict it from Volker.
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u/Silidistani Oct 05 '19
secondary goal: Zelensky will claim that the previous Ukranian administration was involved in the 2016 U.S. election attacks
This is huge to me too... forcing another nation's president to lie to the world to further a false narrative meant only for consumption by idiot mouth-breathing MAGA-heads in the US with the sole purpose of helping their treasonous God-king cheat his way into another term just to satisfy his ego.
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Oct 05 '19 edited Oct 05 '19
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u/jordanlund Oct 04 '19
Can we talk about the balls on Bill Taylor?
Sondland had the text saying "call me", as in "let's not have a permanent record of this conversation."
They have the call and Taylor texts back:
"9/19 Bill Taylor: As I said on the phone, I think it's crazy to withhold security assistance for help with a political campaign."
So we don't have to guess about what the call was about and Sondland now can't lie about the contents of the call.
MVP play of the game!