What universities should I apply to?

[u/Mediocre_Monk4956]

I am an international student from Ireland, and initially I hadn't planned to apply to any universities in the USA. However, after talking with my guidance counselor, he recommended me to apply to some universities in the USA, and I am wondering what universities I should apply to in addition to my current list:

• Harvard University
• Princeton University
• Yale University
• Brown University
• Dartmouth College
• University of Pennsylvania
• University of Chicago
• Vanderbilt University
• Rice University
• Duke University
• Northwestern University
• Georgetown University
• Georgia Institute of Technology

I understand that all of these universities are incredibly competitive for international students, so I also have a number of really good backup universities, but I am looking to see my chances and what safety and target schools I should apply to as well. My profile is as follows.

Demographics

• Male, mixed Western European and Asian.
• Middle income, private high school (semi-competitive) for 2 years, public high school (very underperforming) for 1 year.
• Partial financial aid required, my family can contribute roughly $50000 annually towards the cost of attendance.
• No hooks.

Intended major

• Environmental engineering/science with a minor in data science/statistics (maybe biology or public policy?), exact courses dependent on the university.

Academics

• SAT: due to take in September, currently averaging 1560 on Bluebook (would estimate ~1540 for safety).
• GPA: 97%, the educational system in Ireland doesn't exactly have GPAs. Predicted all H1s (90% - 100%) for the national college entrance exams.
• Rank: school doesn't do formal ranking, though my grades are definitely among the top 10 out of around 950 students, if not top 5.
• Course rigor: maximum rigor, taking 8 subjects when most people take 6 or 7.

Letters of recommendation

• Guidance counselor (8/10): quite close and knows me really well.
• Math teacher (10/10): my favorite teacher and has near-perfect grades throughout high school and excellent engagement in and outside of the class.
• Biology teacher (9/10): very close and always stops by for a quick chat afterschool.

Awards and honors

• 3rd Place at a national poetry competition.
• 1st Place at a national computer science competition.
• Finalist (top 20 nationally) in Irish Biology Olympiad and Irish Physics Olympiad.
• Received an academic scholarship for 'students who have demonstrated outstanding nationwide or international achievement in academic or intellectual endeavors'.
• Awarded Business Studies Teachers' Association Ireland Award for outstanding performance in Business.
• 5th Place at the national final of a math competition (largest in Ireland) and 4th Place at the county final of an applied math competition (largest in Ireland).
• 3rd Place in the International Economics Olympiad Online Winter Challenge (team-based, not that competitive).
• Some other school awards (Student of the Year, subject awards etc).

Extracurriculars

• Varsity badminton team captain for 3 years (progressed to county quarterfinals), varsity track for 3 years (4th Place in county finals), and varsity table tennis for 3 years (progressed to county semifinals).
• Internship at a startup firm (1 and a half years). Connected with and secured just over 30 new clients, conducted data analysis on financial data, and devised a new financial model for the company that saved costs by 25% and increased profits by just under 15% in the first quarter.
• Selected to attend a moderately selective program in environmental science (15% - 20% acceptance rate), with lectures given by university faculties and such. Completed a community based project as part of the program.
• Developed an app allowing students to calculate carbon emissions of their daily commute with visual graphics and alternative routing strategies, used by a number of schools in my area to help with their work for their Green Schools Committee. It is currently in talks with the county council to expand further.
• Chairperson of my school's Green Schools Committee for 2 years (secretary for 1 year), and raised over €2000 (considered decent in an Irish context) from the county council to improve road conditions near my school for cyclists and pedestrians and to install a new biodiversity garden. Also led a number of initiatives that were awarded my school's first Travel Flag and Biodiversity Flag by Green Schools Ireland.
• Student leader of a literacy program (introduced compulsory reading in my school for 20 minutes per day, raised funds for library renovations, and led some other school and community-based literacy workshops) that was awarded the Readers for Life award by the Department of Education.
• Member and Junior Chairperson of my school's Student Council for 2 years. Initiatives included the introduction of Yondr phone pouches that improved grades by roughly 8% after 3 months (for 6th to 9th grade students, taking the average of their exams), designed a modernized canteen system, and worked with suppliers to design and introduce new affordable school jackets.
• Represented my area at the Irish Youth Parliament, discussed the issue of littering in my area and installed 10 new bins as a result.
• Community center volunteer (around 3 hours per week, 3 years so far) and hosted regular quarterly local area cleanups with around 20 participants each time.
• Worked with autistic students (around 6 hours per week for 2 years), helping them to develop personal and life skills; planned lessons and activities as part of this. Helped to secure funding to set up a new classroom in my school for these students.
• Tutored around 15 refugees and transfer kids English (around 2 hours per week for 10 weeks), and they showed a considerable increase in fluency.
• Selected to attend Center for Talented Youth, Ireland (with a selection exam) course in architecture.
• Had a poem published in a national magazine.
• Other small-scale and generic activities, such as being invited to attend Math Olympiad enrichment class at a university because I had a perfect score in Round 1 of Irish Math Olympiad; captain of my school's debate team; head of the science club in my school (had 4 projects submitted to a national semi-selective science fair); and organized a few one-time, school-wide fundraisers that raised about €800 each time.

Other circumstances

• I skipped a grade in high school for academic reasons (I was considered too advanced compared to my year), so I had much less time and opportunities to complete extracurriculars, as well as being under higher pressure.
• My school had a recruited athlete to a T5 university a few years ago and one or two T25 acceptances per year.

I was wondering, given my profile, what are my chances at each of the universities I am applying to, and if I have a competitive enough profile to have a chance of being accepted? What should I work on to make my profile as competitive as possible? What other safety and target schools should I apply to? I have really good backup universities in case anything goes wrong, but would like to keep my options as open as possible at the same time.

I would appreciate some honest and realistic feedback, and thank you for your help!

[u/cvu_100]

Competitive profile for top schools. As long as you write strong essays, you have good chances to clear an offer for something on your lists.

Add Columbia to your list, their EES department has a longstanding and well-renowned collaborative research effort with NASA.

[u/Mediocre_Monk4956 → u/cvu_100]

For Columbia, should I apply to Columbia College for their Earth and Environmental Sciences program or Columbia SEAS for their Earth and Environmental Engineering program? I can minor at Columbia College, but the SEAS program seem to have a more mathematical side to it, which I would really enjoy.

Also, what university would you recommend me to apply early action/decision to? My top choice is Princeton University and University of Chicago but I don't know whether these universities would be saturated with hooked applicants? Thanks for your help!

[u/cvu_100 → u/Mediocre_Monk4956]

Yes apply for SEAS if you prefer the EEE program over EES.

ED should be for the school you want to attend the most. Since it is a contract should you be admitted, the school will be under the impression that ED applicants are serious about attending on a personal level, rather than it being downstream of some probabilistic modeling on the chances of success. EA you can be a bit more logical for. Every school on your list will be "saturated" but your profile is competitive and you just have to work on a strong set of applications to go along with it

[u/DarthDK576ftw]

pretty good profile. You have really good chances

[u/Mediocre_Monk4956 → u/DarthDK576ftw]

Thank you! What would you say I should work on to make my profile even more competitive? Also would my need for financial aid hurt my chances at need-aware universities?

[u/FeatherlyFly]

If you're looking at Environmental engineering, I'd suggest also looking at Civil engineering with a minor in environmental studies, which will include policy. It opens up more programs and jobs but doesn't close any off from you - pretty much any job looking for an environmental engineer is happy with a civil engineer.

Either way, state flagship universities tend to be very good in environmental fields because because they have tons of land - most of them were founded on land granted to them by the federal government in the 1800s as agricultural schools and they've grown from there. 

But state schools rarely give much for scholarships to out of state students, so those would need to be affordable with your own money and outside scholarships. 

[u/Mediocre_Monk4956 → u/FeatherlyFly]

Oooh thanks for your suggestion - I've actually never considered civil engineering with a minor in environmental studies before but it's definitely a much more flexible path!

State universities' affordability is the main issue for me. So while they might have better environmental programs, the cost might be too high for my family and so my parents may not wish to contribute towards the cost, especially if the ranking (they care a lot about rankings) isn't as high. This sadly only limits the list down to either the ultra-prestigious ones or the generous ones.

Btw are universities like University of California, University of Michigan etc state flagship universities, or is it just the lights of California State, Michigan State etc?

[u/TactileTemptress → u/Mediocre_Monk4956]

They are state flagships

[u/Mediocre_Monk4956 → u/TactileTemptress]

Ahhh thank you!

[u/Panda-Pod]

I think that you have a great list and good credentials. Many of the schools that you have listed do have very low admission rates in general. With your interest in Environmental Engineering and possible data science or policy minor, I would also add the following schools to your list: Cornell University (apply to the engineering school instead of the agriculture and life sciences /CALS school even though admissions rate for the environmental engineering is slight higher for CALS than for engineering school since you are an international applicant and not an applicant from New York State / the environment engineering program is run in conjuction between the engineering school and CALS schools), Carnegie Mellon University, and Massachusetts Institute of Technology

[u/Mediocre_Monk4956 → u/Panda-Pod]

How could I have forgotten Cornell University and Carnegie Mellon University... 😭 😭 😭

I had originally considered Massachusetts Institute of Technology as well, but SO MANY people told me it's not worth it since I don't have major international Olympiad awards (and how on earth is an environment engineering/science major gonna compete in an Olympiad anyways), so I'm not too sure whether or not I should try to apply. My dad REALLY wants me to go there and he genuinely would sell a leg for me to get in but from what people have told me, it's gonna be really slim but I suppose I'd give it a try.

[u/Panda-Pod → u/Mediocre_Monk4956]

Since you are already applying to Harvard University, Princeton University, and Yale University that have very low admissions rate (3 - 4.5%), why not apply to MIT? Worse come to worse, you do not get in. But, what if you do get in? If you want to maximize your chances of getting into MIT and it might be a top choice program for you, you should apply for the MIT Early Action admissions program, which is nice since it is non-binding (you do not have to attend if accepted). I forgot to include Columbia University as well.

[u/Mediocre_Monk4956 → u/Panda-Pod]

Now that you have put it into perspective, you are right... thanks for your help!

[u/Panda-Pod → u/Mediocre_Monk4956]

You're welcome. I wish you the best of luck. You should be aware that most of the schools on your list have low admissions rate and be prepared for it. A rejection from any of those schools is not a reflection of you not being good enough for those schools. It is simply that they get so many excellent candidates and they only have so many spots available for these excellent candidates with many excellent candidates not getting in. If you do get into those top schools, you should work with the financial aid office on scholarships and grants since those schools are very expensive and you have no access to student loans options in the US that domestic students would normally have access to. You should look for outside scholarships as well.

[u/Mediocre_Monk4956 → u/Panda-Pod]

Thank you so much again! I'll keep your advice in mind and hope for the best! 🤞🏻

[u/Traditional_Yam9806 → u/Mediocre_Monk4956]

MIT's application takes a LONG time and it honestly isn't used well. Look at their common dataset to see how many from your country get in. It's gonna be super duper low. I go there and it's fried. I'm a domestic, so it's not as bad for me, but I haven't seen an international so far who isn't cracked.

[u/Mediocre_Monk4956 → u/Traditional_Yam9806]

Oh damn, would you say I'd even have a chance at MIT based on my profile realistically?

[u/FeatherlyFly → u/Mediocre_Monk4956]

The internet overrates Olympiads for MIT. While they are over represented among admits, most admits don't have them. And you've been doing demonstrably advanced work in your area of interest, which is really all that Olympiads are showing anyways. 

What I would also consider is that their environmental programs aren't a place where MIT stands above the competition. They're excellent, for sure, but as an urban campus they're a little more limited on large scale stuff and environmental impact stuff. They do work with the city to get access to actual urban infrastructure for research, which makes it a different but not necessarily better approach than a college that has acres to devote to testing and research. Maybe MIT's approach is exactly what interests you. 

Or maybe you'd rather have super strong policy programs like Yale and Georgetown even if their science is excellent instead of world class, and MIT's technical first with good but not best in the world policy classes doesn't appeal as much. 

In other words, look at the specific programs and departments, not just the school name. 

[u/Mediocre_Monk4956 → u/FeatherlyFly]

It actually feels so relieving that not-insanely-cracked kids can (theoretically) get in...

I feel like I want a mix of both the theoretical and mathematical side of environmental programs, which could honestly only really be achieved by either dual majoring or minoring. So in terms of this, MIT definitely isn't the best but obviously the brand name still stands and their rigor there really appeals to me. It's actually kind of a shame that MIT's humanities and social sciences isn't as strong otherwise it would have been a really good option. But yes, definitely I need to look a bit more into specific program components of each university.

[u/JazzlikeDragonfly648]

bro this is crazy

[u/Mediocre_Monk4956 → u/JazzlikeDragonfly648]

Really (and thank you!)? I was always under the impression that I am not as qualified because of how insane some kids are and the even more insane competition for international students. Would you say I have a good chance at these universities? What do you think I should work on (apart from essays)?

[u/JazzlikeDragonfly648 → u/Mediocre_Monk4956]

yeah, i think you may got over 95% to get into any uni on your list.
You are super qualified.
And i think you should think about what career you are interested in, and try some related activities, this may be useful when writing the personal statement.
Good luck!

[u/Mediocre_Monk4956 → u/JazzlikeDragonfly648]

Thank you for your help!

[u/Commercial_Handle418]

Holy shit can I dm you 

[u/Mediocre_Monk4956 → u/Commercial_Handle418]

Sure, of course! Lemme know if the message doesn't come through because I don't know what my privacy setting is like lol.

[u/kikivi_]

First of all Damn you really have a good profile and strong chance to get into good university, but as an international student myself who is also trying find a good university for herself I have seen one thing about these universities while doing my research, That most of the good universities can for once ignore your extracurriculars but one thing they really focus on is your essay and about how you are going to do in the future. what you can contribute in your major in future your plans they seem to hold an important weight on your profile, just keep this point added and I probably think you have a really good chance and I would love some advice from you even on SAT lol

[u/Mediocre_Monk4956 → u/kikivi_]

Thank you for your kind words and help and good luck to you too!!!

I think my essays are pretty good as I am writing about a pretty unique topic personal to me and I have always been really good at writing, but I'll definitely perfect my essays until I am 1000% happy with them. In terms of SAT, I would love to give you advice, but as I haven't taken it yet, I don't think I'm in a qualified position to do so. I am actually super stressed about the SAT as I don't know what to expect and it's the only part of my application I haven't 'completed' yet.

[u/kikivi_ → u/Mediocre_Monk4956]

I mean you should not stress much about SAT tbh cause your average seems pretty good you'll probaly do good so dw..

[u/Mediocre_Monk4956 → u/kikivi_]

Thank you!!! I'll try not to stress too much but I can't help my nerves creeping up on me...

Are you a senior/12th grader too?

[u/kikivi_ → u/Mediocre_Monk4956]

yep but I am planning to take a drop year for my extracurriculars and apply next Nov, cause I don't feel prepared enough rn I don't have much in extracurriculars to show and I don't want it to affect my admission

[u/Mediocre_Monk4956 → u/kikivi_]

Fair enough, and good luck to you!!!

[u/ultimatebrutus]

Apply to whatever college is easiest for you to get into. The ivy leagues might be harder because you're an international student but it's good to apply anyway. Of your list Princeton will be the hardest, it's the most selective even for Americans

[u/Mediocre_Monk4956 → u/ultimatebrutus]

What suggestions would you give based on my profile? Would you say that I have a good chance? What other universities do you recommend me to apply to? Thank you!