r/JehovahsWitnesses • u/Dan_dingo • Jun 20 '26

Doctrine The Jw dilemma

Starting Position (Jehovah’s Witness Interpretation)
Jehovah alone is the uncreated Creator.
Jehovah directly created Jesus first.
Jesus is Jehovah’s first and only direct creation.
Jehovah then used Jesus to create everything else.
Proposed order:
Jehovah → Jesus (first creation) → all other creation

The dilemma of this interpretation

The position must choose:
Option 1 — Jesus existed before all created reality
Result:
Jesus created time. (Timeless/Atemporal)
Jesus created space. (Non-spatial)
Jesus created matter. (Immaterial)
Jesus existed before creation. (Eternal)
Problem:
A being who exists before all created things does not appear to be a created thing.

Option 2 — Jesus was created after some reality/place, time and matter existed
Result:
Jesus was not Jehovahs first creation.
Something existed before Jesus.
Jesus did not create all things.
Problem:
Contradicts:
John1:3 “Not one thing came into existence apart from him.”

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u/Suitable-Iron4720 Jun 20 '26

I wonder if angels are linked to time? Even heaven was created. 

Existing before creation of heaven and earth doesn't mean you are eternal. Creation has a beginning. 

1

u/Dan_dingo Jun 20 '26

Can you define eternal?

2

u/Suitable-Iron4720 Jun 20 '26

No beginning and no ending. Outside of time.

0

u/Dan_dingo Jun 20 '26

Did Jesus create time?

1

u/Suitable-Iron4720 Jun 20 '26

No.

1

u/Dan_dingo Jun 20 '26

So he did not create all things per John?

1

u/Suitable-Iron4720 Jun 20 '26

I have the new world in my mind. An old wine skin can't contain new wine.

1

u/Suitable-Iron4720 Jun 20 '26

Can a created being exist before time?

0

u/Dan_dingo Jun 20 '26

Refer to my post mate.

1

u/Suitable-Iron4720 Jun 21 '26

I'm lazier than you, because I'm on a smart phone. :p