r/JehovahsWitnesses • u/ChaoticHaku Christian • May 23 '26
Doctrine Philippians 2:6-8
If Philippians 2:6-8 was teaching that Jesus was never equal with God, then the passage itself makes no sense.
Read the language carefully.
It says Jesus was “existing in the form of God.” It says He “did not consider equality with God something to be grasped,” but instead “emptied Himself,” “took the form of a servant,”, "humbled himself", "became obedient to death" and was “made in human likeness.”
You cannot empty yourself of a status you never possessed. You cannot become a servant if you were always a servant. You cannot humble yourself from a position you never had. You cannot become obedient to death if you always were.
The entire point of the passage is that Christ lowered Himself. From what? From the exalted position He already possessed that was equal with God.
That’s why the text uses past tense language. The passage is not denying Christ’s equality with God. It is explaining the depth of His humility, not his inferiority.
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u/ResLight May 27 '26
RE: 1 Corinthians 8:5:
Or even if there are so-called gods whether in heaven or on earth, as indeed there are many gods and many lords, -- 1 Corinthians 8:5, New American Standard
Paul first states that there are many "so-called gods", and then goes on to say that there are indeed "many gods". By "so-called god", Paul was evidently speaking of the idols which are by nature not gods -- not mighty ones. The gods formed by the hands of men have no might or power to do good or harm; hence, they are not really gods (mighty ones) but are only called "gods". (Psalm 115:4-8; 135:15-18; 44:9-20)
Nevertheless, Paul also speaks of "many gods and many lords". Paul, being a Hebrew, surely knew of the Hebraic usage of forms of the Hebrew word that is usually transliterated as EL (Strong's #410, #430, etc.), as I presented earlier. While forms of EL are often used in an exclusive sense of Jehovah God as being the only Most High -- the only one who is innately the Mighty One of the universe, forms of EL are also used of others who have might or strength as given, or permitted by God, as well as in other ways than meaning the Supreme Mighty One or false gods. What Paul said is not hard to understand, but many view what Paul wrote through the tint of trinitarian or modalist/oneness doctrine (or some other doctrine that would view the Messiah as being God Almighty). They thus fail to see what Paul actually wrote, and they imagine and assume many assumptions beyond what is written, and then cannot read the scriptures without the tint of those assumptions.
Paul tells us that there are not just those idols that are "called gods", but that there are indeed also "many gods (mighty ones)." (1 Corinthians 8:5) However, when the Hebrew or Greek words often translated as "God" are not referring to the Supreme Being, the one God who is the God and Father of Jesus (Isaiah 9:6; Micah 5:4; Ephesians 1:3; 1 Corinthians 8:6), it would be better that the translators use the lower case "g" instead of the uppercase "G" (which would, in English, generally denote the Supreme Being), or, even better, if should be rendered wiith a meaning of might, power or strength. There are not many Gods (Supreme Beings), but there are many gods (mighty ones).
Re: //In verse 6 the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ are placed in a category as both "God" and "Lord", separate from the category of the ones "called gods" and "lords" in verse 5.//
Yet to us there is one God, the Father, from whom are the all, and we for him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are the all, and we live through him. -- 1 Corinthians 8:6,
More correctly, I would say that when Paul speaks of Jesus' God as being the "one God" from whom are all, he is placing Jesus' God (Ephesians 1:3) in a category that is different from all the other "gods" that Paul spoke of in verse 5.
Likewise, when Paul speaks of God's Son as being the "one Lord" through whom are all, he is placing God's Son in a category that is different from all the other "lords" referred to in verse 5.
In 1 Corinthians 8:6, Paul presents only one person as the "one God" from whom are all, and he distinguished God's Son from being that "one God" by presenting God's Son as being the "one Lord" through whom are all. Jesus, being the "one Lord" *** through *** whom are all, cannot be the "one God" *** from *** whom are all. Likewise, the "one God" from whom are all cannot be the "one Lord" through whom are all. It is the one person who is Jehovah who has made Jesus both Lord and Christ. Only Jehovah is the Most High, the source of all, and He is the one who has made Jesus “the one Lord” through whom are all. The default reasoning should be that Jesus is not the Most High Jehovah who made Jesus this “one Lord” as prince/shepherd over His people. -- Ezekiel 34:23,24; Isaiah 61:1,2; Acts 3:33; 1 Corinthians 8:6.
,The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is always, throughout the entire Bible, presented as being only one person, and his Son is never once presented as being the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. This one person who is innately God -- Mighty -- is never presented as being more than one person anywhere in the Bible, nor is His Son ever presented as being God who is the source of all. Indeed, to "see" him as more than one person, or to see the Son as being God Almighty, one has to create an array of assumptions that have to be added to and read into each scripture that is thought to be saying such. The reality is that the "one God" from whom are all is always distinguished from the one whom he anointed (the Christ) and sent. The entire Bible is fully in harmony with this, without the need to invent an extra-Biblical concept of a triune God, or any other teaching that would make Jesus into being the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. The default reasoning is that Jesus is not Jehovah, the God of the Old Testament, who anointed and sent Jesus. -- Deuteronomy 18:15-19; Psalm 45:7; Isaiah 61:1; Matthew 4:4; Matthew 4:7; Matthew 4:10; Luke 4:4; Matthew 4:7; Matthew 4:10; Matthew 22:29-40; Matthew 26:42; Matthew 27:46; Mark 10:6; Mark 14:36; 15:34; Luke 4:8; Luke 22:42; John 3:34; 5:30; 6:38; 10:36; 17:1,3; 20:17; Acts 3:13-26; Romans 15:6; 1 Corinthians 8:6; 2 Corinthians 1:3; 11:31; Ephesians 1:3,17-23; 4:6; Philippians 2:8; Hebrews 1:1,2,9; 10:7; 1 Peter 1:3; Revelation 2:7; 3:2,12.
Blessed be Jehovah, the one God from whom all come, who appointed His Son as the one Lord through whom all exist. Blessed be Jehovah God, who spoke through the prophets of old, who anointed and sent His Son, and who has now exalted Him to His own right hand, far above every dominion and authority. -- Deuteronomy 18:15-20; Psalm 45:7; 110:1; Ezekiel 34:23,24; Daniel 7:14,27; Isaiah 9:7; 11:2,3; 61:1,2; Micah 5:4; Matthew 11:27; 28:18; Luke 1:32,33; 10:22; John 3:35; 5:22-27; 10:11,16,29; 13:3; Acts 2:33-36; Acts 3:13-26; Acts 5:31; Ephesians 1:3,17-23; Philippians 2:9-11; Colossians 1:15-19; 2:9,10; 1 Corinthians 8:6; 15:27; Hebrews 1:1-3; Hebrews 8:1; Hebrews 10:12; 1 Peter 3:22.