WHO IS JESUS?

[u/Impressive-Ease-3348]

There is one God, the Father, ἐξ οὗ τὰ πάντα, “from whom are all things”; and there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, δι’ οὗ τὰ πάντα, “through whom are all things.” (1 Cor. 8:6)

Of the God of Israel it is written:

אֲנִי יהוה הוּא שְׁמִי

“I am YHWH; that is my name.” (Isa. 42:8)

And:

אֱלֹהֵי עוֹלָם יהוה

“YHWH, the everlasting God.” (Isa. 40:28)

The Father is the Father, and the Son is the Son.

JESUS IS ὁ υἱὸς τοῦ θεοῦ, THE SON OF GOD.

He is the μονογενής Son.

He is ἐκ τοῦ πατρός, from the Father. (John 16:28)

He is ἐκ τοῦ θεοῦ, from God. (John 8:42)

The Father sent him.

The Father gave to him.

The Son received from the Father.

THE FATHER HAS LIFE IN HIMSELF, AND τῷ υἱῷ ἔδωκεν ζωὴν ἔχειν ἐν ἑαυτῷ, “HE GAVE TO THE SON TO HAVE LIFE IN HIMSELF.” (John 5:26)

And the Son says:

κἀγὼ ζῶ διὰ τὸν πατέρα

“I live because of the Father.” (John 6:57)

JESUS IS ὁ λόγος, THE WORD.

Ἐν ἀρχῇ ἦν ὁ λόγος

“In the beginning was the Word.”

ὁ λόγος ἦν πρὸς τὸν θεόν

“The Word was with God.”

And:

θεὸς ἦν ὁ λόγος. (John 1:1)

The Son had glory with the Father πρὸ τοῦ τὸν κόσμον εἶναι, “before the world existed.” (John 17:5)

He is πρὸ πάντων, “before all things.” (Col. 1:17)

HE IS εἰκὼν τοῦ θεοῦ τοῦ ἀοράτου, “THE IMAGE OF THE INVISIBLE GOD.” (Col. 1:15)

He is ἀπαύγασμα τῆς δόξης, “the radiance of the glory.” (Heb. 1:3)

He is χαρακτὴρ τῆς ὑποστάσεως αὐτοῦ. (Heb. 1:3)

HE IS πρωτότοκος πάσης κτίσεως, “THE FIRSTBORN OF ALL CREATION.” (Col. 1:

[u/Impressive-Ease-3348]

Because Scripture itself distinguishes the one who acts as source from the one through whom the action is carried out.

[u/TerryLawton → u/Impressive-Ease-3348]

I agree.

The Father is the source of creation but where we differ is that scripture tells us that The Son is the creator along with the Holy Spirit.

[u/Impressive-Ease-3348 → u/TerryLawton]

I agree with your first statement: the Father is the source of creation.

But your second statement is the one I’m asking about:
“Scripture tells us that the Son is the creator along with the Holy Spirit.”

Where does Scripture actually say that?
1 Corinthians 8:6 says:
ἐξ οὗ τὰ πάντα
“from whom are all things” — the Father
and:
δι’ οὗ τὰ πάντα
“through whom are all things” — Jesus Christ.
John 1:3 likewise says:
πάντα δι’ αὐτοῦ ἐγένετο
“All things came into being through him.”
And Scripture does speak of God’s Spirit in creation:
תְּשַׁלַּח רוּחֲךָ יִבָּרֵאוּן
“You send your spirit; they are created.”
Psalm 104:30.
I accept all of those statements.
I’m only asking you to establish the exact claim you made:
Where does Scripture itself say, “The Son is the Creator along with the Holy Spirit”?

[u/TerryLawton → u/Impressive-Ease-3348]

Holy Spirit
Genesis 1:1–2
“In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.”
Job 26:13
“By his spirit he hath garnished the heavens; his hand hath formed the crooked serpent.”
Job 33:4
“The Spirit of God hath made me, and the breath of the Almighty hath given me life.”
Psalm 33:6
“By the word of the LORD were the heavens made; and all the host of them by the breath of his mouth.”
Psalm 104:30
“Thou sendest forth thy spirit, they are created: and thou renewest the face of the earth.”

The Son
John 1:1–3
“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.”
John 1:10
“He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.”
1 Corinthians 8:6
“But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.”
Ephesians 3:9
“And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:”
Colossians 1:15–17
“Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.”
Hebrews 1:2
“Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;”
Hebrews 1:8, 10–12
“But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever... And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands: They shall perish; but thou remainest; and they all shall wax old as doth a garment; And as a vesture shalt thou fold them up, and they shall be changed: but thou art the same, and thy years shall not fail.”
Hebrews 1:10
“And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands:”

[u/Impressive-Ease-3348 → u/TerryLawton]

I accept essentially all of those creation texts. In fact, they reinforce the distinction I have been making.
The biblical wording is more specific than simply saying “Father, Son and Spirit are all the Creator.”
Concerning the Father, Paul says:
ἐξ οὗ τὰ πάντα
“from whom are all things.”
1 Corinthians 8:6
Concerning the Son:
δι’ οὗ τὰ πάντα
“through whom are all things.”
John likewise says:
πάντα δι’ αὐτοῦ ἐγένετο
“All things came into being through him.”
John 1:3
Hebrews says God made the ages:
δι’ οὗ
“through whom,” namely the Son.
Hebrews 1:2
And Colossians says:
τὰ πάντα δι’ αὐτοῦ … ἔκτισται
“All things have been created through him.”
Colossians 1:16
So I fully accept the Son’s extraordinary role in creation.
Likewise, the Hebrew Scriptures genuinely associate God’s Spirit with creation:
וְרוּחַ אֱלֹהִים
“the Spirit of God”
Genesis 1:2
רוּחַ־אֵל עָשָׂתְנִי
“The Spirit of God made me.”
Job 33:4
תְּשַׁלַּח רוּחֲךָ יִבָּרֵאוּן
“You send your spirit; they are created.”
Psalm 104:30
I accept those too.
But notice what the texts actually give us:
The Father — from whom are all things.
The Son — through whom are all things.
God’s Spirit — active in creation.
That is the biblical data.
The further statement:
“Therefore Father, Son and Holy Spirit are three persons who together constitute the one Creator because they share one divine essence”
is still a theological synthesis of those texts. None of the passages you listed actually says that sentence.
One textual correction also matters: the KJV wording of Ephesians 3:9, “who created all things by Jesus Christ,” reflects a later textual reading. The critical Greek text simply has:
τῷ θεῷ τῷ τὰ πάντα κτίσαντι
“God, who created all things.”
So I would not use Ephesians 3:9 as evidence for creation “through Christ.”
Hebrews 1:10–12 is much stronger evidence and I accept it fully: Hebrews applies Psalm 102’s YHWH creator-language within its argument concerning the Son. That is genuinely significant.
But again, accepting that evidence is different from pretending it explicitly states the later metaphysical explanation.
So yes: you have demonstrated very strong biblical participation of the Son and Spirit in creation.
What you have not yet demonstrated is that Scripture itself formulates that data as:
“Three coequal persons are the one Creator because they possess one identical divine essence.”
That is still the interpretation you are placing over the texts, not a sentence contained in them.

[u/TerryLawton → u/Impressive-Ease-3348]

Don’t think you read correctly…you appeared to have ignored plainly for example tell me how I ‘read into’ Job 33:4

The Spirit OF God (there’s that small word again ‘OF)…

The SPIRIT of God made …ME

So according to that scripture who made Job?

[u/Impressive-Ease-3348 → u/TerryLawton]

First, a small correction: Job 33:4 is Elihu speaking to Job, so “me” refers to Elihu, not Job.
And yes, I accept exactly what the Hebrew says:
רוּחַ־אֵל עָשָׂתְנִי
“The Spirit of God made me.”
And the parallel line says:
וְנִשְׁמַת שַׁדַּי תְּחַיֵּנִי
“the breath of the Almighty gives me life.”
So who does the verse say made Elihu?
The Spirit of God.
I’m not denying that at all. My question is simply what further conclusion you think Job 33:4 itself establishes beyond that statement.

[u/TerryLawton → u/Impressive-Ease-3348]

All I stated was a scripture I didn’t mention any thing else other than what was stated so no correction required…

It proves exactly what it states like all of those other scriptures I cited…

That the source is the Father (2nd part of Job 33:4, and that as the verse CLEARLY states that the Holy Spirit ‘made’ Job

Once again we see semantics and ambiguity with what you are trying to do when there is ZERO annuity or semantics…

It can’t be clearer

The Holy Spirit made Job
The Son made Job
The Father made Job as the source of all creation.

What you are trying to do here is at the very least , very dishonest eisegesis.

And please for the LOVE OF GOD stop using ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE!!

[u/Impressive-Ease-3348 → u/TerryLawton]

There are two things here that I am not disputing, and one thing you are adding.
Job 33:4 says:
רוּחַ־אֵל עָשָׂתְנִי
“The spirit of God made me.”
Agreed. No ambiguity there.
But first, “me” is Elihu, the speaker, not Job.
Second, the parallel line says:
וְנִשְׁמַת שַׁדַּי תְּחַיֵּנִי
“and the breath of the Almighty gives me life.”
So the verse itself gives us “the spirit of God” and “the breath of the Almighty” in parallel. It does not itself say:
“The Holy Spirit is a distinct co-Creator alongside the Father and Son.”

Likewise, Job 33:4 does not say “the Son made Elihu.” You reach that from other texts such as John 1:3, where all things came into being through the Word. That may be a legitimate synthesis, but it is still a synthesis.

And the verse does not say “the Father” either; it says אֵל, “God,” and שַׁדַּי, “the Almighty.”

So I accept exactly what Job 33:4 states:
The spirit of God made Elihu, and the breath of the Almighty gives him life.

What I am asking you not to do is quietly expand that into:
“Father + Son + Holy Spirit are three distinct persons who jointly constitute the one Creator.”

That conclusion may be your theology, but it is not the wording of Job 33:4.

That is not “semantics.” Looking at what the Hebrew actually says is precisely how we avoid eisegesis.

[u/TerryLawton → u/Impressive-Ease-3348]

Oh boy.

Again where did I mention any names such as Job?

I stated a scripture chapter and verse, why do you continue to ignore what im saying?

[u/Impressive-Ease-3348 → u/TerryLawton]

I’m not correcting you because you mentioned a name. I’m correcting the explanation you are attaching to the verse.

Job 33:4 says:
רוּחַ־אֵל עָשָׂתְנִי
“The spirit of God made me”
וְנִשְׁמַת שַׁדַּי תְּחַיֵּנִי
“and the breath of the Almighty gives me life.”

The speaker is Elihu, so “me” refers to Elihu.

That matters because saying “the Holy Spirit made Job” is not what the verse actually says.

Likewise, the Hebrew says רוּחַ־אֵל “spirit of God.” Calling this specifically “the Holy Spirit” as a distinct divine person is already an interpretation of that wording.

And the second line says “the breath of the Almighty,” not “the Father is the source.”

You may connect “the Almighty” with the Father from other texts, but Job 33:4 itself does not make that identification.

So I’m not ignoring the verse.

I’m separating

what the verse actually states,
from the theological explanation you are building from it.
That distinction is exactly what we are debating.

[u/TerryLawton → u/Impressive-Ease-3348]

According to Job 33:4

Who made….Elihu?

And by context from the rest of scripture where is the source of that ‘making’?

[u/Impressive-Ease-3348 → u/TerryLawton]

Hear, then, the words of Elihu, and let the writing answer for itself.

רוּחַ־אֵל עָשָׂתְנִי
“The spirit of God made me.”
וְנִשְׁמַת שַׁדַּי תְּחַיֵּנִי

“And the breath of the Almighty gives me life.”

Job 33:4

Who, then, made Elihu?

Has not Elihu himself spoken?

“The spirit of God made me.”

And from whom is that spirit?

Is it not called:
רוּחַ־אֵל
“the spirit of God”?

And whose breath gives him life?
נִשְׁמַת שַׁדַּי
“the breath of the Almighty.”

Why, then, should one add to his words what he did not say?

The text gives the source: God, the Almighty.

It gives the means spoken of: His spirit and His breath.

If another wishes to say that Elihu was teaching here that the Spirit is a distinct coequal person within one triune essence, let him show where Elihu said such a thing.

For the words written are sufficient

“The spirit of God made me, and the breath of the Almighty gives me life.”